Argos- can anybody help?!!

[meeycha]

I bought a sofa from Argos last june, it is a 3 seater however the middle has collapsed (though its not physically broken).

All the stuffing has slipped lower down than the wood making it impossible to sit in the middle,because of this my 3 seater is now a 2 seater!!

I called Argos out and they sent a man from an independent company.

The man said he could see exactly what the problem was and he copuld fix the problem.

He however had to go back to Argos with his findings.

They called me and said as the sofa is not broken there is no problem to answer and that they will help no further. I argued that if it was fine then why did the gentleman say he could fix it??!

They are just not interested.

I have a new baby and cant afford another sofa.

Can anyone advise me of what to do next??

[rosiecotton]

You would expect a sofa to last longer than 9 months!

 

I am assuming that you have just used the sofa in the normal way and haven't been having furniture-jumping contests etc?

 

Therefore your claim is that the sofa does not comply with the terms of the Sale of Goods Act as it is not of satisfactory quality or fit for normal purposes. Argos are liable to you under this Act and in the first instance they should provide you with a satisfactory repair or a replacement (whichever is easiest for them).

 

I would write to Argos (there are template letters on this site, I believe, or there are some on the Consumer Direct website Consumer Direct) giving as much detail as possible about the sofa, when and where it was bought, when it went wrong, details of the faults, and state that it does not comply with the terms of the Sale of Goods Act as it is not of satisfactory quality or fit for all normal purposes, therefore you are claiming a repair or replacement by [give them a reasonable date].

 

How did you pay for the sofa and how much did it cost?

[meeycha]

I paid £800.00 by card it was on there website. I know its not a fortune but you still expect it to be usable.

No never had any furniture jumping contests but i was pregnant up until 4 months go maybe thats the problem

[demon_x_slash]

Was it a debit card, or a credit card? If a credit card, then your card provider is jointly liable with Argos.

[meeycha]

Unfortunately it was a debit card

[rosiecotton]

I'm not 100% sure if there are template letters on this site. Thought there were but I can't find them if there are! Maybe someone else can correct me. I also actually had a look at the Consumer Direct ones but I wasn't that impressed :o

 

Try having a look here: Sale of Goods Letter - Dorset For You

 

Bear in mind that you will be going for the repair/replacement angle, as you won't legally be able to reject the sofa at this time.

[meeycha]

Thankyou i will send that letter off to them ASAP

[wobbles]

I have just sent the letter to them too

I bought 2 leather sofas from them in june 2004, they were delivered approx 6-8 weeks later, the same thing has ahppened with my sofas they have sunk (but on one side) so now my 2 seater is a 1 seater and my 3 seater is also a 1 seater becasue if you sit in the middle of it you fall down the left hand side.

 

keep updating your progress please and we can help each other

[kabukiman]

Unfortunately it was a debit card

 

 

Some debit cards with visa do offer extra protection, look in terms and conditions or just phone them up.

[jansus]

just a thought in case they drag things out make sure you take lots of digital dated photos to back your claims up - and to send to trading standards if necessary.

 

j

[wobbles]

Hi Meeycha

 

Just wondering whether Argos replied to your letter?

[delilah 9]

Hi, the same thing happened to my leather sofa brought from argosin 2005. Had someone come to look at it and report back to argos with the problems found. I am waiting for a new one to be delivered. That was back in Dec of last year.

 

I have had 2 calls to arrange a delivery of the new one but when I called them back no-one seems to know anything about it. I used the 2 years interest free payments on their card to purchase it originally. May call them again and if I get no luck ask for a refund. The item is £100 cheaper now and I was told I would get this back when the new one is delivered.

[BankFodder]

Hi, the same thing happened to my leather sofa brought from argosin 2005. Had someone come to look at it and report back to argos with the problems found. I am waiting for a new one to be delivered. That was back in Dec of last year.

 

I have had 2 calls to arrange a delivery of the new one but when I called them back no-one seems to know anything about it. I used the 2 years interest free payments on their card to purchase it originally. May call them again and if I get no luck ask for a refund. The item is £100 cheaper now and I was told I would get this back when the new one is delivered.

 

I bought a sofa from Argos last june, it is a 3 seater however the middle has collapsed (though its not physically broken).

All the stuffing has slipped lower down than the wood making it impossible to sit in the middle,because of this my 3 seater is now a 2 seater!!

I called Argos out and they sent a man from an independent company.

The man said he could see exactly what the problem was and he copuld fix the problem.

He however had to go back to Argos with his findings.

