Welcome Finance - This company needs to be banned.

[confusedbywcf]

Basically a copy of the agreement u signed with them - do you already have one? even if you have it's worth requesting a copy of theirs as if they don't or can't provide it that means you don't have to pay til they do.

NO I DONT HAVE A COPY JUST MY STATEMENT WHEN I ASKED THE OFFICE MAMAGER FOR A COPY SHE SAID IT WAS ON A DIFFFERENT COMPUTER SYSTEM AND WOULD SEND IT TO ME THIS WAS 3 WEEKS AGO

[andie_303]

ok i'll find you the letter you need to post with a £1 postal order - send it recorded delivery to the head office address they then have 12 days +2 (for postage) to comply - then we can see what it says on there. If it says anything about loan for home imporvements or makes no reference to the car it is no longer secured on it.

 

Also if they fail to provide it you don't have to pay them again til they do and there's not a thing they can do about it.

 

Bear with me finding the letter now

[confusedbywcf]

ok i'll find you the letter you need to post with a £1 postal order - send it recorded delivery to the head office address they then have 12 days +2 (for postage) to comply - then we can see what it says on there. If it says anything about loan for home imporvements or makes no reference to the car it is no longer secured on it.

 

Also if they fail to provide it you don't have to pay them again til they do and there's not a thing they can do about it.

 

Bear with me finding the letter now

 

THANKYOU I APPRECIATE IT

[andie_303]

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Re:− Account/Reference Number 4563210025897412

 

This letter is a formal request pursuant to s.77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to the above account, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide.

 

I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit. You are reminded that should you fail to comply with my request, the provisions of s.77 will apply.

 

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

 

Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b),6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR).

 

I enclose a postal order in the sum of £1.00, which is the statutory fee. Note that these funds are not to be used for any other purpose.

 

If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity, and certainly within the statutory time limit for compliance, and return the fee.

 

We look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully

 

PRINT NAME - Do not sign it!!

[confusedbywcf]

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Re:− Account/Reference Number 4563210025897412

 

This letter is a formal request pursuant to s.77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to the above account, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide.

 

I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit. You are reminded that should you fail to comply with my request, the provisions of s.77 will apply.

 

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

 

Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b),6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR).

 

I enclose a postal order in the sum of £1.00, which is the statutory fee. Note that these funds are not to be used for any other purpose.

 

If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity, and certainly within the statutory time limit for compliance, and return the fee.

 

We look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully

 

PRINT NAME - Do not sign it!!

 

THANKS WILL SEND IT OFF TODAY

[Voda]

Morning Andie,

 

How are you this morning?

 

Well I trust.

 

In advance of my going to the lawyer next week, did you get a reply back from the person that you were going to talk to about my documents?

 

Sorry to be a pain in the butt, but it would be great to have your expert opinion too.

 

When I bought my used car via Welcome Finance, thank heavens that I bought it from an independent main dealer that had no ties with Welcome.

 

It came with a 3 year warranty too. I used to be in the Motor Trade many years ago and know all the tricks in that sometimes dodgy trade.

[andie_303]

Basically your payments are slightly under what they actually should be and I was trying to find out what variance they are allowed in their APR - I was looking at it for me as well and unfortunately neither mine nor yours was enough that we could argue about that.

 

I'm looking at some other options now but I feel my best course of action is that I'm currently in court with them about PPI and I'm thinking of filing another case citing fraud and misrepresentation as there is something in my agreement that I know is there but is not declared (i can't say what that is just yet) but if i can win it it may well set a precedent for others if you also have what i have. Cryptic I know but I really can't say what I have.

 

In the meantime if you're lawyer comes up with anything let me know - I need all the help I can get.

[SHELLA]

Ooo interesting...what year are those leaflets from Shella?

 

 

Lifecare 24 was included in the agreement I have from 2003.

In the agreement of 2005 it has morphed into Medicare 24.

[Voda]

Hi Andie,

 

Many thanks for that info.

 

What did you think about the paragraph on the Personal Loan Statement that said "Interest will be calculated at the Rate of Interest on the daily balance outstanding of the Total Amount of Credit and the Acceptance Fee. It will be paid as part of your Monthly Payments".

 

I fully understand what you are saying as your case is "Sub Judice".

