JMio v Clydesdale Bank - LBA Sent

[JMio]

I've called the Network Support number this evening, spoke the 'the other Fiona (not Hutton) to ask the actual reasons why they're not willing to provide me with transaction information under the DPA.

 

They're arguement is this:

 

"Because the information prior to July 2005 is held on Microfiche, it is not part of a relevant filing system, and therefore outside the scope of what they are obliged to provide under the Data Protection Act. The £5 per statement charge is because it's a manual process for a member of staff to reproduce these statements"

 

So is this the same situation as the Abbey National's stance then? Should I be looking to send off a similar letter to the 'Abbey Microfiche Argument' one?

[sachmo]

How come i just received all my statements for £10 from Dec 1999???? What are they playing at i wonder. Something fishy is going on i think.

[paul_ingram]

Just got the same, no statemets before July, as they deem the act to cover only a "relevant filing system" and they are saying that microsfiche takles maual work therefor not a relevant filing system.

 

So asked to speak to comliance, and they said that they are meeting with the IC tomorrow to discuss this stall tatctic and if they say that it's a relevant they will rpovide all the statements, so I'm off to call the IC again!!

[JMio]

Sachmo - can I ask which branch this was from? Did you just send in the normal DPA Request letter and that was it?

[JMio]

Sent the MicroFiche Letter (amended from the Abbey National thread) to Fiona Hutton (CC'd to both Branch & Neil McKirdy, Customer Relations Manager).

 

I'm absolutely dying to get these details - I just know they've charged me a fortune over the last 5 years.!

[norvernrob]

When the 40 days are up from your original DPA request, send a prelim letter with a nice high estimate of charges. Then see if they are suddenly able to find the information you want.

[JMio]

Got 2 x letters from the Clydesdale this morning:

 

Letter #1

 

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

 

Dear Mr JMio,

 

I refer to your letter dated 19th April to Neil McKirdy, which has been pased to me to provide you with a response.

 

I confirm that we shall be happy to provide you with all the information to which you entitled under your right of access to your personal information under the Data Protection Act 1998.

 

With regard to the information concerning charges applied to your account, those records held exclusively in electronic form date back only to July 2005. Records prior to that data are only accessable via a combination of electronic and manual means. The latter is not referenced by criteria relating to individuals. We therefore consider that this does not constiture a relevant filing system, as defind in Section 1 (1) of the Act, and that this information is outside of its scope.

 

I hope that this satisfactorily clarifies out reasoning in this matter. If, however you have any further queries, please do not hesitate to contact me.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

Gordon Watt

Data Protection Advisor

National Australia Group (Europe) Limited

 

Regulatory Compliance

3rd Floor

The Athenaeum

8 Nelson Mandela Place

Glasgow

G2 1BN

 

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

 

 

Letter #2

 

Dear Mr JMio,

 

DATA PROTECTON ACT 1998 - DATA SUBJECT ACCESS REQUEST

 

I refer to previous correspondence and now enclose the relative information, however I understand Gordon Watt in our Compliance area was making contact with you regarding outstanding issues.

 

If you require any additional information regarding your accoutn please contact your branch.

 

Yours sincerely

 

Fiona Hutton

Network Support

 

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

 

Along with Letter #2 was copy statements from July '05 - total of £110 charges on there.

 

Looks like I'm going to have to report them to the IC & hope like hell that they intervene for me!

[JMio]

Lodging a complaing with the IC -

 

For anyone else in a similar situation - they're very VERY helpful on the helpline:

 

01625 545 745 - then option 1 for DPA

 

Link to their DPA Complaint Form:

 

http://www.informationcommissioner.gov.uk/cms/documentUploads/DPA%20Complaint%20Form%20.pdf

[caro]

Hi JMio

 

I think you are being led a dance here. I asked for info going back six years and YB (local branch) sent copy statements going back from when I opened the account in 1998 (over 6 years), to when I closed it. No info on manual intervention yet though, so I assume there wasn't any.

 

Hope this helps

 

Caro

[diddled]

This outfit are wriggling again.

If the Information Commissioner decides to conduct an assessment, the outcome will probably be in the bank's favour. The IC (without bothering to request access to the data in question) are more than likely to accept the bank's explanation, then tell you that such a question is a matter for the courts to decide.

[JMio]

I'm seriously wondering how I would fare if I started 'estimating' that they owed me £700 in charges, in stages of every 6 months?

 

Would they then likely provide the details as a way of defending the claim?

 

I wouldn't mind the additional effort it would take, the accounts only been open since September 2001, so well within the 5 year Scottish timescale.

 

Can anyone advise please?

[sachmo]

Sachmo - can I ask which branch this was from? Did you just send in the normal DPA Request letter and that was it?

 

The branch was sunderland and yes i sent normal DPA Request letter.

[JMio]

Sorry if this is a daft question (been a looong week & my heads thumping!)

 

It is definately the Clydesdale that you're with, and not the Yorkshire Bank?

[caro]

Yes I am with Yorkshire, but as your posts are in the Yorkshire Bank forum and are part of the same group, I thought they would have had the same policy. Not that any of that matters, none of the b******s are above the law so go get 'em and get your money back.

[sachmo]

I am with yorkshire bank but i thought it was the same as clydesdale.

