Virgin Active and ARC!!! Please Help

[spamheed]

Dear Spamheed Hello,

 

I have received a letter from ARC today copy of my contract with virgin active and membership rules are also attached with that. Does it have your signature on it?

is it a copy of the actual contract that you signed?

 

Letter is here for you

 

Dear XXXXX,

 

We are writing in response to your recent correspondence.

 

Please find enclosed a copy of your signed contract form our client which shows you agreed to the term and conditions of the contract. As we have now supplied you with this documentation we require full payment with the next 10 days. No they don't, assuming that the contract is correct they can have what you can reasonably afford and nothing more

 

Your payment should be sent directly to this office. Please ensure your payment is made payable to ARC (Europe) Ltd and clearly write your reference number XXXXX on the reverse, or this may delay it being allocated to your account. Alternatively you can telephone us to make a payment by debit or credit card.

 

If we do not receive your payment within the next 10 days, this account will be passed to our solicitors for further action.

 

 

Yours Faithfully,

 

 

 

 

 

In the rules under the heading of Debt Collection it says;

 

If you are a Diamond Member and have committed to a minimum twelve month term and you do not make a monthly payment (with in 30 days of the due date) then we may add to the out standing sum to be collected the reasonable and necessary costs incurred by us in employing third party to collect the outstanding sum (which will not be disproportionate to the sum to be collected).

 

Please guide : (

 

 

hope it helps

[Rose Rose]

I am sending you scan of that contract and the things in circle I have signed. I hope I have attached the document properly.

 

Yes that is the copy of the acctual contract which I have signed.

 

Hopefully you will get the attachment.

[Rose Rose]

Opps!! Sorry Spamheed it iz too small , let me type that for you.

[Rose Rose]

Dear Spamheed,

So sorry for the delay, that whole affair of ARC is driving me mad and I have a very bad cold : (.

Yesterday received a letter from Virgin Active Gym. They want me to send the ref number of the recorded delivery letter which I posted back in Dec 2007. According to their member service manager she will then send my letter to her head office to resolve that matter as soon as possible. But there is not guarantee abt the out come on my membership and I might have to make a full payment towards my account, but obviously her head office will decide that.

I am sending them the copy of all special delivery, electronic proof receipts..Obviously via Special Delivery…

Ohh yeah they have finally received my doctor letter so they do receive Special Deliveries some times

[spamheed]

wherever possible, it is always best to deal with the original creditor, debt collectors see things in black and white.

 

Tthe original creditor has to take into untangible things like their own reputation. what's going to happen if prospective members are made aware of their tactics?

 

even common sense says that at the end of the day if you are medically unfit and unable to use the facilities you are paying for, enforcing the full 12 months contract would seem a little harsh.

 

A debt collector simply sees [you owe £xxx - pay us £xxx]

 

lets see what Virgin Active come up with and act from there

[Geordie08]

Hi All, sorry, first post today as I am having the same problem with the same companies (ARC and Virgin) Im going to follow your letter advice above but would be very interested to hear how you get on with things.

 

I too am ignoring ARC phone calls as I answered the first one and felt victimised and bullied and don't wish to repeat!

 

My case is different as I simply wished to cancel contract after 12 months, so I called them to do so and they said to write a letter, so I did and I too cancelled my direct debit (like the lady on the phone said I could) and 3 months later I get a letter from ARC. They say because I did not send my letter recorded delivery I have no proof that I sent it, hence I am liable for £335.

 

I work for a bank (I know - sorry!) so I cannot have CCJs against my name or I will lose my job. I am almost scared into paying them the money for this reason alone as I'd rather loose £350 than my job!

 

I have not sent them anything by recorded delivery, I have not used the gym since cancelling my membership and I did not receive any letters from them that they "claimed" to have sent me.... although I should point out that whilst they expected me to send my letter by recorded delivery, they did not do this themselves and hence do they have any proof that they actually sent letters to me.

 

Sorry to jump on the bandwaggon here, hope everything gets sorted out for you Rose Rose.

 

Regards

[Geordie08]

Also, as a last ditch hope - does the potal rule apply here as I sent the letter... (OK - so I'm grasping at straws - but Im sure I remember this from a 1st year university Law module!)

 

Thanks,

[spamheed]

make the company prove that the debt is legitimate, if you have a letter of cancellation, then it is as valid as their ascertation that they never received it.