 

Of course, I'll let you know what my lawyer says.

 

We need all the ammunition that we can get.

 

Take care

 

Basically your payments are slightly under what they actually should be and I was trying to find out what variance they are allowed in their APR - I was looking at it for me as well and unfortunately neither mine nor yours was enough that we could argue about that.

 

I'm looking at some other options now but I feel my best course of action is that I'm currently in court with them about PPI and I'm thinking of filing another case citing fraud and misrepresentation as there is something in my agreement that I know is there but is not declared (i can't say what that is just yet) but if i can win it it may well set a precedent for others if you also have what i have. Cryptic I know but I really can't say what I have.

 

In the meantime if you're lawyer comes up with anything let me know - I need all the help I can get.

[andie_303]

My agreement from 2006 has lifecare 24 also...... but Nu havent underwritten it....not according to them anyway. I have two issues with mine, the first being that it looks like none existant insurance policy and it is a 5 year policy on a ten year loan and im sure that - that alone must be a mis-sel, surely the insurance should cover the loan perid, you would not buy a car opver 5 years with a 2 or 3 year gap policy would you, it does not make sense.

 

 

I have life care and it's a 5 year thing on a 3 year loan - but in reading some of the small print stuff it says this is a 60 month policy from the time of taking it out - I guess thats standard for everyone??

[andie_303]

Hi Andie,

 

Many thanks for that info.

 

What did you think about the paragraph on the Personal Loan Statement that said "Interest will be calculated at the Rate of Interest on the daily balance outstanding of the Total Amount of Credit and the Acceptance Fee. It will be paid as part of your Monthly Payments".

 

I fully understand what you are saying as your case is "Sub Judice".

 

Of course, I'll let you know what my lawyer says.

 

We need all the ammunition that we can get.

 

Take care

 

 

I'm told if they've said they're going to do it it's ok and not covered by the Wilson case....my arguement is using an analogy of...If I kill someone it's not murder and I can't get in trouble if I con that person into signing a piece of paper that in the smallest and most confusing way possible says I am allowed to do this!

Just because they have said it does not make it right and in the case of Sammy why are they telling her(him??) that in response to hear complaint they HAVE NOT charged interest when they blatantly have.

 

I really do think it's worth a test case - all you need is a good judge on a good day and it will set a precedent. Hey I'm willing to risk it and lose my court fees but are Welcome willing to risk it when they KNOW what information I have on them and how it could bring their house of cards tumbling down.

 

Did you see what Bobby posted earlier by the way? Last page - If we're both reading it correctly Welcome have told HSBC and the LSE they are likely to default on the loan!!

[andie_303]

RNS Number : 0083P

Cattles PLC

17 March 2009

 



Cattles plc

£400,000,000 7.125% bonds due 2017 (the "Bonds"), issued pursuant to a Trust Deed dated 5 July 2007 (as amended from time to time) between Cattles plc (the "Issuer") and HSBC Trustee (C.I.) Limited (the "Trustee")

The Issuer is aware that certain bondholders are seeking to form a co-ordinated group to allow dialogue between the Issuer and bondholders, in light of recent announcements by the Issuer. Bondholders wishing to participate in this group are requested to contact John Hale at the ABI in the first instance.

The Issuer has had an initial, informal meeting with certain of the bondholders to discuss the current position. The information provided by it at the meeting was in the public domain or of a non-price sensitive nature. Details of the matters discussed at the meeting are to be provided on request. Contact details for this purpose are as follows:

 

 

Cattles plc

Kingston House

Centre 27 Business Park

Woodhead Road

Birstall

Batley

West Yorkshire WF17 9TD

Fax: +44 (0) 1924 448 324

Attention: M.W.G. Collins

Further to the announcement by the Issuer on 10 March 2009 in which the Issuer gave notice that the Board believes that the Issuer is in breach of covenants under its borrowing arrangements, the Issuer has given notice to the Trustee that a Potential Event of Default has occurred under the Bonds by reason of the cross-default provisions in the Bonds.

 

 

Here Voda - Last paragrapgh at the bottom is interesting don't you think??

[mojo8]

I have life care and it's a 5 year thing on a 3 year loan - but in reading some of the small print stuff it says this is a 60 month policy from the time of taking it out - I guess thats standard for everyone??