[geedels]

I too am with Clydesdale and am having similar problems getting the list of transactions pre-July 2005. Do you think it is worth questioning them on the difference between their policy and their twin the Yorkshire? I was thinking of doing so in the same letter stating that I was reporting them to the IC.

[JMio]

I think their argument is that although they're essentially the same company (National Australia Group), their records are held on different systems. Now, whether this is true or not I don't know, but it is the angle that the Clydesdale seem to be taking.

 

My current situation is that I've received copy statements from June 2005, I've sent them a modified version of the 'Microfiche' letter that's in the Abbey National thread, AND I've lodged a complaint about them with the IC.

 

There's a few of us here in the same boat, surely between us we'll find a way to crack this horrible bunch?!

[homer_j]

Got 2 x letters from the Clydesdale this morning:

 

Letter #1

 

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

 

Dear Mr JMio,

 

I refer to your letter dated 19th April to Neil McKirdy, which has been pased to me to provide you with a response.

 

I confirm that we shall be happy to provide you with all the information to which you entitled under your right of access to your personal information under the Data Protection Act 1998.

 

With regard to the information concerning charges applied to your account, those records held exclusively in electronic form date back only to July 2005. Records prior to that data are only accessable via a combination of electronic and manual means. The latter is not referenced by criteria relating to individuals. We therefore consider that this does not constiture a relevant filing system, as defind in Section 1 (1) of the Act, and that this information is outside of its scope.

 

I hope that this satisfactorily clarifies out reasoning in this matter. If, however you have any further queries, please do not hesitate to contact me.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

Gordon Watt

Data Protection Advisor

National Australia Group (Europe) Limited

 

Regulatory Compliance

3rd Floor

The Athenaeum

8 Nelson Mandela Place

Glasgow

G2 1BN

 

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

 

 

Letter #2

 

Dear Mr JMio,

 

DATA PROTECTON ACT 1998 - DATA SUBJECT ACCESS REQUEST

 

I refer to previous correspondence and now enclose the relative information, however I understand Gordon Watt in our Compliance area was making contact with you regarding outstanding issues.

 

If you require any additional information regarding your accoutn please contact your branch.

 

Yours sincerely

 

Fiona Hutton

Network Support

 

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

 

Along with Letter #2 was copy statements from July '05 - total of £110 charges on there.

 

Looks like I'm going to have to report them to the IC & hope like hell that they intervene for me!

 

Hi,

 

Just to let you know that we had the exact same problem with Mr Watts. However, following a complaint to the ICO and starting court proceedings without the information, I am now in correspondece with a firm of solicitors that they are using to defend the claim.

 

In fact, Mr Watts actually called me personally to apologise because he accepted that the information contained within my statements was covered by the DSA request and subsequently received copy of the statements from 2000-2002.

 

If you want some ammo, I am more than willing to let you refer to my conversation . Also could I ask if you would be prepared to allow me to have a scanned copy of that letter from Mr Watts, so when I go to court I can present my argument that they are stalling with customers to reduce their liabilities through the 6 year rule?

[Robertxc]

Hello,

 

I'm in exactly the same situation with Clydesdale as you. I would be very grateful if I could get a copy of your letter should the need arise. I got an identical letter as you and wrote back imediately pointing out that it was the data I needed, and not the statements. I was quite firm with them, so I expect them to comply within the 40 days, but you never know....

[JMio]

Homer / Robert - no problem at all - if you PM me your respective email addresses I'll get this scanned in & sent to you as soon as I get a chance (might take a couple of days before I'm near a Scanner though).

 

We'll beat them! Might not be straightforward (when is it EVER with Clydesdale Bank!?) but with the help of this site we WILL BEAT THEM!!!

 

:-) :-)

[geedels]

Hi, Did I understand that right, Mr Watts sent you all the details you requested? I've only dealt with Fiona Hutton, but I guess there is nothing to stop me from contacting Mr Watts directly with the threat of going to the IC. Sounds like he was a reasonable bloke, do you think I should go for a polite approach before an agressive one? Do you think we can mention that we are aware that other Clydesdale customers have received their information?

Thanks!

[JMio]

Hi,

 

No - as far I've received nothing at all from anybody at the Clydesdale Bank that represents what I asked for (ie Transactions & Charges OR Statements).

[JMio]

For anyone that may be intrested, I've scanned in the letter I received from Gordon Watt (Data Protection Advisor at CB), Homer_J had requested a copy of this, I'm happy to send it to whoever else may find it useful.

[JMio]

Contact Number for Gordon Watt:

 

0141 223 1013

[louise_ormerod@yahoo.co.u]

Hi, I'm new to posting on this site but I've been following the cause and banging my head against a brick wall trying to get information out of Clydesdale Bank, I've been dealing with Fiona Hutton at Network support, however she's ignored my last final DPA demand letter sent recorded delivery on the 29th April. So I called the information commissioners office and a very helpful lady said I'm definately entitled to information regardless if it's held on microfiche for a flat fee of £10 and 6 years back is not an unreasonable request. She helped me navigate through the website and I've filled out all the forms required to complain. She also suggested contacting the data protection officer for the bank it also states on the Clydesdale Bank website that if you have a problem with them to contact the following people and I've included the details in case you feel a little bit tempted ( I'm just about to start typing them a letter!!! Good luck!

 

Financial Ombudsman Service

South Quay Plaza, 183 Marsh Wall

London E14 9SR

Telephone number: 0845 080 1800

Fax number: 020 7964 1001