Letter from Railway Prosecutions Unit - what to do?

[Old-CodJA]

I agree that's your best course of action in my opinion and you might like to simply wait until you get any further letter rather than chase it after returning theirs.

[bdasteve]

I received a letter today from the Unit - £36 and warning me that next time it will go to court. I'll deserve court if there is a next time! Thank you all for your help - esp Wriggler

[mik1]

 

Off the record comments? A bit too Bodie and Doyle for my taste, but most of the evidence relating to 'fare dodging' comes from the 'ticket history' and what the staff saw, rather than what you admit.

 

What is ticket history?

[honeybee13]

What is ticket history?

 

Hello and welcome to CAG. I believe it's to do with Oyster cards, electronic season tickets etc, shows what journeys have been made on it. I forget over how long, but weeks or months. Do you have a reason for asking and can we help?

 

My best, HB

[Wriggler7]

Tickets tell a story, they have coded on them the machine that issued them, and may have a time/date last used, depending on what gates they have been used in.

 

There is, with some passengers, a record of season tickets held. Oysters show the last 8 'uses' made, and a lot more can be discovered from the Oyster records available to Tfl staff.

 

Many offenders have bought 'wrong' tickets previously, and clerks may have made notes of their suspicions. I have read cases where the clerk felt that something was amiss, made notes, and passed them to an Inspector. I am told that many fiddlers will use self service machines to avoid detection.

 

Of course, some clerks will tell the Inspectors that people use the machines every day, even when ther is no queue.

[Wriggler7]

The end result is that even if the Inspector has made mistaks, either with cautions or 'PACE' codes of practice, the real evidence from the ticket, the CCTV and so on will still yeild a conviction. Clever solicitors can play with 'admissions', real evidence is a tougher nut to crack.

[Grotesque]

It has been a while since I have seen a real 'Great Eastern' inspector, but then I only use their line between Upminster and Romford.

 

I understand that they also use a contract revenue protection team, is it 'Meteor'?

 

I know that some of them wear head cams, which I guess also record voice.

 

Meteor= 'run-off-the-mill' minimum wage Agency, man barriers, PFN's, tickets, No MG11's / prosecution work.

The lads with head-cams were from Carlisle Security, enforce bye-laws (mainly 'feet-in-seats', anti-social behaviour etc)

[Wriggler7]

Funnily enough, I went through Romford today, the 'Meteor' folk were all around, near the barriers, on the stairs. They were too busy talking to each other to look closely at my ticket, not that there was anything wrong with it. They failed to spot the dodgy looking chap with his hood up who slid through behind his mate. He went to the same place in Main Road that I did.

[h_riz]

same problem with me...they didnt ask me to pay th fine and now i hav to appear in magistrate court...i choose to plead guilty and not to apper in the court...i m happy to pay the money and i amm all confused...if they hv ask me to pay the fine i would hv but al these court thing make me really upset...someone help...wot will happen after the court date? i am no going on dat day ...how i will pay the fine?

 

 

I too was stopped for being in first class with only standard class ticket - I wrote off explaining the reason I was in there and didnt hear anything further even though I was willing to pay a fine. Next thing I have a summons to go to court - what can I do?

[honeybee13]

same problem with me...they didnt ask me to pay th fine and now i hav to appear in magistrate court...i choose to plead guilty and not to apper in the court...i m happy to pay the money and i amm all confused...if they hv ask me to pay the fine i would hv but al these court thing make me really upset...someone help...wot will happen after the court date? i am no going on dat day ...how i will pay the fine?

 

Hello and welcome to CAG.

 

Is your problem with the same rail company please? It may not make any difference, but it's possible the guys will advise you to start a thread of your own. I expect they will be along later when they can.

 

[edit] it might also help if you tell us a bit more about what happened on the day you had the wrong ticket, if that's what happened.

 

My best, HB

[h_riz]

i recieve letter from london eastern railway...

i was travelling btw harlow town and tottenham hale and accidently sit in the firsclass while having standard ticket. the inspector questioned me and made a report he didnt ask for penalty fare ...and then i recieve a letter from prosecution unit..i replied that i apologize and i am happy to pay the fare...but after some days i recieve letter from court magistrate...i select to plead guilty and not to appear in the court and send it to the clerk as the letter said...hearing is on 6th july 2011....i have not heard back from them any sort of confirmation....wot shud i do...is there any contact no or should i wait...???

[SRPO]

They will write back to you with their decision approx 10 days after the hearing.