 

they just seem to throw a policy on a loan as and when they want regardless if it covers your needs or not just to bump up there commissions. My partner and i work in motor finance and ive seen it so many times and even though the FSA would hang the business for doing it the managers seem to turn a blind eye to unscrupulous saleamen doing it.

[andie_303]

they just seem to throw a policy on a loan as and when they want regardless if it covers your needs or not just to bump up there commissions. My partner and i work in motor finance and ive seen it so many times and even though the FSA would hang the business for doing it the managers seem to turn a blind eye to unscrupulous saleamen doing it.

 

 

I keep asking Welcome where the needs analysis was done that decided IF i needed such policies and IF they were suitable for me - Short answer is THERE WASN'T ONE but is that the answer Welcome give OH NO - they think they can con their way out of it by saying I should have told them about any medical conditions WITHOUT them asking - WTF are they serious??

 

They have refused to give me the name of the person that did the loan paperwork and have refused to tell me if he was qualified and registered to be selling insurance policies - I wonder why????

[andie_303]

Thats also what you get when you pay salespeople commision on selling insurance products....WHOOPS did I just say that!

[Voda]

Hi Andie,

 

That's also very interesting.

 

I hope that this lawyer I am going to see is as good as he is cracked up to be.

 

Yes I see it the same way too re the default.

 

Have a great day.

 

I'm told if they've said they're going to do it it's ok and not covered by the Wilson case....my arguement is using an analogy of...If I kill someone it's not murder and I can't get in trouble if I con that person into signing a piece of paper that in the smallest and most confusing way possible says I am allowed to do this!

Just because they have said it does not make it right and in the case of Sammy why are they telling her(him??) that in response to hear complaint they HAVE NOT charged interest when they blatantly have.

 

I really do think it's worth a test case - all you need is a good judge on a good day and it will set a precedent. Hey I'm willing to risk it and lose my court fees but are Welcome willing to risk it when they KNOW what information I have on them and how it could bring their house of cards tumbling down.

 

Did you see what Bobby posted earlier by the way? Last page - If we're both reading it correctly Welcome have told HSBC and the LSE they are likely to default on the loan!!

[pt2537]

Thats also what you get when you pay salespeople commision on selling insurance products....WHOOPS did I just say that!

and if you werent told of the commission that YOU Would have to fund, then you have a claim there too for a secret or undisclosed commission

[andie_303]

and if you werent told of the commission that YOU Would have to fund, then you have a claim there too for a secret or undisclosed commission

 

 

Exactly - thank you for confirming my musings

[Dipply75]

Morning all....oh my god, my brain is going nuts! I have read the last 6 pages to catch up and there is so much jumping out at me.

 

Andie, we really need a discussion on this acceptance fee/interest thing, they are trying to hide something, need to do some digging, you may be able to rely on this after all.....something Peterbard said got my nose twitching.

 

Posggj - that letter you posted ref the car/MOT/deposit - was it cash/cheque £1000 or car part exchange? If they have accepted a deposit and stated it worth less than its value for tax/duty etc avoidance purposes you have them. Is there a seperate thread for this one?

 

Andie, need to PM you ref the blatant forgery you let me see...been digging, land registry etc

 

Shella, what you have there may just be gold dust...along with the others who posted info ref medicare/lifecare etc. I need ot go back and read pages again and take some notes but bear with me, may just be worth it.

 

Confused....I think you are about to uncover some very dodgy dealings indeed

 

Stewie, will fill you in later but you have opened the way to me claiming another £2K ish - thank you!!!!

 

Voda - keep in touch! Good luck, hope we can stil help.

 

Got some peace to do some digging, and got some sleep too lol, brain on and focussed on Welcome today

[Dipply75]

Shella - Now unless i'm going nuts and dreaming posts that I haven't really seen I'm really confused now

 

I know stewie started it as he had canx his PPI and they hadn't restructured his loan properly and so he was effectively still paying for something he had no use of.

 

Now i'm positive someone told us what sections of the CCA that breached or something along those lines - Dipply was it you??

 

Help I'm cracking up!!

 

It was Stewie once he had been to trading standards...which got me thinking big time...will see if I can get a link to some info for you

[confusedbywcf]

Morning all....oh my god, my brain is going nuts! I have read the last 6 pages to catch up and there is so much jumping out at me.