They called me and said as the sofa is not broken there is no problem to answer and that they will help no further. I argued that if it was fine then why did the gentleman say he could fix it??!

They are just not interested.

I have a new baby and cant afford another sofa.

Can anyone advise me of what to do next??

 

I have just sent the letter to them too

I bought 2 leather sofas from them in june 2004, they were delivered approx 6-8 weeks later, the same thing has ahppened with my sofas they have sunk (but on one side) so now my 2 seater is a 1 seater and my 3 seater is also a 1 seater becasue if you sit in the middle of it you fall down the left hand side.

 

keep updating your progress please and we can help each other :grin:

 

You could benefit enormously from cooperating with each other.

I suggest that you contact each other by pm and then by email and exchange photos of the sofas as well as statements.

 

Statements should include information as to when the sofa was bought and where, its construction and the kind of use to which it has been put.

 

Try as fully as possible to describe the damage and if possible try to photograph the damage by lifting up the fabric if necessary.

 

If you can show that three sofas have broken in the same way it will be very difficult for Argo to say that there is not some inherent defect in the construction or design.

 

I think that you should start dealing with Argos by means of collective letters which you can agree by means of email. Don't let Argos divide you. If you have to litigate then I would suggest that you try and bring the claim in the same court - over the counter and include a note to the judge that although this is not group litigation, the issues are the same and that it would be beneficial to all parties - including the defendant if the cases were heard on the same day.

If any of you have to travel to the court then put Argos on notice in your LBA that you will be claiming your reasonable costs of travel.

Argos will benefit enormously from only having to instruct one lawyer on one day.

Don't let Argos divide you for any reason. - They may use data Protection etc as an excuse. It would all be an excuse.

 

As with most consumer problems, I advise you to take control of the problem. Set your timescales and stick to them. Don't get caught up in any useless correspondence.

Send one letter for all three with photos and statements. Give !4 days. Then send another letter giving 14 days before you send them The Good News.

Don't negotiate. Decide what you want and stick to it.

 

Personally I would reject the contract to the extent that I would insist on a replacement - even if one of you has had the sofa for a year.

If you consent to a repair, then the sofa will be gone for at least a few weeks and you will be sitting on the floor. Consenting to a repair without a temporary replacement would not be a pragmatic solution.

 

Fabrics wear out or can develop faults but sofa structures have to last the reasonably intended life of the sofa at 100% effectiveness. If they suddenly break then the sofa is suddenly useless.

I realise that Argos might be entitled to have some allowance made for a year's use of their sofa but frankly I would push this one to its limit. I would expect Argos to back down and I wouldn't expect a judge to be very pleased - when he found that he was dealing with three similar but independent cases.

 

If Argos forced you to start a claim then I would bring in the press. i am sure that local press in all three areas would be very interested in this story.

We don't have templates for this kind of thing on the site.

We found that these consumer problems are so divers that it was scarcely possible and in any event we are so occupied with bank charges that we don't have the resources.

 

When the bank charges issue is resolved we will be able to develop a more comprehensive general consumer resource.

[rosiecotton]

Personally I would reject the contract to the extent that I would insist on a replacement - even if one of you has had the sofa for a year.

If you consent to a repair, then the sofa will be gone for at least a few weeks and you will be sitting on the floor. Consenting to a repair without a temporary replacement would not be a pragmatic solution.

 

Do bear in mind though that legally you cannot insist upon a repair if a replacement would be disproportionate to the trader.

 

Any repair they do offer, however, must be done within a reasonable time and without causing you significant inconvenience. It should also put the sofa back into the condition that you would expect it to be in, so should not be a patch-up job.

[BankFodder]

Do bear in mind though that legally you cannot insist upon a repair if a replacement would be disproportionate to the trader.

Could you let me know the legal basis for this please.

[rosiecotton]

Of course.

 

Part 5a of the Regulations amending the Sale of Goods Act 1979 (incorporated as Section 48B):

 

 

48B.

(1) If section 48A above applies, the buyer may require the seller—

(a) to repair the goods, or

(b) to replace the goods.

(2) If the buyer requires the seller to repair or replace the goods, the seller must—

(a) repair or, as the case may be, replace the goods within a reasonable time but without causing significant inconvenience to the buyer;

(b) bear any necessary costs incurred in doing so (including in particular the cost of any labour, materials or postage).

(3) The buyer must not require the seller to repair or, as the case may be, replace the goods if that remedy is—

(a) impossible, or

(b) disproportionate in comparison to the other of those remedies, or

© disproportionate in comparison to an appropriate reduction in the purchase price under paragraph (a), or rescission under paragraph (b), of section 48C(1) below.