[Weller Fan]

HELP!!! re London Easter Railway

 

I was travelling from Billericay to Stratford with a standard class ticket & the train came in as only 4 carriages instead of 8. As I was waiting at the end of the platform, i ran back to the front car & squeezed my way on + entered 1st class - it was that or wait for the next train & i was already late for work. I was stopped at the next station & cautioned. a genuine error on my part and a first offence- i had sufficient funds on me to pay the additional fare but wasnt given the opportunity to pay. another passenger was next to me & in the same situation - we swapped numbers just in case - i spoke with him today & after he returned their letter, he was given the option of paying the fare diffference & an admin fee. i havent been taht lucky - i guess its due to my delay in sendign the form back to them.

 

I received a form asking me to state my side from the prosecutions unit, which I did complete but stupidly didn't send straight back - I sent it back nearly 3 weeks ago, but in the meantime have received a court summons.

 

If i go to court, I will be found guilty, lose my job + be unemployable as I work in the financial services industry. My court date is set for 30th Sept 2011 - is there anythign I can do to grovel to them & settle their costs out of court? I need to avoid going to court at all costs>>

 

Any advice greatly appreciated - please help me so I can stop worrying!

[Stigy]

HELP!!! re London Easter Railway

 

I was travelling from Billericay to Stratford with a standard class ticket & the train came in as only 4 carriages instead of 8. As I was waiting at the end of the platform, i ran back to the front car & squeezed my way on + entered 1st class - it was that or wait for the next train & i was already late for work. I was stopped at the next station & cautioned. a genuine error on my part and a first offence- i had sufficient funds on me to pay the additional fare but wasnt given the opportunity to pay. another passenger was next to me & in the same situation - we swapped numbers just in case - i spoke with him today & after he returned their letter, he was given the option of paying the fare diffference & an admin fee. i havent been taht lucky - i guess its due to my delay in sendign the form back to them.

 

I received a form asking me to state my side from the prosecutions unit, which I did complete but stupidly didn't send straight back - I sent it back nearly 3 weeks ago, but in the meantime have received a court summons.

 

If i go to court, I will be found guilty, lose my job + be unemployable as I work in the financial services industry. My court date is set for 30th Sept 2011 - is there anythign I can do to grovel to them & settle their costs out of court? I need to avoid going to court at all costs>>

 

Any advice greatly appreciated - please help me so I can stop worrying!

There's an Easter railway now?

 

I suggest you write to the Prosecutions department for the TOC concerned and explain the effect this could potentially have on your career etc. State how sorry you are and that it will never happen again. Also state how it was your first offence and offer to pay all reasonable admin costs in order to stay out of court. Just because you've received a summons through the post doesn't mean that it's Game Over, and it can still be settled administratively right up until the court date. They don't have to accept, but it wont hurt to try.

[luis70]

HELP!!! re London Easter Railway

 

I was travelling from Billericay to Stratford with a standard class ticket & the train came in as only 4 carriages instead of 8. As I was waiting at the end of the platform, i ran back to the front car & squeezed my way on + entered 1st class - it was that or wait for the next train & i was already late for work. I was stopped at the next station & cautioned. a genuine error on my part and a first offence- i had sufficient funds on me to pay the additional fare but wasnt given the opportunity to pay. another passenger was next to me & in the same situation - we swapped numbers just in case - i spoke with him today & after he returned their letter, he was given the option of paying the fare diffference & an admin fee. i havent been taht lucky - i guess its due to my delay in sendign the form back to them.

 

I received a form asking me to state my side from the prosecutions unit, which I did complete but stupidly didn't send straight back - I sent it back nearly 3 weeks ago, but in the meantime have received a court summons.

 

If i go to court, I will be found guilty, lose my job + be unemployable as I work in the financial services industry. My court date is set for 30th Sept 2011 - is there anythign I can do to grovel to them & settle their costs out of court? I need to avoid going to court at all costs>>

 

Any advice greatly appreciated - please help me so I can stop worrying!

 

After how many days, did you return your form?

[Old-CodJA]

If you did not respond within the time advised on the letter, it is very likely that they will have taken the view that you may have intended to avoid the liability and that will be why you have received a summons.

 

You could write with a full apology, offer to pay the full fare and their reasonably incurred administration costs and ask if the company will accept this as a means of disposing of the case without prosecution. Adding an apology to the company & staff concerned and an undertaking not to repeat the offence will improve the chances of success.

