Leeds Mercantile court 4th October 2007

[j.barton1]

No problem, youre very welcome.

He shouldnt have to speak in a case management conference but with the stay hearing he might have to but he shouldnt worry too much, its quite informal and the judges and staff in leeds are very helpful.

Regarding the stay, if the stay is requested chances are it will be granted IF it has been applied for properly. We have to show up, the last one i went to some claimants didnt show and the banks could be awarded costs...big time costs....the case management forms do take a while to sink in.....i've sent in 3 now and am just getting the hang of them, read through the questions with the answers and it should be okay...see this... http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/mercantile-court-cases-stays/96212-case-management-info-sheet.html might answer a few of your questions.

Anything you need feel free to ask

Jenny

[elgincroft]

Thanks Jenny

 

Thats so scary cos I really did believe it was cancelled and he wouldnt have shown up if I didnt get a hunch something was wrong! I saw they had written £5000 costs on their case management letter and I nearly wet myself cos we're having a baby!!!! I dont know what he is going to tomorrow now then - it says on the letter from the courts it is a hearing. but i know they want a stay. I dont know what the original terms and conditions of his bank account stated for costs for going over drawn but they were really high for each occasion. I think he wishes we hadnt started this now - if he loses will they make us pay £5000?

[j.barton1]

Thanks Jenny

 

Thats so scary cos I really did believe it was cancelled and he wouldnt have shown up if I didnt get a hunch something was wrong! I saw they had written £5000 costs on their case management letter and I nearly wet myself cos we're having a baby!!!! I dont know what he is going to tomorrow now then - it says on the letter from the courts it is a hearing. but i know they want a stay. I dont know what the original terms and conditions of his bank account stated for costs for going over drawn but they were really high for each occasion. I think he wishes we hadnt started this now - if he loses will they make us pay £5000?

No Hun, they're trying to scare you, they can't make you pay this if they lose...same thing was on my cmsheet...its just another scare tactic by the bank. Don't worry, it'll be over soon. I dont really know what'll happen tomorrow.....the stay hearings are quite new.

 

Jenny x

[elgincroft]

Thanks

 

He has gone for a bath to think it all over. I wish we had the original of his cm sheet, but we had to post it quickly. his dad faxed it too. stupid bank. theyve been paying out everyone else beofre this test case stuff came up. they should have said no new claims will be processed until after this, but existing ones should be allowed to go ahead. oh i'm only saying that cos its us.

 

 

The annoying thing is that before we bought our house, he had to get a loan to cover the exact amount we are claiming back (which is how much his overdraft was - only because of the charges!) The money would have come in very handy for the baby. I take it they arent settling at the last minute anymore with this stay stuff!

[j.barton1]

Some cases are still getting settled...just probably not us!! I've had this case since Jan,i had a cmc in June but A&L didnt show...i thought i would have won but the judge asked for another cmc...unfortunatley in the meantime the stay crap happened...so i guess if the judge allows the stay it'll be another 6 months for us....if the judge allows it?

[elgincroft]

well if it happens in 6 months i will be due then, so I can turn up too! that would be a good story, going into labour whilst taking hsbc to court! as long as we dont end up having to pay costs I can cope with this. thanks for your help. my partner and i had visions of him standing in a dock giving evidence!!!

[jansus]

jenny found this - looks like might be to do with costs - found this

 

 

Join Date: Jun 2006

Posts: 845

 

 

Re: nbart v citi cards

NBART post from someone elses thread:

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by nbart

I attended court today for a hearing that had been set aside from July. Citis' representative from a local firm of solicitors turned up late and was only given the court bundle citi was to rely on, as I was, this morning, one hour before the case was due.

 

The court bundle was prepared by Eversheds LLP, 1 Callaghan Square, Cardiff a firm of solicitors, head office London.