 

Andie, we really need a discussion on this acceptance fee/interest thing, they are trying to hide something, need to do some digging, you may be able to rely on this after all.....something Peterbard said got my nose twitching.

 

Posggj - that letter you posted ref the car/MOT/deposit - was it cash/cheque £1000 or car part exchange? If they have accepted a deposit and stated it worth less than its value for tax/duty etc avoidance purposes you have them. Is there a seperate thread for this one?

 

Andie, need to PM you ref the blatant forgery you let me see...been digging, land registry etc

 

Shella, what you have there may just be gold dust...along with the others who posted info ref medicare/lifecare etc. I need ot go back and read pages again and take some notes but bear with me, may just be worth it.

 

Confused....I think you are about to uncover some very dodgy dealings indeed

 

Stewie, will fill you in later but you have opened the way to me claiming another £2K ish - thank you!!!!

 

Voda - keep in touch! Good luck, hope we can stil help.

 

Got some peace to do some digging, and got some sleep too lol, brain on and focussed on Welcome today

 

will let you all know how i get on on monday

[mojo8]

These agreements really aren't fit for purpose - surely there's gotta be somthing in that - becasue my guess is you aren't paying for the insurance over the 36 months it is valid it'll be spread over the lifetime of the loan there by accruing interest - therefore you are making payments on something that is no longer valid or usable by yourself - need to trawl back through these posts as I'm sure there's something about that and therefore making the agreement null and void - give me a few minutes...

 

If the thinking is right here Shella you may have them

 

exactly right, when vehicle finance is sold on a five year agreement, or any term, the customer has to be offered sufficient insurance to cover the loan period or suitable insurance to ensure that they are not out of pocket if anything happens to there car, this is done through a "needs and demands" statement, it is then down to the customer to decide if they want the policy. If our guys sold a five year agreement with 3 years gap policy then the FSA ould have a field day with us and we would be in trouble and again if the needs and demands were not completed then any insurance can be deemed a mis-sell.

[pt2537]

Exactly - thank you for confirming my musings

andie,

 

look at paragraph 31-51 of Wilson and Hurstanger, it will tell you all you need to know on the secret commissions

 

also if you can show a link between the commission and the rate of interest you pay , well, lets just say , they will be in a world of ****e

 

we litigate this type of case on a weekly basis mate, there is a lot of mileage in it i can assure you

[andie_303]

Morning all....oh my god, my brain is going nuts! I have read the last 6 pages to catch up and there is so much jumping out at me.

 

Andie, we really need a discussion on this acceptance fee/interest thing, they are trying to hide something, need to do some digging, you may be able to rely on this after all.....something Peterbard said got my nose twitching.

 

Posggj - that letter you posted ref the car/MOT/deposit - was it cash/cheque £1000 or car part exchange? If they have accepted a deposit and stated it worth less than its value for tax/duty etc avoidance purposes you have them. Is there a seperate thread for this one?

 

Andie, need to PM you ref the blatant forgery you let me see...been digging, land registry etc

 

Shella, what you have there may just be gold dust...along with the others who posted info ref medicare/lifecare etc. I need ot go back and read pages again and take some notes but bear with me, may just be worth it.

 

Confused....I think you are about to uncover some very dodgy dealings indeed

 

Stewie, will fill you in later but you have opened the way to me claiming another £2K ish - thank you!!!!

 

Voda - keep in touch! Good luck, hope we can stil help.

 

Got some peace to do some digging, and got some sleep too lol, brain on and focussed on Welcome today

 

PM me - gotta run out for a while so I'll be back soon

[Dipply75]

Due In To Wcf Office On Monday Am Apparently The Person Who Drew Up The Modified Agreement Has Been Sacked And Tghe Manager Says Bthe Loan Issgtill A Car Loan Even If Head Office Have It As A Home Improvement Loan

Havent A Clue How To Fight This As It Seems So Complicated

 

Hi Confused, it may seem like swimming in mud just now but we've been doing this for a while now lol, and I know a few of us will already have a plan of action for you in our heads.

 

We will show you how to take control of this, you will feel much better soon! Why have you to go into the branch on Monday?