 

There is no guarantee that this will work, the TOC do not have to accept your offer, but will give it serious consideration.

[Weller Fan]

All, thanks for the great advice. I wrote a very grovelling letter, explaining about losing my job, career etc, and then managed to call them. After a bit of back & forth which involved me faxing my letter to them, I spoke to a Prosecutor. He could not have been more helpful. He explained that it was my delay in sending the form back (almost 2 months, i'm ashamed to say.) that has generted the court summons. He said they don't set out to ruin people's lives or careers, and court is a last option. He had reviewed my case & letter, and was happy for me to pay their full costs (£13.60 fare differential +£100.00 court costs) to settle out of court.

He explained that the summons will still be called at court, but would be marked as 'withdrawn' - so no ciriminal record, the court don't get involved. the railway DO keep all your details, so next time, they do send you straight to court.

The message to all you genuine 'victims' is, speak to them - they are reasonable people, explain why you were in the wrong, apologise + say it was a one-off, offer to pay the full costs and the problem goes away!

[Grotesque]

Yes, Tony's a nice feller.

 

@wellerfan: The Jam ROCKED!!! -but Style Council S*CKED!!! LOL

 

Well doone with your case mate! Goood result!

[Weller Fan]

Tony was a very nice feller indeed ! But how the hell did you know I spoke to him amongst all the prosecutors?! And by the end of the morning, I felt like I knew Lorraine better than my missus!

 

I'm a but sad & think Weller can do no wrong, but have to agree The Jam were miles better than TSC, as is Weller solo!

[Grotesque]

LOL my omnipotence grows EVER STRONGER

 

Hope you didn't tell him that you felt you knew HIS missus better than you knew your own... he might've have misinterpreted!!!

[honeybee13]

Hello Weller Fan, I'm pleased for you and well done.

 

Grotesque, is there any chance you could elaborate on your interesting observations and world domination [or the universe for all I know] project, for us lesser mortals, please?

 

My best, HB

[Old-CodJA]

Whoa!! You're not looking for exposures relating to any of T's perceived pecadillos I hope HB?

 

Groteque may of course wish to share his own personal thoughts with all of us

[honeybee13]

Whoa!! You're not looking for exposures relating to any of T's perceived pecadillos I hope HB?

 

Groteque may of course wish to share his own personal thoughts with all of us

 

Heavens forfend, certainly not exposures! It was the hint of world domination that got my interest.

 

My best, HB

[Tibetius]

Hi Guys,

 

I have tried getting a telephone number for them but couldnt find anything.

 

Can anyone help?

 

Thanks

 

All, thanks for the great advice. I wrote a very grovelling letter, explaining about losing my job, career etc, and then managed to call them. After a bit of back & forth which involved me faxing my letter to them, I spoke to a Prosecutor. He could not have been more helpful. He explained that it was my delay in sending the form back (almost 2 months, i'm ashamed to say.) that has generted the court summons. He said they don't set out to ruin people's lives or careers, and court is a last option. He had reviewed my case & letter, and was happy for me to pay their full costs (£13.60 fare differential +£100.00 court costs) to settle out of court.

He explained that the summons will still be called at court, but would be marked as 'withdrawn' - so no ciriminal record, the court don't get involved. the railway DO keep all your details, so next time, they do send you straight to court.

The message to all you genuine 'victims' is, speak to them - they are reasonable people, explain why you were in the wrong, apologise + say it was a one-off, offer to pay the full costs and the problem goes away!

[luis70]

All, thanks for the great advice. I wrote a very grovelling letter, explaining about losing my job, career etc, and then managed to call them. After a bit of back & forth which involved me faxing my letter to them, I spoke to a Prosecutor. He could not have been more helpful. He explained that it was my delay in sending the form back (almost 2 months, i'm ashamed to say.) that has generted the court summons. He said they don't set out to ruin people's lives or careers, and court is a last option. He had reviewed my case & letter, and was happy for me to pay their full costs (£13.60 fare differential +£100.00 court costs) to settle out of court.

He explained that the summons will still be called at court, but would be marked as 'withdrawn' - so no ciriminal record, the court don't get involved. the railway DO keep all your details, so next time, they do send you straight to court.

The message to all you genuine 'victims' is, speak to them - they are reasonable people, explain why you were in the wrong, apologise + say it was a one-off, offer to pay the full costs and the problem goes away!

 

Weller : Can you provide the telephone number of the procecutions department please?