The issues raised by Llloyds bank defences and claiming beyond 6 yrs

[Soniam1981]

ok thank you. So now i have recieved tht bog standard letter back from LTSB saying they charges are for a service etc and was just wondering if i should send the second letter threatening action now or just start court proceedings? Any help would be great. thanks.

[noomill060]

Have you sent them an SAR to discover how much they actually owe you?

[Pen]

Have you also read through the F&Qs section, this is where you will find all the info for making your claim against the bank, what bank are you with.

Pen

[Soniam1981]

I got hold of 6 years worth of statements from my online banking and then worked out the charges + interest and wrote them the first letter i was advised by another cliamant from the moneysavingexpert.com site. I have had one repy saying basically that i wont be getting my money refunded as they are charges for a service, blah blah. Have just found the next letter with the help of someone in the chat room so will be sending that. Thanks for all your help. This site defo gets my support and a donation when i get my money back. Everyone has the right to this info - you guys are doing a great job.

[Nads]

Fantastic, wish I had known this before, I have already sent my LBA for the last 6 years just completing my NI to commence court proceedings. So what's the best way to deal with this, should I wait and request statements prior to the 6 years? or continue with my 6 year claim? which includes contractual interest by the way.

 

Imagine at this rate I could afford a deposit on a house!!!!

[Justinfarley1976]

Hello CAG!! First post and with a question too.

With regards to my old Lloyds TSB account that I had closed when I got a joint account with my now ex-wife in 2000, can I get my statements for that old account? I was charged for the plasma in my blood with that account!!

 

Any reply from you guru's would be so appreciated!!

 

Thread ya later!! (lame I know)

 

Justin

[bonnieblusher]

I have sent a letter to lloyds and the 40 days is nearly up and I have heard nothing. Surprise surprise, I have been in to my bank on numerous occassions and they have just expolited me. I remember one month when they changed to "Real time banking " and they paid everything twice then charged me for the privilige and the manager of my account refused to give me compensation, he shouted at me and i had my children with me I was so humiliated. I am up 2day on my accounts overdraft facilities and they have just sent me a Visa debit cheque card and i have been apparently with collections for the last 6 months !!!! They dont make sense. What do i do if they dont send me the requested information?

Please help

 

Thank you

[photoman]

I have sent a letter to lloyds and the 40 days is nearly up and I have heard nothing. Surprise surprise, I have been in to my bank on numerous occassions and they have just expolited me. I remember one month when they changed to "Real time banking " and they paid everything twice then charged me for the privilige and the manager of my account refused to give me compensation, he shouted at me and i had my children with me I was so humiliated. I am up 2day on my accounts overdraft facilities and they have just sent me a Visa debit cheque card and i have been apparently with collections for the last 6 months !!!! They dont make sense. What do i do if they dont send me the requested information?

Please help

 

Thank you

 

Post them this

 

Date:

Ref:

 

 

LETTER BEFORE ACTION

Section 7 – Data Protection Act 1998

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Account: xxxxxxxx

 

You have failed to comply with my Data Protection Act Subject Access Request dated (Insert Date).

 

If you do not comply within the next 7 days I shall seek a Court order obliging you to do so together with further action and damages at the discretion of the Court and without any further notice.

 

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

 

 

 

[name]

 

P.S. I would like to draw your attention to a recent case on 21/11/06.

In this circumstance an action resulted in the granting of a County Court order in respect of a failure by the Royal Bank of Scotland to comply with a disclosure request under the Data Protection Act

.

District judge Forrester, making the order commented that had the claimant been able to supply him with the name of the data controller that he would have added a threat of imprisonment for non-compliance

.

Then be prepared to carry it through with a court action.

Here is a sample of the wording for an N1 court order to force compliance with your Data Protection Act request:

Sample Particulars of Claim: Text in red should be amended/deleted as appropriate.

 

NB: Please note that some County Court staff may not be aware of the procedure for these claims. It is important that you insist that the N1 is accepted - and that your claim is NOT a "pre-action disclosure", or a claim under "part 8".

The Information Commissioner has indicated that these claims should be dealt with in the Small Claims track.