 

it's amazing how much mail "goes astray" according to these companies, don't worry about CCJ's just yet, they have to take you to court and win to get one of those, you have proof that you cancelled the debt.

 

ask them for a copy of the original signed agreement and the notice of assignment, how do you know that these jokers are genuine? you don't so make them prove it. if they can't prove it, end of story.

[cayman]

Well I have ARC chasing me aswell! But honestly there's no reason to panick! I'm not worried in the slightest and they're asking for 500 pounds! I personally didn't break a leg- I got a new job that had gym membership included and so didn't want to keep paying for the Virgin Active one. I have answered ARC everytime they have wished to speak to me which is about 3 times. I have not felt bullied or intimidated! I have simply encouraged them to take legal action against me and insisted virgin's contract is not legally binding!

Basically, I've scoured the internet for cases of people actually getting taken to court because of a virgin membership and it seems there are none! I have a theory that the same principle as with the bank charges may well apply in this situation also: If one case goes to court and the court decides in favour of the consumer (us), then it could set what's known as a 'binding precedent'. Basically meaning that if in one case the court decided the conract wasn't legally binding, then all similar cases would have to follow suit and companies like Virgin Active who talk people into singing long contracts would be screwed because word would soon get around that their contracts are meaningless and need not be abided by!

Anyway, I'm not saying that the above is the case but I do strongly suspect it is. Otherwise they owuld have no reason to sell the debt or pay a debt collection agency like ARC- If the law was really on their side then would they not simply take the cheaper option and take you directly to court themselves!???

In any case, the essential point to note here is that, legally binding or not, you will not have a court judgement filed against you in your absence. Obviously, in order for a case to be put against you in the County court, you will need to be informed beforehand. That is why I have always maintainded that I will never give ARC or Virgin Active any of my concern or time or money until I recieve official correspondance from the County court itself. That, and only that, will be enough to make me concerned about this. And if were to come to that stage (which I really doubt it would) then you can pay them what they want and obviously once that's done the case will be dropped. Even in this situation you wouldn't need to pay them neccessarily. You'd be surprised but you can actually resume your gym membership at this stage- Yes, that's right! Even if they file a court case against you, if you agree to resume you membership and go back to making your monthly payments, they will call off the debt collectors and drop the case against you! And the reason for that is simply money. As long as they're getting their money, they're happy.

[m0jo]

Hi all first post, i signed up as this thread is exactly what is happening to me at the minute.

 

The last letter i sent should tell you where it went wrong and really i'm looking for any advice.

 

I spoke to Arc and they say they have began 'legal proceedings' should i be worried?

 

The internet is littered with people in similiar problems but i haven't found many with conclusions other than negotiating and paying out.

 

 

If I start a fresh this will give you a brief insight into the ongoing saga I find myself in.

It started innocently enough one day at the gym, I moved house in November 2006 which meant further mileage to access the gym; it made it uneconomical to get to and knowing there was no closer Virgin Active (VA) facility I passively asked after a session at the gym in October ‘when my membership would expire’ (being on the diamond membership I knew the contract could take potentially 12 months before it could be cancelled).

It took little over 10 minutes to check the database before the service staff confirmed I could cancel in May for June finish. I’d already cancelled my direct debit for October and I received a non payment notification letter.

I returned in May as promised and I was informed “I had just missed my April - 12 month contract rolling contract date and would have to pay for another year. I was needless to say livid at having being misinformed previously and complained as you would expect.

It was concluded that head office would confirm when my contract was due and because of my circumstances i.e. confusion, moving house, it was likely I would be legible for a so called ‘buyout’ option, so I waited to see what reply I got before taking further action.

I shortly received a letter stating my cancellation request had been received and I could cancel at the end of “November 2007” (this was to be the first of many frustrating standard letters of reply, where it would seem that only the ‘bold text’ required amending).

I replied to the letter saying that this was the third date I had been told and I wasn’t happy. I’d been paying for the gym since I moved house in November and not using it, I paid for 7 months extra of a membership I could have cancelled in October at no cost.

I got no reply to this letter and in June I cancelled my direct debit out of frustration.

June 4th, 5th I received two letters respectively telling me about my cancelled direct debit, to which I replied with a letter similar to my previous one explaining the situation.