(4) One remedy is disproportionate in comparison to the other if the one imposes costs on the seller which, in comparison to those imposed on him by the other, are unreasonable, taking into account—

(a) the value which the goods would have if they conformed to the contract of sale,

(b) the significance of the lack of conformity, and

© whether the other remedy could be effected without significant inconvenience to the buyer.

(5) Any question as to what is a reasonable time or significant inconvenience is to be determined by reference to—

(a) the nature of the goods, and

(b) the purpose for which the goods were acquired. .

 

If a repair would be reasonable and possible, and replacement would be more expensive to provide, then the trader would be entitled to offer a repair.

 

I'm not an expert on upholstery so cannot comment on whether a repair in this case would be possible, however any repair carried out must - as I said before - be done within a reasonable time, without causing significant inconvenience and put the goods back into the condition they should be in. If this is not possible, replacement or rescission can be looked at.

[BankFodder]

Thanks. I hadn't seen that before.

 

I think that it is poorly expressed as it appears on its face to give the benefit off disproportionality to the trader.

 

In fact a closer reading shows that the inserted section is more balanced than that and in fact it seeks to find a balance of disproportionality.

 

 

 

It weighs the inconvenience to the seller of providing a particular remedy against the inconvenience which might be experienced by the purchaser were he not to receive that particular remedy.

 

I think that in the case of a sofa supplied by a major national mass market supplier, the inconvenience to them of having to supply a replacement is far outweighed by the inconvenience which would have to be endured by a family who were obliged to sit on the floor throughout the period of repairs - not to mention being required to take time off to wait in for the pick up and re-delivery.

 

In fact, I can't understand Argos at all. It must be far less inconvenient to them to supply a replacement rather than organise a repair. After all they are not in the repair business.

 

If the customer has to make an accommodation with Argos then I would have thought that the loss of the £100 cash payment reflecting the fall in price might be satisfactory to both parties and I expect that it would satisfy the judge.

 

It is a shame that these laws and people's interpretation of these laws are not couched (sic) in a way which is supportive of a positive consumer culture.

If a re-emergence of the culture of the Consumer Right is to occur then people will need to construct their language accordingly: the language carries the concept.

[rosiecotton]

I'm not in the business and don't know much about costs, but if there is serious structural damage I would also be surprised that it would be cheaper to repair than replace.

 

Once again "significant inconvenience" isn't defined in the law, the legislation is by its nature quite woolly and open to interpretation. Would two weeks without a sofa cause significant inconvenience? If it's the family's only suite, I would suggest so, but ultimately it would be down to a judge and I've seen cases like this go both ways.

[wobbles]

quick update I sent the letter to Argos on 10th April, asking them to reply within 14 days. not heard nothing from them yet. Thank you Bankfodder and rosiecotton for the advice, I think its a good idea if we all work together as bankfodder says

[wobbles]

Just had a telephone call from argos, I have to get an independant report on the sofas, and if it proves that they are faulty they will refund or replace the sofas and pay for the report.

 

Address to send report to:

Customer relations department Argos Direct

Acton Gate

Stafford

ST18 9AR

[delilah 9]

I have just called them and been told to I have to choose another sofa as the one I have can't be replaced because it's out of stock. Looking on the site just now.

[wobbles]

they dont have the ones i bought at all in the catalouge anymore so I will probably be told to choose another one as well.

 

Good luck

[delilah 9]

Well, I called again because I couldn't find anything I like and was told that they have been trying to call me with regards to delivery date of the new one?? Because they have been unable to get me by phone (they have my mobile number too) they sent a letter on the 17th April which has never materialised. I have a delivery booked now for this Thursday. Will keep you informed.

[delilah 9]

Well I have my new sofas, they replaced them all even though only the large one was faulty. Glad the did as they are a slightly different colour and grain texture. They also look as though they have improved the design, seems to be more padding on the seats. Am well pleased.

[jampot]

Did anyone get aknowledgement of a response to the Acton Gate address?

 

I sent an LBA on 24th April addressed to "Sarah Wella / Complaints Manager". That was the name I was given, and I added the Complaints Manager part myself to ensure delivery if I'd been given a false name to write to, or she'd left.

 

As of today, Track and Trace say it hasn't been delivered.

 

I sent a copy of the letter on Wednesday. Track and Trace say it hasn't been delivered.

 

What on earth can I do next?