Housing Benefit Fraud - Please help, very desparate

[Lorraine856]

This is my first post and I hope someone can help me. I signed on to JSA in December 2010 but had to sign off agian in February 2011 as I was going into hospital for major surgery on my stomach. The job centre applied for housing benefit for me so I thought that it would automatically be cancelled after I signed off. I have been living with my parents since the op and havent been home. It looks like I wil have to give up my home anyway (it is rented). I can't work as yet for the forseeabe future and I am now suffering depression.

 

I had a letter from the council regarding my housing benefit and I worte back explaining the situation as above. I recieved a letter saying I had to pay back an overpayment of £1107.72 but the letter also suggests that I may be subject to prosecution.

 

I can pay the money back as I haven't used it but prosecution would just be unbearable. I have thought about suicide and I have no doubt that this is all it would take. I couldn't stand the shame of it all or be able to go through the procedings. I could't cope with it.

 

Please can anyone tell me what is likely to happen. If I pay the money back immediately will it be in my favour. I had no intention to commit fraud but I guess they hear that everyday. I'm 47 and have never been in any trouble in my whole life.

 

Please help me if you can. I would be so grateful for any advice or help.

Thank you

[honeybee13]

Hello there, welcome to CAG.

 

Others with more knowledge than me will be along to advise you, but prosecution is not common. Don't beat yourself up over that just yet.

 

My best, HB

[Lorraine856]

Thank you for your welcome, Honeybee13. I want to beleive you about the criminal proceings but I am in such a state over it I can barely cncentrate on anything else.

 

Lorraine856

[Nystagmite]

The outcome will depend on things like whether you've done this before.

[rebel11]

Hi lorraine

 

Have to agree with Honeybee can't see them prosecuting you, if you are having difficulty dealing with the matter, contact you local CAB centre and they can help you deal with the matter.

[Lorraine856]

No......I have never done anything like this before.

 

L

 

Thak you Rebel11. I'll call CAB tomorrow. Does anyone think it's worth calling the council and explaining the situation again in person?

[driving me crazy]

it seems to be a genuine mistake, and perhaps a doctors letter to verify you have been for a operation

and also suffer depression will help you ,the council will probably accept full repayment,or even instalments i think the genuine people who claim benefits seem to be targated more then the fraudsters ,do not worry as it will probably be the end of the matter if arrangements to pay back are made hope this helps

 

the council dont know what they are doing from one day to the next ,i think it is a total waste of time telephoning them

[leemack]

What were you living on at the time you weren't receiving JSA - for instance ESA? Were you still liable for rent at your property and if so how has this been paid? How long have you not been living at your property?

[Lorraine856]

Hello Leemack, thank you fro replying. I was self employed before I started claiming JSA. My contracts ran out and I lived on my savings until they were depleted then I had no choice but to sign on. I have always paid my own rent until that time and I have never been in arrears.

 

I got poorly between Christmas and in Feb had to have an operation on my stomach. I haven't lived a my house since February when I went into hospital. I am living at my parents to convalece but will be unable to find a job for a while yet.

 

I hope this helps with your questions.

L

[kingfisher01]

It is highly unlikely that you will be prosecuted for this, as it does appear to be their error, and as you have still got the money, well that's a massive plus.......It's all easy for us to say "don't worry", but were all different. probably wasting time trying the CAB most of them are booked up for weeks, and getting them on the phone seems to take forever. You really will be just fine over this.Hope you come back soon,to tell us some good news.....Best wishes

[Lorraine856]

Kingfisher, thank you so much for your reply. I'm going to make arrangements to pay the full amount back tomorrow without delay. I wsh I'd never signed on in the first place. I never will again. I hope everyone is right about them not prosecuting, I really am scared stiff.

[jadeybags]

The letter you got with the over payment is pretty standard. But if there was somewhere to put a bet on, my money would go on you NOT being prosecuted, for a few reasons too.

You still have the money, I can just see them in court now "this person commited benefit fraud for financial gain" um yes, so why is it they haven't spent it yet, apart from the fact they had more important things to worry about at the time, like major surgery, the money is still there" It just wont happen.

Oh & also because of the amount, without the above scenario, anything less than 2k isn't actually in the tax payers interest to go through court for. It's not cheap prosecuting people.

And then you have the real trump card, you're going to pay it back in one go, tomorrow. Take someone to court with the above circumstances, when they dont even owe it anymore anyway? It's just not going to happen, in my opinon.

No I am not an expert, but that's all just common sense. When you're on the outside looking in.

I paid them back in one go, I didn't still have the money, but I took out a loan, long story. But the interviewer told me at the time of the Interview under caution that the fact I had paid them back DID go in my favour. Even if it's not them that makes the decision.

So stop worrying, ring them tomorrow, pay them back, then you may well even have to go for an IUC. That's not unusual still, but they have procedures to follow (over payments over 500 usually warrant an IUC so my council said, & the solicitor I spoke to) & they have boxes to tick that's all.

Your over payment is only slightly less than mine, the compliance officer told me in the grand scheme of things that isn't an amazing amount! It is to us, but not to them.

x

[leemack]

There are two issues:

 

Firstly, you can get housing benefit while not on JSA, you just need to show how you were supporting yourself at the time - have your parents been giving you money or just providing room board and care? If so, before paying any money back, appeal the overpayment and provide details of how and why you were being supported, providing a monetary value for the board you were receiving, include a letter from your parents confirming this. You would have been entitled to ESA, and can in fact claim for three moths backdated if you get a backdated med cert from your doctor saying you're unable to work. Any period you were in hospital, you were being supported by the hospital and had no income. Also if you were still living off some savings that still counts towards entitlement to HB.