 

Having only had a few minutes to look through the bundle I recognise several pages that appear to have been used by Citi's internal solicitors and as such contained several inaccuracies. Are they employing different tactics? The bundle contains a skeleton argument of 14 pages, witness statement from John Allan Jones, oft report, case law Phillips v attorney general of Hong Kong, Potter v Citi, Dunlop v Newgarage

 

Pre the hearing I talked to the solicitor who told me he had not received my court bundle as apparently Citi hadn't received it. I produced a Royal Mail tracking receipt to show him that my bundle had been received and signed for at the Salford office. To cut down on paperwork for my bundle I submitted case laws, Government early day motion, oft full report, Dunlop v Newgarage, Murray v Leisureplay, UTCCR 1999, UCTA 1977, SOGA 1982, and Matnamara statement on cd with relevant passages in my evidence relating to the disc for the full reports. I did this as both times I have been to court the judges have had laptops. This obviosly would be up to the judge to accept but it does save enormous amounts of printing.

 

Immediately we saw the Judge, a deputy district judge, she informed us that she was under the impression that all such cases, regardless of them being for credit card claims, were to be stayed, but she wanted to confirm this from the district judge. She ajourned for 20 minuits to confirm. Meanwhile Citis' solicitor contacted Eversheds to confirm whether they wished to proceed today, as I had stated that I wished to proceed, they also said they wanted to procced today.

 

On returning to the judge she told us that although both parties wished to proceed she was staying the case. She quoted an order from Civil Judge Hume QC case 7QT4849 at Winchester c/c who gave his reason as to avoid large cost orders against the claimants if they lost. This wouldn't happen in this case as it was through small claims track. All the cases within the Carlisle district are all being stayed.

 

I hope this information will be helpful to other claimants.

[j.barton1]

well if it happens in 6 months i will be due then, so I can turn up too! that would be a good story, going into labour whilst taking hsbc to court! as long as we dont end up having to pay costs I can cope with this. thanks for your help. my partner and i had visions of him standing in a dock giving evidence!!!

Its ok hun...c u tomorrow!!

[j.barton1]

jenny found this - looks like might be to do with costs - found this

 

 

Join Date: Jun 2006

Posts: 845

 

 

Re: nbart v citi cards

NBART post from someone elses thread:

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by nbart

I attended court today for a hearing that had been set aside from July. Citis' representative from a local firm of solicitors turned up late and was only given the court bundle citi was to rely on, as I was, this morning, one hour before the case was due.

 

The court bundle was prepared by Eversheds LLP, 1 Callaghan Square, Cardiff a firm of solicitors, head office London.

 

Having only had a few minutes to look through the bundle I recognise several pages that appear to have been used by Citi's internal solicitors and as such contained several inaccuracies. Are they employing different tactics? The bundle contains a skeleton argument of 14 pages, witness statement from John Allan Jones, oft report, case law Phillips v attorney general of Hong Kong, Potter v Citi, Dunlop v Newgarage

 

Pre the hearing I talked to the solicitor who told me he had not received my court bundle as apparently Citi hadn't received it. I produced a Royal Mail tracking receipt to show him that my bundle had been received and signed for at the Salford office. To cut down on paperwork for my bundle I submitted case laws, Government early day motion, oft full report, Dunlop v Newgarage, Murray v Leisureplay, UTCCR 1999, UCTA 1977, SOGA 1982, and Matnamara statement on cd with relevant passages in my evidence relating to the disc for the full reports. I did this as both times I have been to court the judges have had laptops. This obviosly would be up to the judge to accept but it does save enormous amounts of printing.

 

Immediately we saw the Judge, a deputy district judge, she informed us that she was under the impression that all such cases, regardless of them being for credit card claims, were to be stayed, but she wanted to confirm this from the district judge. She ajourned for 20 minuits to confirm. Meanwhile Citis' solicitor contacted Eversheds to confirm whether they wished to proceed today, as I had stated that I wished to proceed, they also said they wanted to procced today.

 

On returning to the judge she told us that although both parties wished to proceed she was staying the case. She quoted an order from Civil Judge Hume QC case 7QT4849 at Winchester c/c who gave his reason as to avoid large cost orders against the claimants if they lost. This wouldn't happen in this case as it was through small claims track. All the cases within the Carlisle district are all being stayed.

 

I hope this information will be helpful to other claimants.

 

 

thanks Jan, as always u are there with the good info, looks like a costs issue doesnt it, i might be able to find out abit tomorrow if its mentioned.