 

 

BRIEF DETAILS OF CLAIM (On Front of N1)

 

Order under Section 7 and Section 15(2) of the Data Protection Act 1998

Damages

 

NB: It is absolutely vital that you do not use the word "injunction" as this may cause problems. You will also find that the fee varies from £30 to £150, depending on the court involved. Of course, this fee should be recoverable, and if you qualify for relief from paying fees you will not have to pay, or it may be reduced.

 

 

PARTICULARS OF CLAIM

 

 

1. The Defendant is a Data Controller within the meaning of the Data Protection Act and is responsible for the processing of data of which the Claimant is a Subject.

 

2. The Claimant (has/had) an account number (Insert Account Number) ("the Account") with the Defendant which was opened on or around (Insert date) (and closed on or around (Insert date)).

 

3. On (Insert Date) the Claimant sent a Subject Access Request, pursuant to Section 7 of the Data Protection Act 1998 to the Defendant.

 

4. The Defendant has failed to comply.

 

5. By virtue of the Defendant's failure to comply with the Subject Access Request the Claimant has suffered damage (and distress).

 

6. The damage (and distress) caused is:

 

Extra costs incurred in addition to court costs, due to the Defendants failure to comply - this includes the cost of additional correspondence and time spent preparing documents and seeking legal advice, I estimate this cost to be £...........

 

Add any further things that can be clearly quantifiable, and to which you can provide proof.

 

Please be aware that claims for distress are only available where the distress is caused by the quantifiable damage. You would usually need professional evidence in support. If you are intending to go down this route it is vital you contact us before proceeding.

 

7. The Claimant seeks an order that the Defendant do comply with the Claimant's Subject Access Request

 

8. Under the terms of Section 15(2) of the Data Protection Act 1998, where the Defendant contests that information requested under the Claimant's Subject Access Request is not included within the scope of Section 7 of the Data Protection Act 1998, the Claimant requests that the Court inspects that information, and where it finds that the Defendant's opinion is unfounded, that it orders such information be included within the information supplied to the Claimant under the Subject Access Request.

 

9. Damages and costs within the discretion of the Court.

 

 

 

I believe that the contents of these particulars of claim are true

 

 

Signed:

 

 

Date:

You can also lodge a complaint with the Information Commissioners Office.

Go to their website to read how to, and to get the form;

For more information about these requirements, please see their website

(ICO – Information Commissioner's Office) or call the Helpline on 01625 545 745.

 

[shapessalon]

Recieved the same letter as you today from lloyds just wondering if you heard anything from them yet. if so could you let me know because i'm not sure what to do now. Good luck.

[Banshee]

I am up to the point of sending the 2nd letter to Loyds Got back the standard letters stating the charges are for extra services provided when customers dont have enough money in there accounts to cover payments blah blah lol Anywayz am a bit confused as to which letter to send now As ive found 2 The 1st gives Lloyds 14 to respond the 2nd 7 days to respond before i take court action Does anyone know Which one i should send? Also ive only made a claim for the past 6 years But have since found Statements and Letters back as far as 1996 When i 1st opend my account with them Durring the first few years they were seriously punishing me in Charges They would charge me £10 for going £13 overdrawn and £27 for returning a cheque for £12 If i can make a 2nd claim for back then i could claim another £2,000 between 96 and 2001 Can i make 2 seperate claims? Ive got all the letters but not all the statements from back then Any assistance would be very appreciated as am struggling with the time periods of sending letters etc

[Pen]

Unsure, letters and statements are totally different, for instance one letter could say that you will be charged x amount on x date but a week later after a phone call to complain you could have received another letter stating they are not going to debit x amount, get what I mean, statements are evidence I think they could argue a letter, thats only my opinion though.