 

Secindly, you can be away from your rented property for 13 weeks for any reason and still claim housing benefit, then in addition you can be absent for up to 52 weeks on certain conditions, and I think 'receiving doctor approved care' is one of them - you would just then need a letter from a doctor to confirm he advised you to convalesce and be card for (might work - never tried it) - but in any case the 13 weeks holds.

 

Of course, you can certainly decide to just pay them, but in my opinion, ou have broken no benefit laws and have not fraudulently claimed and should appeal.

 

Contrary to what people believe, you don't have to have a benefit claim or be working to claim HB, and certainly for at least 13 weeks you were entitled to HB. If you choose to appeal we can help on what to write in your appeal letter.

[Lorraine856]

OMG you are all so fabulous. Thank you so much Jadeybags for your reassurance. It's difficult to see things from the outside in when all you can see is the worst case scenario. And Leemack, thank you for your detailed reply - I didn't know any of that. The letter I have says "you have overpaid housing benefit of £1107.72 due to Job Seekers Allowance Ceasing. I thought you had to be claiming JSA to claim housing benefit and because I didn't make the claim in person - it was done through the Job centre, I assumed it would automatically cease too. This has all made me feel terrible - like a criminal. I can't even think straight about it.

Thank you again for your brilliant replies. x

[jadeybags]

You definitely dont have to be on any other benefits to claim housing benefit. That seems to a common missundertanding. And yep, in your case will actually make a difference to the over payment amount, if any. And you can be away from home for 13 weeks. I still say dont spend it, pay them off, but only once you know for sure what the right over payment is, if any.

No idea personally how you appeal the amount, I didn't do that. But as has been said, people on here know how.

But derfinitely get those awful thoughts of prosecution out your head. I hate those letters they send out, because they go to everyone, no matter what situation. Not their fault I know, time is money, but so unfair.

[sillygirl1]

Housing Benefit isn't dependent upon JSA, I got Housing Benefit immediately I became redundant earlier this year. I have only just been getting JSA.

 

Sounds like they sent a bog standard letter.

 

As you haven't touched the money then they would look rather silly going to court.

 

Keep us posted as to what is happening and get well soon.

[Lorraine856]

I'm just going to pay it back - in the hope that it will appease them and make it all go away. I don't have the strength to appeal and I don't want to have anything more to do with the benefits system after this. It's all a huge worry. This is the first time I have made a claim for anything and this whole experience has scared me so much.

[kingfisher01]

I'm sure i speak for everybody one here, when i say it's a pleasure to be of help. You initially sounded so worried, but see, doesn't the world seem a better place than it did just a short while ago....FEAR ENDS WHERE FAITH BEGINS.....I'd like to say good luck for tomorrow, but you know what, you wont need any.....Best wishes.

[Lorraine856]

Thank you Sillygirl1, for your good wishes and reassurance. I will defintely let everyone know what happens as you ahve all been good enough to reply.

 

Lx

 

Kingfisher, your reply made me cry. I came here looking for help and advice and got it in bucketloads. I'm really so grateful. xx

[jadeybags]

 

Blimey you sound like me.

 

I had people telling me I should appeal as it's an official error, I had people telling me because it's housing benefit & not DWP, they will always win, in the end I paid them off & cancelled my claim toot sweet.

 

I am entitled to it still. Probably not much. But I would still rather budget & pay my own rent now than claim off them.

But I still have the urge to say to you fight it!! Hypocritically. But as others say, claim what you're entitled to.

[Lorraine856]

I know what you mean Jadeybags but I will just be grateful if they accept the money back and let me go without any further incident. I've got enough to worry about with my health and immediate future without the fear and shame of prosecution. I just wouldn't cope with it. It was an oversight through not having the right information - i.e. thinking that the job centre would cancel the Housing benefit claim - and having my life turned upside down because I got sick. They've made me feel like a criminal - they're really scary.

[kingfisher01]

Life ends when you stop dreaming

Hope ends when you stop believing

Love ends when you stop caring

Friendship ends when you stop sharing...............................................................................................................That's it wheres the kleenex!!!

[jadeybags]

Ahhh I like that. Not the Kleenex bit though!

[leemack]

I must've put in over a hundred housing benefit appeals regarding overpayments as a caseworker, I can't remember any where the overpayment wasn't either reduced of completely wiped out. They most certainly don't always win.

 

And I agree, I would advise to fight, writing a letter stating she wishes to appeal the overpayment and giving the reasons why. But only the OP can make that decision, it sounds as if she's lucky enough to be able to pay the money back - even though she's entitled to it.

 

Many people out there in a similar position don't have the luxury of being able to pay back benefit they're entitled to and will have no choice but to appeal.

[jadeybags]

Able to prove that you shouldn't have known you were being over paid, I think was the term used. My only excuse was not reading award letters because as long as my rent was paid, I never worried.

 

I didn't expect them to accept that excuse. If that was good enough, then award letters wouldn't be sent out, they would just tell you over the phone? I accepted that I had received what I shouldn't have. And it needed to be paid back.

 

I didn't have the money to pay it back, but at the time I couldn't afford the 100 a month they wanted (I had cancelled the benefit so it wasn't like they could take it out that) but I could afford 30 a month for a loan that covered it.

What would you have done? Not meaning you specifically, just anyone in general really.

 

edit: Not blaming them by the way, I found out after that CAB could have negotiated with them a lower amount I could afford, (my fault for not finding that out) But just another reason I think you need to be on the ball with all the rules. And if you're not, it's only a matter of time before you end up here.