It wasn’t until the 20th June I got a further letter again ‘standard’ with the edited parts in bold. It made no acknowledgement of either of my previous letters nor did it answer any of the questions I had asked. It mentioned a 50% buy out option and six months of my contract. I replied stating ‘I’d already paid 8 months extra (Nov06-Jun07) and I was reluctant to pay any further money.

I presumed after this letter the matter was closed and it wasn’t until the 20 September (3 months after) I heard from VA, I had just returned from my holiday so you can imagine my disappointment. I now found myself threatened with additional cost of collectors and interest even though I had co-operated and replied at the earliest opportunity possible to each of the correspondents.

I decided once and for all to resolve the matter and take the long haul visit to the VA branch in Derby itself. There I met Mr. Walker who was the general manager and the highest person in authority present. We sat down in the lobby to discuss my personal details which wasn’t very professional and very disconcerting.

I questioned why I had not received any response to my letters and pointed out that as a customer a personalised letter would have been much more appropriate in the given situation than the standard ones sent. I asked what exactly I owed on the account to which he replied six months. He argued that I had not responded to his letters and refused to now offer the 50% discount initially offered.

I had co-operated at every given opportunity and Mr. Walker was now being argumentative and I found his criticism very unconstructive when I had taken the time to visit the facility to resolve the issue in person.

I asked to see my personal file (which now after seeking legal advise over the whole situation I found I am entitled to under the Data Protection Act 1998 (c. 29)) I was refused out right, and Mr. Walker told me he ‘just didn’t have the time for me’. From a senior manager I didn’t expect this level of incompetence in customer care and I asked to speak to someone else who could help me resolve the problem. He explained he was the only one that could help. I then asked for the contact details of the VA group to which he replied “there isn’t one” I found this very hard to believe that a brand like Virgin Active with various facilities across England had no central HQ?

Maybe I misconstrued the Virgin homepage which states…

“In our customers' eyes, Virgin stands for value for money, quality, innovation, fun and a sense of competitive challenge. We deliver a quality service by empowering our employees and we facilitate and monitor customer feedback to continually improve the customer's experience…”

But having taken the time to visit the VA Derby facility I was still no better off than when I started and in fact was left feeling even worse after the whole experience. I refused to leave without any documentation of my visit; Mr. Walker refused to write on a piece of paper to confirm the outstanding debt insisting he would ‘mail’ this to me. Not in the least bit satisfied I was forced to accept this and was bullied into resubmitting my Direct Debit details without any real guarantee of how much was to be taken and when.

Furious with the outcome I rang the phone number on the headed paper 01908 546 600 to immediately express my concerns which just so happens to be the group number I’d asked Mr. Walker for previously.

I spoke to Becky who was an exception to the VA staff at Derby I’d previously dealt with. She seemed genuinely caring about the matter and agreed to liaise with Mr. Walker to reach an acceptable conclusion that would suit both parties.

Becky called me back as promised (end of October) and said that VA Derby was willing to consider the matter closed if I agreed to pay a further £48.00 (rounded figure). I reluctantly accepted, if this would finally close the ongoing issue now running into a year old, maybe it was worth it.

I tried all week 1st -5th November to speak with someone that could settle what had been agreed. I was told I needed to speak to Mr. Walker (which given the hostile treatment he showed me previously I wasn’t happy about) but nevertheless agreed. I reached his mailbox and left a message for him to return my call. The following day after hearing nothing I called again this time leaving a message with a staff member to call me back ASAP regarding my account closure. This happened all week each day I was promised someone would return my call but no one did.

So I sort legal guidance whom advised me that I’d have a strong case to claim all the money paid after November 2006, on the grounds my rolling contract was sold to me. To cut a long story short I didn’t want the hassle of going to small claims so I wrote an email stating that if know one called me back by the 20th November I would presume the matter had already been closed. Two weeks, I believed to be a reasonable time period for a company that prides themselves on customer service to call me back.

I’ve hear nothing until yesterday when a letter dated 03 October reached my doorstep. It offered an inflated £70.00 buy out option (£22 more than the previous agreement) if I paid within 10 working days. Not knowing the working day I can only assume that the gym is open 7 days a week and therefore this offer had already expired (date letter received 15.10.07).