 

Pen

[photoman]

I am up to the point of sending the 2nd letter to Loyds Got back the standard letters stating the charges are for extra services provided when customers dont have enough money in there accounts to cover payments blah blah lol Anywayz am a bit confused as to which letter to send now As ive found 2 The 1st gives Lloyds 14 to respond the 2nd 7 days to respond before i take court action Does anyone know Which one i should send? Also ive only made a claim for the past 6 years But have since found Statements and Letters back as far as 1996 When i 1st opend my account with them Durring the first few years they were seriously punishing me in Charges They would charge me £10 for going £13 overdrawn and £27 for returning a cheque for £12 If i can make a 2nd claim for back then i could claim another £2,000 between 96 and 2001 Can i make 2 seperate claims? Ive got all the letters but not all the statements from back then Any assistance would be very appreciated as am struggling with the time periods of sending letters etc

 

Banshee,

I will answer your question here, but for the sake of keeping this thread relevent and readable for all those looking for information, you should really start your own thread for all questions from now on.

Regards your question. If you have only sent a prelim, and are about to send an LBA, then you can simply add all the additional charges in. Perhaps state something along lines of the fact that you have since your initial letter discovered additional charges, and will now be claiming those too. You can if you wish mention sec 32 of Statute of Limitations, but personally I would not, let them raise the issue, and then just put the relevent reasonings in your POC on your claim form. Regards the time period 14 days is good form, as you do not want to be seen as acting too hasty.

 

You seem to be a newcomer here so, I'll post some stuff to get your teeth stuck into in a moment.

[photoman]

Banshee

 

Some info for you.

 

First of all read the Frequently asked questions here

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/faqs-please-read-these/

DO READ THE STEP BY STEP INSTRUCTIONS !!!!!!

As you go on, you’ll also find this very helpful:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/site-questions-suggestions/53182-cant-find-what-youre.html

You’ll then need to start your own thread;

Go to here:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.c o.uk/forum/

 

Find the name of the Bank your action will be against.

Click on it (the name of the Bank in Bold Blue)

On that page, you will then find a label saying "Forum Tools" (just under the list of page numbers).

Click on it. It will show you some options.

Firstly, it's a good idea to subscribe to the Forum ,as you'll then recieve updates from people in similar situatioins against the same Bank. So click on Subscribe. It will ask how often you want updates (Personally I like Daily).

Once Subscibed to the Forum it will redirect you back.

Hit the same button and choose "Start new thread"

Give your Thread a title eg: yourforumname v whatever bank

(choose how often you want updating by email if anyone posts responses in your thread)

 

Then your up and running !

 

Whilst your there, you might want to take some time to have a look at some of the threads by people taking action against your same Bank, very helpful. Remember, any threads you want to follow, you can either choose the thread tools button, and choose subscribe to thread, or simply whenever you make a post in a thread it will automatically subscribe you to that thread.

On the main page I've posted above, you'll also find lots of highlighted "stickies", which have lots of very informative stuff in them too.

Once your ready to start , you’ll need to do a schedule of charges to submit to the bank, try this one:

http://www.zen122856.zen.co.uk/CompoundSheet_v1.9.xls

 

Best regards and good luck

 

photoman

[magickminion]

Hi..I have received a letter, along with my statements for the last 6 years, and Lloyds have stated that they can send me further statements that date back before the 6 year period but it will take longer to access their archived data. They then say under the terms of the Data PA, they are allowed up to 40 days to fullfil my request. The Data Protection Act letter I initially sent them didn't stipulate statements up to 6 years ago. So my question is, do they have 40 more days to comply? OR, am I still within my 40 day period to retrieve this information?

[Glenn UK]

they only get one lot of 40 days, from the date they got your SAR and cheque they have 40 calender days

 

Glenn

[jules78]

Hi,

 

I closed my TSB account in 2001 after holding a student account. I recieved lots of charges. I have now finally received my statements from 1997-2001. I have had a quick look at the statements - in that period I recieved over £800 worth of charges.

 

Do you think that it is worthwwhile to persue these chargges - thanks

[liono]

hi guys, ok i am currently making a claim against lloyds for the charges they have placed on my account. i recieved a letter from them today stating that there charges are "fair" and that they cant agree to cancel my charges!!

If there is anyone who can give me some advise on what i should do next or give me a few tips that i may find useful it would be much appreciated.

