Halifax/fraud/inheritance money/internal investigation!!!

[Hacked_Off]

Sent them this:

 

Dear Madame,

 

I will first of all deal with, and respond to your letter point by point. “ I am unable to stop these payments from being debited from your account. We can cancel the earmarked payments once we receive a fax from the companies in question stating that they no longer have an interest in these.” As previously stated many times to several people within Halifax, you are wrong. I am frankly astounded that not one person within Halifax is familiar with the BCOBS regulations, to which you are subscribed.

 

For the sake of clarity, BCOBS section 5.1.11 states;

 

“(1) 4Where a banking customer denies having authorised a payment, it is for the firm to prove that the payment was authorised.

(2) Where a payment from a banking customer's account was not authorised by the banking customer, a firm must, within a reasonable period, refund the amount of the unauthorised payment to the banking customer and, where applicable, restore the banking customer's account to the state it would have been in had the unauthorised payment not taken place.”

 

Clearly this applies to this situation. Not one person from Halifax has made any attempt to remedy this situation. The general attitude I have been subject to has been 'oh well never mind'.

 

You also claim “Whilst we are unable to stop these transactions debiting your account...you can get in touch with the companies directly”. First of all you CAN stop transactions, second it is not for me to get in touch with a company that has taken money without my authorisation, it is for you to reverse the payment as per the charge back scheme, again to which you are subscribed.

 

You have also stated “please contact our fraud team..” I have done this more than once, they did nothing. They had zero knowledge of the BCOBS regulations and hung up the phone after a twenty minute wait, resulting in me having to start again, at expense to myself.

 

“I hope we have explained why we believe we haven’t made a mistake”. I hope I have explained to YOU why you HAVE made a mistake. Your knowledge of BCOBS I’m afraid is somewhat lacking. This situation could have easily of been remedied, but instead Halifax have chosen to resolve this matter the hard way. My confidence in you to manage my account is now zero. I am appalled at the way I have been treated.

 

“ I am pleased I have been able to resolve your complaint satisfactorily.....” You are making assumptions here. I am not satisfied with this outcome, not even a little bit. Telling me you will be doing nothing is not an outcome, it is a farce.

 

As previously conveyed to you, my complaint is as follows;

 

Three unauthorised transactions debited from my account

Unauthorised transactions left account overdrawn, potentially leaving me with charges, to be clear I will not be paying any charges.

In branch staff in your x branch were incorrect on unauthorised transactions and generally unhelpful.

I have spoken to 8 different people from Halifax, all of which are incorrect in relation to unauthorised transactions.

Your fraud team were contacted, I was left on hold for twenty minutes, they then hung up, resulting in me having to repeat the process at a cost to myself.

Generally poor service from yourselves.

I now have zero confidence in Halifax to manage my account.

 

Given the circumstances, and zero trust I now have in Halifax. I am only prepared to communicate with you in writing as per my rights laid down in article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights. Be advised any further telephone calls from yourselves will be considered harassment as per the Protection from Harassment Act 1997, and reported to the relevant authorities.

 

As a remedy to this situation, I want my account placed back into the situation it would have been in had this not happened, including reversal of any charges, a refund of £13.72 in unnecessary phone calls I had to make to yourselves and an apology for your shocking service.

 

For the avoidance of any doubt, I am fully prepared to take this matter further.

 

I require your final response.

 

Yours disgruntled,

 

A law student

[renegadeimp]

Dear oh dear. The bank is flouting regulation again. There is NO NEED AT ALL for you to contest it with the creditor. You can tell the bank outright you want it cancelled and they have to oblige.

[Hacked_Off]

Yep, I spoke with the FCA to clarify and he said "although we are supposed to be impartial, I can tell you they are entirely wrong" they have also asked for a copy of that letter.

[dx100uk]

thread tidied.

 

dx

[fletch70]

Hacked off

At the risk of starting an argument again can you tell us what your lecturer said with regards to this?

[Hacked_Off]

Basically what we already know-BCOBS

[fletch70]

Not what i really asked as there are several interpretations of that but we can leave it at that

[Klandestine]

In this case it is technically the Payment Services Regulations (PSR) which apply. (The BCOBS handbook itself states that BCOBS 5.1.11 doesn't apply where PSR do).

 

As I have said previously a card payment isn't technically classed as a payment until the money physically leaves your account. (How can it be - none of your money has left your accounts, it's just an authorisation hold reflected only in your available balance).

 

I know it's not what you want to hear, but Halifax weren't wrong in what they told you.

 

Now that the amounts have left the account, they should of course be refunding the payments in question and any associated charges (and in my opinion also a refund of phone calls aswell as a gesture of goodwill).

[renegadeimp]

i guess it comes down to whether the account holder has instructed the bank to cancel any payments. If they have, then yes, the bank is completely out of line. Halifax and lloyds seem to be doing it a lot, then completely ignoring regulation. Sadly, even though the agencies have been on the banks backs over the years, te banks still seem to laugh at the regulators.

[Klandestine]

This is still in line with the law. The PSR allows people to withdraw their consent to a payment but it doesn't put any obligation on the banks to cancel the transaction or put a stop to it (for example with CPAs). Legally, they only have to refund payments once they have taken place which is what should (and hopefully will) happen for Hacked_Off if he/she reports the transactions to Halifax now.

[renegadeimp]

Depends if the account holder notified them before hand. Sure, if its a hold, then it can be reversed after, but if the bank had been told to refuse the transaction, then the bank is legally obliged to comply. it is of no concern what the OP does with their money. The bank are entrusted to hold it and follow the account holders instructions.

[Klandestine]

I am afraid that according to the law that isn't true. The bank only has an obligation to refund payments not authorised by the account holder they do not have to stop the card payments in any case.