I thought this may however have been due to the recent postal strikes so I checked the franking date. It was the 11th(?) the letter had been posted 8 days after, which even on next day delivery would only give me a day to settle my debt?

 

 

The letter also stated I now had 7 months left on my contract (I’d actually gained a month since previous letters).

So what now? Again I find myself in consultation for legal advice and after a brief phone call I have to state the following:

“I have given Virgin Active Limited my full co-operation in a matter that is in no fault of my own. Given that the issue has been (a) ongoing for over a year now (b) of recently been absorbing a lot of my domestic life; all future communications will be billed at the following rates:

Phone call (£1 per minute + the expense of the call)

Letter £15.00 per page

Email £15.00 per page”

I have also been advised to begin the process of filing a small claims action; however I am still hopeful a peaceful end can be met.

I finish by saying in October 2006 my intensions were only to cancel my membership until a facility closer had opened or I moved closer to a facility. I’d had to previous issues with Virgin Active; in fact the trainers were very friendly and resourceful, full of advice and always willing to help and the 4 years I’d been going to the gym were a pleasure.

I have Virgin Media telly (even virgin pop at one stage) yet for such a big company I can’t emphasise how disappointing this matter has been for me especially having tried so hard to resolve this matter myself.

If this does go to the courts I will be claiming for the full 8 months £319.60 (Nov06-June07) I’ve already paid without using the gym plus future communications at the given rates. At current as mentioned I will not pursue this matter in the courts, but please rethink the last offer.

[Ukbatman]

Hi,

Edited May 11, 2008 by Ukbatman

[m0jo]

Just had my Arc letter

 

standard as per

 

309.65 arrears due

549.35 total liability

 

10 days to pay blar blar blar.

 

Any advise, i still believe i am in the right and have tried to co-operate at every opportunity

[cayman]

It makes me sick to read this as you seem to just be good and honest people being taken for a ride by a corporate company that exercises no morals or principles, that will use any means including threats of courts and baylifts in order to intimitate you into paying them extortionate sums of money that you probably don't even owe them.

 

I can only re-emphasise the stance I have taken with them and that is that until I recieve an official letter, from the County Court, summoning me to a hearing I will not pay them anything.

 

My advice is to not waste any time on them, ignore them and their 'debt collectors' and their solicitors' letters and phone calls.

 

Cancel all direct debits and remember that if you do get summoned to court and it really is looking like you might lose out (which I severly doubt would happen as I genuinly do not believe that their "legally binding" contracts have ever been tested in court) then you can always think about paying them at that stage. If you were to be summoned to court and you were to pay them what they wanted before the court trial started then they would call off the court proceedings, because at the end of the day all they want is their money. So really you have absolutely nothing to lose until you get that official letter from the court itself.

 

To conclude, until you have had official documentation from the actual court itself, to confirm that they really are taking legal action, there is no need to respond to them or to even let it concern you or take up any of your time.

 

That's my advice on these people- Thanks for reading.

[cayman]

P.S. Mojo I think it's a great idea to follow this up with the Small Claims Court- In my eyes you shouldn't have paid them that 400 pounds or whatever it was, it's daylight robbery and you should try to get it back. As far as I know a claim in the small claims court is free isn't it?

[Ukbatman]

 

zzzzzzzzzzzzz

Edited May 11, 2008 by Ukbatman

[m0jo]

Thought i'd just post an update.

 

Fridays activity's

 

I spoke to Derby gym who advised me the case was being dealt with at head office so:

 

I called 0845 1304747 who were unable to help advising me to call 0845 1304747 where my account details were

 

so they transferred me to:

0845 1304747 Barbican to sort my details out where no manager was present (Gemma) and were unable to help I was informed to call

0871 9845886 Member Service Team as all debt payments that are written off are sent here anyway so they should be able to help

Call (1) to 0871 9845886 transferred to Derby spoke to Steff and am expecting a manager to call me back from Derby's facility STILL NOT HAD MY CALL BACK

Call (2) to 0871 9845886 transferred to Derby again, unable to progress any further than previously put through

Call (3) to 0871 9845886 Fabian informed me the manager Heidi Law was not present to speak too as he was not able to help resolve my case. Call ended with me being cut off

Call (4) to 0871 9845886 I now have her email address.

 

Rang Derby up again to speak to the accounts dept there within my various calls it was suggested they had the power to withdraw the proceeding with arc. But at Friday 7pm i was calling outside there working hours.

