Fare evasion Please HELP!!

[ssd01]

I had no money on me at all as I had left my wallet the night b4 at work by mistake whereas yourself was using a freedom pass as i gather my fair cost was 2.80 and id already bought a pass for £68 for the months travel it only went over by a day as well!!

[Grotesque]

Yes they are not similar situations. And the results may well be the same. But more likely to be different!

[ssd01]

Yes they are not similar situations. And the results may well be the same. But more likely to be different!

 

Do you mean im more likely to have a worst outcome then the other individual??

[Grotesque]

Apologies if my reply seemed disconcertingly vague....

[ssd01]

Ok A little update i bumped into the RPO officer at new street who stopped me originally yesterday i asked him what was the likely hood outcome of all this he said it wont b a £1000 fine dnt b silly and as long as u admit its a mistake u made etc and pay the admin fees it shud b fine - what likely hood have i got of not getting convicted for what i don?he was understanding and also said he hadnt even done the report yet! which is quiet a while wait thnn

[Grotesque]

...did you offer him a 'GOOD' drink ...it's all part of the procedure you know

[ssd01]

...did you offer him a 'GOOD' drink ...it's all part of the procedure you know

 

Im worried about a criminal record and conviction not really fussed about offering him a drink:P

[Grotesque]

...Is today's right answer!!!! If you had it would have constituted Attempted Bribery, thus enabling you to worry about the whole thing even more....

[honeybee13]

Hi Grotesque.

 

I think ssd has had enough of the funnies for a little while. Maybe you could cut them some slack please?

 

My best, HB

[Grotesque]

No way. LOL. It's all taken in the spirit with which it's intended!!!

Edited July 4, 2012 by Grotesque

[ssd01]

Look i just dnt want to get a criminal record or a conviction and im askin on here from individuals experiences and from what i have been told by the RPO's what is the likely outcome? im goin away to asia in september and dont want this lingerin over me ive just been on my new job as well for the last 2 months and want to work hard at that

[ssd01]

Awaiting for the letter and worrying is the worst!!

[honeybee13]

Awaiting for the letter and worrying is the worst!!

 

I know, everyone says that. It's fear of the unknown. That's the part we can't really help with, I'm afraid.

 

HB

[Grotesque]

Apologies, I thought you had already been advised pretty thoroughly. O/C's posts (26, 28, 33 I think especially) pretty much summmarise the posistion. Let's re-cap.

 

1. You altered a ticket thus demonstrating intent to defraud the railway company, regardless of the amount of the loss to company, this is a statutory offence under various legislation.
   
2. The Inspector has written a report which he will submit to his Prosecutions Dept. Incidentally, that's why an Inspector when asked on what's going to happen following a report will often- and in all honesty! -reply, "I don't know" or, "the railway will write to you", because that's the case. The Inspector is merely an expert witness; he does NOT make the decision to prosecute, and that's all he can honestly say (disingenuously, perhaps) once he submits a report.
   
3. The Prosecutions Dept. will consider his report and if they feel that you were guilty of what you have been reported for, will write to you on the matter, possibly mentionning a potential charge at this point. THIS IS THE STAGE YOU ARE AT. Post #2 above made a good point about writing a letter, but you can't do that until someone has written to you (so you'll have an office contact, reference numbers, etc). Do nothing until then. And for Crippen's sake, stop panicking. You will NOT be charged under the Forgery, Fraud, or Counterfeiting Acts* (they're for people who laser-copy Gold cards etc). Likewise you will NOT get a thousand pound fine or a year in stir or whatever some other posters have suggested (not wrongly, but you generally need not worry about maximum sentences for a first offence).**
   

At the end of the day, you can't do anything now. Don't worry about phoning them; if the Inspector hasn't even made out his report (supposedly) then they won''t even know who you are; and hey! -what if he forgets? Phenomenally unlikely, but never impossible.

When they write toyou, that's when we'll know where we stand; the ball will be in your (our!) court (Npi) and we can go from there.

