Is the bank taking your Benefits ?

[wakenthedead]

Hi there, I already had all my statements so didn't need to apply for them from the bank. I sent them a letter detailing every singly charge they've made to my account - with dates, amounts etc - since I started receiving benefit - which ended up being over £1400 in a twelve month period. Sent it off to the appropriate person at The Bank of Scotland at their HQ in Edinburgh asking for this to be refunded to my account - also included in the letter the paragraphs from the template letter at the top of this thread.

 

The standard reply came back saying they would look into it and be in touch in 4 weeks, although I did state in the letter that I'd like the matter resolved in 7 days.

 

So you think I shouldnt wait the 4 weeks then?

 

WakentheDead

[wakenthedead]

babybluex82x - I just wanted to say I utterly sympathise with your story - I'm in the same position as you, all my benefits have been swallowed by the bank and I've been living on thin air for months now. I'm disabled and can't work for the time being and I find it utterly disgusting how the banks treat people on benefit. I called the bank - only to end up in tears - only to have the bank helpline person cut me off as they said they couldnt deal with a hysterical person. I've had no help from them. Whenever I call they tell me to visit my branch, when I tell them I'm agoraphobic they say that if I can't get to the branch, there's not much I can do.

 

This forum is a fantastic resource, not only for having people behind you but also for the wealth of information thats on here. Please, private message me if you want to discuss this further, whilst I can't give you advice about what to do (but there are plenty on here who can) - I can help with some moral support as I know just how depressing this situation can be.

 

I'm sure we'll all get there. Eventually!

 

Keep your chin up.

 

WakentheDead

x

[johnwilsonstorey]

I may be wrong but from your reply is appears that you are only asking for the charges to be refunded. Did you manage to do a spreadsheat with interest added, and dont forget you can go back 6 years without encounering any problems not just one year Do you have your own thread as it is much easier for ther moderators to keep an eye out to make sure you dont get into difficulties and then they can advise you correctly.

Make them pay - they did it to you!

[maybelline]

hello, just discovered this thread looking for other info, I have claimed my bank charges and am tackling a couple of other penalty charges scenarios. I have just realised that the remaining part of my claim to Halifax is made up of charges taken from disability benefits, my daughter has had charges taken from educational maintenance allowance and the part of my pre-six years clam against Halifax had penalty charges taken from a studen grant - do all these come under same criteria, obviously it is too late to send an appropriation letter but I wonder if it is worth mentioning? part of my particulars of claim includes a 'begging letter' from me asking them not to take my benefit at the time, they did anyway.

[JonCris]

If they took any of your means tested benefits they broke the law & you could demand them back

[basil the birman]

Hi, i've been reading this thread with utter amazement. I had no idea it was illegal for the banks to take your benefits. I've been on IS with disability premium for nearly 3 yrs and in the last 2 yrs they've taken well over £600 (and yes I am reclaiming my charges!). When I go overdrawn it's because my DDs go out a day or two b4 my benefits go in. Over the years I've tried to get a small overdraft facility, £50, but they've always refused - however they had no problems offering me a £13000 loan 4 yrs ago!! They are total scumbags; I'm so glad I've seen this cos the next time they try taking my money I'm going to follow the advice given earlier.

 

Is there no end to the things these banks will do to make money out of us?

[JonCris]

Hi Basil

 

1st copy the letter by Martin3030 & myself at the head of this thread & send it to your bank now as it needs to arrive preferably before any further benefits are paid in. To be ensure your money you need to send the same letter specifying which benefit to which your referring just prior to each payment.

 

In the same letter mention that you now know they have breached the Social Security Act 2002 & demand they return all penalty payments they have taken from your benefits.......should be fun

 

In reply to your last remark.....no there is not!

[maybelline]

thanks joncris, will amend the template letter to something like under section blah of social security act etc, therefore I will expect a full refund of funds taken. :) EMA is means tested so thats another to tackle.