I have also been told that because my claim amounts to £6,200 that i should write to them stating that i would be willing to accept an offer of £5000 instead of the full amount, this being only for the reason to keep the claim in the small claims court rather than the county court, is this a good or bad idea..........

Many thanks

Claire

[cerisemercedes]

Hi All,

Is the claiming beyond 6 years just for Lloyds customers, or can we all do it, I had an accout with Natwest and Barclays that I got into trouble with when I was out of work - lots of charges, can I reclaim them, and will the still have all the information for 8 1/2 years ago?

cerisemercedes

[photoman]

hi guys, ok i am currently making a claim against lloyds for the charges they have placed on my account. i recieved a letter from them today stating that there charges are "fair" and that they cant agree to cancel my charges!!

If there is anyone who can give me some advise on what i should do next or give me a few tips that i may find useful it would be much appreciated.

I have also been told that because my claim amounts to £6,200 that i should write to them stating that i would be willing to accept an offer of £5000 instead of the full amount, this being only for the reason to keep the claim in the small claims court rather than the county court, is this a good or bad idea..........

Many thanks

Claire

 

Liono

 

First of all read the Frequently asked questions here

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/faqs-please-read-these/

DO READ THE STEP BY STEP INSTRUCTIONS !!!!!!

As you go on, you’ll also find this very helpful:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/site-questions-suggestions/53182-cant-find-what-youre.html

You’ll then need to start your own thread;

Go to here:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.c o.uk/forum/

 

Find the name of the Bank your action will be against.

Click on it (the name of the Bank in Bold Blue)

On that page, you will then find a label saying "Forum Tools" (just under the list of page numbers).

Click on it. It will show you some options.

Firstly, it's a good idea to subscribe to the Forum ,as you'll then recieve updates from people in similar situatioins against the same Bank. So click on Subscribe. It will ask how often you want updates (Personally I like Daily).

Once Subscibed to the Forum it will redirect you back.

Hit the same button and choose "Start new thread"

Give your Thread a title eg: yourforumname v whatever bank

(choose how often you want updating by email if anyone posts responses in your thread)

 

Then your up and running !

 

Whilst your there, you might want to take some time to have a look at some of the threads by people taking action against your same Bank, very helpful. Remember, any threads you want to follow, you can either choose the thread tools button, and choose subscribe to thread, or simply whenever you make a post in a thread it will automatically subscribe you to that thread.

On the main page I've posted above, you'll also find lots of highlighted "stickies", which have lots of very informative stuff in them too.

Once your ready to start , you’ll need to do a schedule of charges to submit to the bank, try this one:

http://www.zen122856.zen.co.uk/CompoundSheet_v1.9.xls

 

Best regards and good luck

 

photoman

PS: Do you really want them to get away with £1200 of your money ??

I suggest you don't indicate that you will accept £5000, as it makes you seem weak.... then they'll offer you £2000 !!

Read around a bit , and see how people with similar amounts have handled matters? As these claims are relatively straightforward, and because there are now so many, often the courts are prepared to bend the £5k rule if you ask (there are templates to help you word such a request on this site). Otherwise you could split your claim, if you can be seen to be doing so with good reason. Post around and ask advice on this.

[photoman]

Hi All,

Is the claiming beyond 6 years just for Lloyds customers, or can we all do it, I had an accout with NatWest and Barclays that I got into trouble with when I was out of work - lots of charges, can I reclaim them, and will the still have all the information for 8 1/2 years ago?

cerisemercedes

 

The Bank doesn't matter. The same rules apply to enable you to claim more than six years.

Getting all your statements for such period could be tricky though, as the Banks have "their own" impression of how the Limitations act is practiced.

You just need to persevere, and push for all the info. There are threads on this site with people doing the same, so seek them out and find out.

This is a useful thread for giving you some info on how far back others have mangaed to get statements.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/80683-please-post-how-far.html

 

Best Regards

[Pen]

Hi everyone, further update on my quest for my Subject Access information. As you know, I have been in contact with a Janet Ayres the poor lady from data Protection Department who informed me that for some reason the departments involved with processing the information will for some reason not let her process mine. I asked her if she could write to me with a reason as to why this is. I recieved this letter from her today.