 

I have tried calling accounts at derby today (monday) at 9.30am and left a voicemail, 10.57am I was on hold for 10minutes, redialed through to reception where I have been advised knowone was in the office until 3.00pm.

 

Cant help but feel no one at virgin cares.

 

in october i agreed a £48 buyout a week later i get this in writing albeit now inflated to £68.

 

I reply with email (have a delivery report and read report) disputing the figure 10/10/07

 

I hear nothin until Friday 11/04/08 when i get this arc letter demanding (£300+) payment within 10 days.

 

My main question is when i rang Arc to explain i was still disputing this with Virgin they told me it was them i need to strike a deal with and they wanted the full (£300)

.

 

What should i write and tell them to buy more time than 10days? i cant afford to have a CCJ against my name as my mortgage renewal will probably be sent through the room if indeed i can find someone?

[Ukbatman]

Zzzzzzzzzzzz

Edited May 11, 2008 by Ukbatman

[m0jo]

I wrote to Arc saying

 

"

Further to your letter dated 09 April 2007, please be aware that I do not acknowledge the £309.65 debt to your company

 

On September 27, 2007, in an effort to end this situation I verbally accepted Sandra Harrisons Buy-Out option of £48.00, her letter (see attached) confirming this was dated 3rd, franked on the 11th and arrived on the 13th but it showed an inflated offer of £69.92.

 

 

I immediately wrote back to Sandra Harrison querying the inflated price and have as yet, had no reply. I assumed she had had finally agreed that I had cancelled my membership correctly and no further action from me was required. I am very concerned that you now inform me that you have passed this "debt" on to a credit reference agency without any contact or correspondence explaining your reasons.

 

From current information on the Web it appears that you will have received many legally worded replies to what seems like your regular use of credit agencies to harass ex-members into paying inflated charges so I will not bother you with this in my reply as yet but in an effort to end this situation I enclose my cheque for £48.00 as originally agreed with Sandra Harrison.

 

Please reply by return confirming your acceptance otherwise I will have no option but to refer this issue to my solicitor."

 

 

 

 

Arc returned my cheque stating the original offer of £69.92 has expired. I knew it had expired, it had when the letter arrived. (dated 3rd franked 11th - i have photo's to show this. it arrived on the 14th by which time the offer had expired.

 

TBH i dont mind paying £70 if it ends the hassle. But PLEASE has anyone have any advise seeing though my last letter was rejected.

 

Thanks in adance to anyone with information

[ronaldo10]

I have a similar situation to many of these posts. What i want to know is has anyone actually been issued with county court summons by virgin active, or Trevor Munn Solicitors, or is it all talk?

[copperkid]

:(First Posting.

I too have just fallen foul of Virgin & ARC & their 12 mth roll-over (lets not remind you its due) membership scheme. I was felled by rheumatoid arthritis and went in 13 months into my membership to tell them I was now severely disabled (quite obvious really). They (Sheffield Virgin) were very unhelpful, but told me I could suspend my membership until I 'felt better!' - this I did at the cost of 5 pounds per month for a whole year. I then decided they'd had enough 'free' money out of my disability allowance and cancelled it in January this year. Whoah - big mistake. Since Monday I have had 7 calls from ARC all with a degree of menace. Worst of all my 6 year old has been picking up the phone and being frightened by these monsters. Is there a way to stop the calls? Letters I can handle. My partner is telling me to pay the 389.55 as he doesn't want them coming round the house to take our stuff (is this likely?).

Just like other postees - I too feel very threatened, angry and irritated by these tactics and would like to expose Virgin for their disengenuous (can't spell) behaviour.

[Confused Girl]

Hi everyone! Thank God for this site, has helped me feel a bit better about things.

 

Firstly, can I say that I apologise for posting in this way (kinda hijacking someone else's thread) but I couldn't work out how to post my own thread - I think it's the stress of the unknown!!

 

I need some help and guidance from someone if at all possible...?

 

Something strange happened today..I missed a call on my mobile from ARC - I only know it was them because I googled the number and it gave me their details and this site. They never left a message for me so at the moment I have no idea why they called. They have only called once so far. Looking on this forum it seems that this is likely to be linked to a gym membership I had when I was in the UK.