 

If you can find me the relevant legal clause then I will gladly agree with you (link to PSR: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2009/209/contents/made).

[renegadeimp]

Wrong wrong wrong. The FCA has clearly stated, and even expanded on it into CPA's with payment regs 2009, that a transaction must be cancelled when the account holder tells them. if the transaction has yet to be sent, then the bank should have no problem unless its an 'in transit' DD or SO. Even then, there are rules that govern those, such as the DD guarantee.

 

It became that much of a hot topic, as i said, the FCA even expanded the regulation to specifically incorporate CPA's. Mainly because banks knew hardly anyone had heard of a CPA, and a hell of a lot of creditors/DCA's etc were abusing the hell out of it.

 

I think its section 55 but dont quote me on that.

 

Also, how do i know that we are right? We have used the argument over and over ad infinitum, have gotten the ombudsman and FCA involved and the cases have ended up with the bank slinking away back into their hole, and offering a 'gesture of goodwill' Some banks even have the cheek to try and make a without prejudice offer.

[silverfox1961]

Christmas Day of all days to be having a tiff.

 

If you are going to disagree, do it politely.

 

We on CAG absolutely agree with free speech BUT not at the expense of good manners.

 

The amount of work involved in moving 'off topic' posts is distracting me from my Bacardi and Coke so if you want to discuss (politely) the issues raised here, take it elsewhere (The Bear Garden)

[renegadeimp]

bacardi and joke? Get some JD down ya.

[silverfox1961]

bacardi and joke? Get some JD down ya.

 

Jack Daniels-Yuck. I am a Brandy/Bacardi/Vodka man (mixed??)

[renegadeimp]

Can always mix JD. Plus there are various brands of JD

 

I cant get into bacardi.

[silverfox1961]

I can't remember which version I tried but the first taste put me off for life.

 

Bacardi is the only spirit I can drink, get drunk, drink myself sober and then get drunk again. (not that I drink that often)

[stu007]

CONTINUOUS PAYMENT AUTHORITY (CPA)

 

After a recent review by the Financial Conduct Authority (FCA) in June 2013 (see Press Release here http://www.fca.org.uk/news/continuous-payment-authorities). The FCA has reminded Banks of their obligations when cancelling Continuous Payment Authority.

 

Previously the Financial Services Authority (FSA) now the (FCA) became responsible for the rules around cancelling CPAs in November 2009 with the introduction of the Payment Services Regulations, under the rules Banks must cancel any CPA so long as properly instructed to do so by the customer.

 

The FCA noted that, particularly in relation to payday loans, some banks and mutuals were not cancelling CPAs when asked to do so. However banks and mutuals must cancel a payment themselves and not require their customer to contact the merchant to cancel the CPA.

 

In addition to securing this commitment, the largest banks and mutuals have agreed to review every individual complaint they have received about the non-cancellation of a CPA and to pay redress where payments have continued to be made despite the customer cancelling the arrangement. This applies to all complaints since November 2009 when the Financial Services Authority (FSA), the FCA’s predecessor, began regulating banking conduct.

 

What is a Continuous Payment Authority?

 

A Continuous Payment Authority (CPA) is a type of regular automatic payment that you can set up using your debit or credit card.

 

The authority is linked to the bank account or credit card account that your card is linked to. This is a popular method of making regular payments that is favoured by many businesses, including gyms, internet service provider, magazine subscriptions, breakdown recovery membership, payday loan repayments.

 

How does a Continuous Payment Authority work?

 

This method of payment is set up by you the consumer giving your debit or credit card details to a company to which you wish to make a regular payment. This can be done over the phone, in person or online. Often there is no written record of the authority being set up.

 

The company itself may be unclear as to the method of payment being initiated – so it is advisable if you are in any way uncertain ask them to clarify whether payment will be taken by direct debit, standing order or Continuous Payment Authority. If possible get them to confirm this in writing.

 

A Continuous Payment Authority gives the company you are paying the mandate to

 

— Take payments on dates of their choosing

— Take payments for different amounts

These authorities don't have the same guarantees that a direct debit has regarding the date or the amount of the payment. It is always advisable to keep a close eye on your bank statement to ensure that all payments match your expectations.

 

How to cancel Continuous Payment Authority?

 

You can cancel a Continuous Payment Authority either by telling the company, or by telling your bank. We would always advise informing both the company and the bank of your wish to cancel CPA.

 

If you tell your bank to stop the payment being taken, it has to do so. However,you should make sure that you inform the company taking the payment, particularly where you have a contract or credit agreement in place. If this is the case, you may still need to make any remaining payments.

Template letters are available from CAGs Library

[Hacked_Off]

Another £70.00 has gone missing.

[Hacked_Off]

It's the same company AGAIN. Halifax are again refusing to refund or put a block on the account..

[fletch70]

Christmas Day of all days to be having a tiff.

 

If you are going to disagree, do it politely.

 

We on CAG absolutely agree with free speech BUT not at the expense of good manners.

 

The amount of work involved in moving 'off topic' posts is distracting me from my Bacardi and Coke so if you want to discuss (politely) the issues raised here, take it elsewhere (The Bear Garden)

 

Always the way , a few too many and we post things we shouldn't

[fletch70]

It's the same company AGAIN. Halifax are again refusing to refund or put a block on the account..

 

If it's going off you debit card i would suggest reporting it as compromised and get a new one. I know not ideal but should stop the aggro

[Hacked_Off]

If it's going off you debit card i would suggest reporting it as compromised and get a new one. I know not ideal but should stop the aggro

 

Tried that, the first woman said "ill just get the form" then hung up. the 2nd woman said "I cant do that". time to switch accounts me thinks.

[renegadeimp]

Change banks, get the regulators onvolved and consider legal action.