Bear in mind, things can be settled on the steps of the court- I've seen wads change hands, so it's never too late, until it is, of course. But remember the Prosecutor is human- his job description is to maximise the efficiency of the company's revenue protectorate, NOT to destroy lives. Somethings will never be settled administratively, and your case may unfortunately be one such, but if they can get the money / costs etc they feel due, and that you have been deterred from repeating such an act, they might feel it's worth freeing up some court time for a more deserving case (e.g., the aforementioned Gold card laser copier!!! lol).

Come back with a letter bro. Keep calm....

 

*Obviously that's my opinion, not the CAG's, and personal rather than legal...

**Ditto

[Grotesque]

 

...temporarily of course!

Edited July 4, 2012 by Grotesque

[ssd01]

Wel thanx for the msg grotesque i get what ur sayin lets jus pray and hope that i dont end up in court thanks again

[Grotesque]

It could be worse mate. Lot of other people done far worse and got away with it

 

Still in with a chance yet.

All the best.

[Old-CodJA]

Thank you for your private message ssd01, but I have to say that it is always best to use the open furum to ensure that the maximum number of users benefit from reading posts and being able to monitor, to ensure that innaccurate information isn't given.

 

In answer to your questions:

 

I think that we have given you all the guidance that we can at this stage.

 

I would not treat the comments by the RPO that you spoke to as a definitive answer, in general it is an explanation of what can happen in some cases, but as we have repeatedly said, it is not the RPO who has authority to make that decision.

 

Yes, I do have experience of railways prosecutions, but all of my experience is that every case is dealt with on its individual merit.

 

The best thing that you can possibly do is to try to stop worrying and wait to see if you get a letter. Until then we cannot help you much further.

[Grotesque]

Hope you reported that PM, OC... thus justifying HB's sig... lol

[ssd01]

Hi all got the letter this morning and proper worried i dont want to be prosecuted please read as follows and please advise what i should say in my reply and if i should offer an out of court settlement please please i need advise asap

 

Dear Mr xxxxxx

 

On 14th June 2012 a person giving the above name and address was questioned by a member of rail staff with regard to an alleged incident on London Midland Railway this matter has been provisionally authorised for prosecution

 

Before I proceed further, I invite you to respond by completing in full the bottom section of this letter, making any comments about the incident on the reverse, and send it to the above address with seven days.

Failure to respond will lead to the matter being progressed without further notification

 

Signed

 

Prosecutions manager behalf

 

Includes reference number, asks for the following:-

Surname, Forename, Date of birth, Address, postcode, telephone number, occupation, NI Number, signature, date

[honeybee13]

Hello again.

 

I expect the guys will be along sooner or later, but as you may know, weekends are quiet here.

 

From reading this forum for some time, I believe the guys always advise being honest, because apart from anything else if you aren't it will probably come back and bite you.

 

I would say that rather than offering an out of court settlement, the wording should be to ask them if they will kindly accept one. Pedantic, I know, but it's for them to decide whether they want to do this.

 

My best, HB

[Grotesque]

Ssd, have a look at my post here. No too cases are the same oof course but might give you the gist. I gotta go so can't reply with the depth you deserve at the mo

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?357071-FCC-intent-to-prosecute&p=3900665&viewfull=1#post3900665

[ssd01]

Hi all was wondering im going to ring the prosecution team first and talk to them apoligise profoundly pray than i will send the letter back what does everyone think??

[Grotesque]

Well, they don't record phone calls (for the purposes of evidence) or take extemporaneous notes during them, which means that the apology you make to whoever answers the phone might not get passed on to whoever's dealing with your case. Why not put the same in writing? That way, it all goes in the same folder and is evidence rather than hearsay tht you showed contrition. That's the way forward.

Good luck!

[ssd01]

Hi all thought i would give an update i made a phone call to this mornin to the number given on the letter and apoligised greatly with offering all payments etc they said they could see i had used it for a number of days the pass this is what the guy i believe from the prosecutions dept said and he said if its a first offence we will take this into account and also that i have shown remorse he has noted this down with a phone call etc he said can i reply back to the letter quickly and include what i feel etc and what i think shud happen about this?Furthermore he said the usual cost is all the fares cost plus administration fees etc and once we receive the reply back frm urself we will further consider it??I was wondering from u guys here what do u think is the likely hood of this goin for prosecution?? i have offered an out of court settlement as well.