Again thanks for the help!! xxx

[threadworm]

see you tomorrow jenny - i'm 30, 6ft with a beard - say hello if you spot me....

[j.barton1]

Will do!! There shouldnt be too many of us there so we should be able to chat.

 

XX

[j.barton1]

Gonna go to bed now...have an early night...might be a long day tomorrow!!

[scoobz]

GOOD LUCK TOMOZ EVERYONE, I'LL BE THINKING OF YOU ALL!

Jen, Give Wraggies some stick (if they decide to turn up)!

Scoobz

[j.barton1]

hahaha ta hun, IF they show i'll be ready for them!! I'm full of cold and sleep deprived so if they start!!!they'll be sorry!! hahaha

 

Jen xx

[patrickq1]

good luck

patrickq1

[jansus]

Thinking of you

 

Jan

[j.barton1]

Hiya all, well...they did turn up.

Everyone got a stay...every single one. The judge ordered the stay on mine cos the a&l solicitor basically said that after the outcome of the test case they will settle my case...he confirmed are you sure about that and the sol said yes!! I asked for the stay not to be granted on the grounds that A&L were not a party to the test case and i would have got it if they hadnt said that. Apparently no bank has said that they will pay out till he said it!! I bet he gets a telling off when he gets back LOL

Apart from that..pretty straight forward..the solicitors didnt know their ar** from their elbow and got one sol to speak for all!! about 6 of us stood up and voiced our objections but to no avail. They kept my objection seperate to the others cos of the points i mentioned but once he had said he'll settle the judges hands were tied. All in all a good day...another long one though..i'm full of cold and went through a pack of tissues but a good day...whats another few months?

xxx

[jansus]

Hi

 

Really sorry you will have to wait for your money but at least you know its on the way! So well done .

 

Speak again tomorrow - I bet if you are full of cold you just want a rest tonight.

 

At least you have the judge as witness to what they said! cant wish for more than that.

 

Jan

[j.barton1]

Hi Jan, Thanks. Its a shame i've got to wait but like you said, he promised he'll pay me after the test case....i cant argue with that with a + 6 yr claim! Limitations werent even mentioned! To be honest i dont even think he had any of my case details or anyone elses!

jenny x

[jansus]

Just a shame that you have had to waste so much time and effort for them to tell you that.

 

As a shareholder I should be very cross they are wasting their money STILL after all this time by sending representatives to these cases when they are going to pay anyway:evil: They may accuse their customers of bad housekeeping . Personally I dont think much of theirs:D

 

I wonder if it will show in their accounts next year how much they paid to Wragges - just to use delaying tactics:rolleyes:

 

By the way - although your case is stayed - is the 8%S69 interest still accruing do you think?

 

Jan:)

[j.barton1]

Yep, I can still add up the interest according to the judge, also if the test case is dropped or the fsa lift the waiver i can apply for a lift. My interest is about £5 a week so thats good, also after the test case the judge is going to discuss what costs are to be awarded so i think i'll be looking at about £4,500 ish...hopefully xx

[jansus]

 

 

 

well you took on the giants and won - so every cloud has a silver lining:D

[j.barton1]

Awww ta hun...although i have no cash...it does feel like a win!!

[AndyGFLees]

Well I had my little say in Court on 4th October, along with some others, and frankly I was glad to get it out of the way. I spent a lot of time preparing for it so I thought that I might as well give it as much as I could. However, in my opinion it seemed that there was very little that could be said to change Judge Kayes' mind. I think that it was a matter of starting from a point where he had already decided to grant the stays and we could only try and argue that they shouldn't go ahead.

 

For anyone else reading this in preparation for another directions hearing (with stays already applied for) the information in http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/16950-stay-here-application-grounds.html are probably the only thing that it will be worth spending your time on customising and memorising.

 

It is a bit pessimistic I suppose but with the test case so close I think it likely that more and more stays will be granted.

[j.barton1]

I agree his mind was made up....you did put your case across very well though...i think it wouldnt have been too bad if everyone hadnt "jumped on the bandwagon" though. When only 5 of us objected at first then everyone followed suit i think thats when it went downhill!! Never mind...roll on january !!

Jenny