 

 

 

 

Dear Pen

 

I refer to our recent telephone conversation in respect of your request for your Information under the Data Protection Act.

 

As explained, this data is produced from a separet department and i emailed your requested to them again following our intial conversation and, again following your subsequent telephone call. if you feel that your request has not been compiled with it will be nessasary for your to contact the copy statement unit for an explanation.

Please except my apoligies for the fact that i was unsuccesful in collating further data relating to your accounts and, should you have any queries in the future, do not hesitate to refer to our customer service requvery department.

 

yours sincereley

 

J L Ayres.

Data protection Unit.

 

So still no joy there then. by the way I have also wrote to the copy statement department on 2 occashions so far they have ingnored my letters.

 

I've now given up trying to get this information myself from the bank, i am going to place my confidence in the judge, lets see what he orders next month at the disposal hearing

 

Pen

[bluedannyw]

I have just had the standard bog off letter form tsb saying that they are not penalties but charges for their service. Now that shows they are covering up charges and can now be seen as concealment, has anyone sent an lba letter confronting this issue and then saying if they do not pay up they will be claiming back for further years. Then to say as an offer of goodwill I will accept this payment and agree not to go back further. I haven't got the statements further back and will probably not ever fget them, but maybe this will encourage them to settle before court action!

[elsinore]

 

I've now given up trying to get this information myself from the bank, i am going to place my confidence in the judge, lets see what he orders next month at the disposal hearing

 

 

Pen, I don't care who the people are who are withholding information from you, or why they are doing it, they are breaking the law!

 

I think you should write to Ms Ayres to remind her of her legal obligations under the DPA and advise her that you have sent a copy of the letter to Penny Berryman, together with a copy of Ms Ayres letter to you. Then send copies of that correspondence to the Court, ensuring that LTSB know that you have done so.

 

I pinched this from a Citi thread (posted by Lickthewallfatboy) as it could form the basis of your letter.

 

The 1998 Act requires requests to be dealt with "promptly" and in any event within 40 days. The 40 day period begins on the day on which the data controller has all the information he needs to identify the applicant and to locate the data requested, along with the fee, if any. The 40 day limit has been unchanged since the implementation of the 1984 Act. However, the requirement for promptness was newly introduced by the 1998 Act. The Information Commissioner has been given extensive powers of enforcement which rival those of the VAT man and can serve a data controller with an “Information Notice” requiring the data controller to provide certain information within set time limits. Failure to comply with such notice, or providing deliberately false information, is a criminal offence. If the Commissioner concludes that there has been a breach of the Act, he may then serve a data controller with an “Enforcement Notice.” This could force a data controller to cease processing personal data, or cease processing data in a particular way. Failure to comply with an enforcement notice is also a criminal offence.

 

Criminal liability does not lie just with the data controller. It is possible for officers of a company, such as its directors or managers, to be personally criminally liable if the offence has been committed with their consent, connivance or neglect. Employees may also incur criminal liability in certain limited circumstances.

 

Once a Court Order is obtained then the Information Commissioners Office must issue an "Information Notice" and the Company must act on it - the consequences of them not doing so can cost them a great deal more than just a few thousand pounds charges.

 

Els

 

 

 

[Pen]

Just out of interest, in 1992, we had a financial appraisal done, by the bank and we ended up buying a Tax free savings plan i think they where called PEPs, we paid a lump some of £3,000 and payed a additional £100 a month into it along with a FSA costing us another £100 a month can not remember what that is but after about 3 yrs when our circumstances changed we stopped paying into it, we where able to get most of our money back but not all due to being tied into for so many yrs I think , but although I have the original appraisal showing the products that where sold to us signed by both us and the adviser, it would be nice to know what happened to these, and if we still had any capital wrapped up in them, this info would of course be on our Data Protection info. It does make you wonder just what the banks have taken from us over the yrs.

 

Can anyone remember what the rules where regarding these products and if there where any clauses in them.

 

Pen

 

Pen

[dinner_lady]

hello having trouble with lloyds