 

My contract was due to run until May 2008, I wrote to the gym in the March giving them notice of my intention to cancel the membership but never heard back from them. I then made sure I paid the full membership until the end of May 2008 and then cancelled my direct debit accordingly. I have lived overseas since April 2008. Anyway, if the gym have sent letters demanding payment, I have not received them and if ARC have sent any, again I have had none of them...so what do I do...?

 

I can only imagine that there is a debt growing somewhere in the depths of ARCs filing cabinet that will eventually catch up with me - even though I don't actually owe any money!!! I have emailed La Fitness but heard nothing back and I have emailed ARC to ask why they telephoned me but again have heard nothing back. If I have had no letter, how can I pay or even query the debt..?

 

Has anyone got any advice they can give...? I'd be really grateful! I just don't want to find that I owe thousands in 5 years time if they finally send me a letter!!!

[Owley]

It seems that all the gyms use ARC as a debt collection agency. I am having exactly the same problems with Next Generation at the moment.

I joined up and then basically could not go to the gym due to health problems and never actually set foot in the place - in actual fact they banned me unless I had a Dr's letter. After 4 months of paying fees I decided to cancel but now they are trying the chase me for £227 (the excat amount they already had in the 4 months). I have provided medical proof and proof I already paid £227 to them but now ARC are doing the usual threats and the fictitious Trevor Munn solicitors letter thing.

 

I basically told them that they would not get one more penny from me and if they wanted to take to court then they could go ahead and knock themselves out. Ibn a court of law there would be no case to answer as the terms and conditions state 3 reasons why membership can be terminated early and one of these is illness or injury.

 

These compnaies and the debt collecters are just trying to bully us poor unsuspecting people into handing over money which we do not owe by using frightening tactics.

 

Good luck to all on here who is going through the same thing - stay strong and lets win the fight!

[Greendeco]

Owley I totally agree, I am being chased for £107 one month membership of £47 which I disputed and the gym did nothing to try and resolve, and £60 debt collection agency fees. I have tried 3 times to pay the £47 (even though I disputed it) and they keep returning my cheque. I have now given the dca two choices accept the £47 in full and final settlement or take me to court. This is so stressful, they are saying they are doing me a favour by only asking for £60 fees as the cancellation policy of the gym means I should be paying £100, I have pointed out this is a penalty and therefore not legally enforceable and quoted the law at them.

Just got home from a couple of days working away to find a notice left on my doormat, could this be a summons? We shall see!

[virginite]

Hi all

If I can be of any assistance, I will try and assist..

[virginite]

Sorry in the delay....

 

Just state to virgin that at the time of cancelling you direct debit you had completed the required number of months for completing the membership and you recieived all 12 months payment, I followed this up with a letter as per my terms and conditionsd of my membership.

 

Further to this the cancellation of my direct Debit on the correct date is construed as a secondary cancellation notice.

 

That should be the end of that one for you.

 

 

Hi everyone! Thank God for this site, has helped me feel a bit better about things.

 

Firstly, can I say that I apologise for posting in this way (kinda hijacking someone else's thread) but I couldn't work out how to post my own thread - I think it's the stress of the unknown!!

 

I need some help and guidance from someone if at all possible...?

 

Something strange happened today..I missed a call on my mobile from ARC - I only know it was them because I googled the number and it gave me their details and this site. They never left a message for me so at the moment I have no idea why they called. They have only called once so far. Looking on this forum it seems that this is likely to be linked to a gym membership I had when I was in the UK.

 

My contract was due to run until May 2008, I wrote to the gym in the March giving them notice of my intention to cancel the membership but never heard back from them. I then made sure I paid the full membership until the end of May 2008 and then cancelled my direct debit accordingly. I have lived overseas since April 2008. Anyway, if the gym have sent letters demanding payment, I have not received them and if ARC have sent any, again I have had none of them...so what do I do...?

 

I can only imagine that there is a debt growing somewhere in the depths of ARCs filing cabinet that will eventually catch up with me - even though I don't actually owe any money!!! I have emailed La Fitness but heard nothing back and I have emailed ARC to ask why they telephoned me but again have heard nothing back. If I have had no letter, how can I pay or even query the debt..?

 

Has anyone got any advice they can give...? I'd be really grateful! I just don't want to find that I owe thousands in 5 years time if they finally send me a letter!!!