[Vital Spark]

Hmmm, I tried to get money returned and to stop a charge being taken. I used the template for Scotland regarding benefits but the response was negative.

 

I have Mairi helping me to get all my charges refunded anyway so maybe I should just stick to the one line of reclaim. Apart from official confusion I'll only confuse myself: not too difficult a task.

 

I also want a bit more information of reclaiming the late payment charges Telewest apply. Anyone know to whjich thread I should go for a letter template for this purpose?

 

All help appreciated and gratefuly received.

[midnight1]

Whats getting me is there must be 1000's of people who banks are taking advantage of in this way due to their lack of knowlege on their rights. Why are the banks geting away with this when they know its wrong and they know the funds going in are benefits because they say so on the payments? Isnt it about time one of the governing bodies felt their collars over robbing the poor to line the fat cats pockets?

[Vital Spark]

Before being killed in a tragic motoring accident, my friend's father was a lawyer. His partner's name was Robin Banks which we all thought was a fairly good name for a lawyer but it takes on a whole new meaning now that CAG have enlighened us as to just how robin' the darned banks are.

[Vital Spark]

Of all MPs and MSPs, I can think of two who might be willing to take the banks to task: Tommy Sheridan and Mr Sarwar (sorry if that name's misspelt).

 

Should we invite their involvement?

[OldBear]

Hi guys,

 

Lots of useful info in this thread.

 

Can I just add a bit for anyone out there who (like my wife and I) have had the Bank take money from Direct Payments? These are payments made by Social Service for, among other things, buying respite care, etc. I bring this up because this 'benefit' has not yet been mentioned on the thread.

 

My wife had £100 in charges taken from the account we use for the Direct Payments made to us on our Autistic son's behalf for respite care. On querying it, they 'graciously' gave back £50 'as a goodwill gesture'. I have been fuming about it for a while now and have been determined to get it back.

 

Reading this thread tonight has brought that back into my mind and I again resumed my search to find a way without going through the normal claim for charges route.

 

Below are a couple of links.

 

This is to the Direct Payments site where this problem is addressed. --->

 

Letters between Secretary of State and British Bankers Association chief executive regarding difficulties of people obtaining direct payments because of banking problems : The Department of Health - Pubs and stats: Letters and circulars

 

This is to the letter sent by Patricia Hewitt to the Banks. --->

 

http://www.dh.gov.uk/assetRoot/04/14/21/23/04142123.pdf

 

She addresses the issue in her third point. Note where she says, "However, a direct payment account is not money that belongs to the individual; it is public money to be spent on the person's care needs. Taking this money will mean that their care needs are not met."

 

This is the BBA's reply. --->

 

http://www.dh.gov.uk/assetRoot/04/14/21/24/04142124.pdf

 

While they only actually say they won't take money from the Direct Payment account to pay a debt on another account, I would say their reply implies they also should not be taking from it at all in the form of ANY charge. Can anyone agree or give an opinion?

 

I hope this helps.

 

OB

Edited July 22, 2008 by steven4064

[traffic_jamming04]

just a note to say i think that banks should hang there heads in shame taking massive charges from people onbenefits,how low do these fatcats go. good luck in reclaiming..

[OldBear]

how low do these fatcats go.

From what I've learned on here, I'd say most of them could limbo under a snake wearing a top hat.

[johnwilsonstorey]

If you think you have heard it all read this thread

 

Please help for an old lady

 

It will really make your blood boil

[MARTIN3030]

Hmmm, I tried to get money returned and to stop a charge being taken. I used the template for Scotland regarding benefits but the response was negative.

 

I have Mairi helping me to get all my charges refunded anyway so maybe I should just stick to the one line of reclaim. Apart from official confusion I'll only confuse myself: not too difficult a task.

 

I also want a bit more information of reclaiming the late payment charges Telewest apply. Anyone know to whjich thread I should go for a letter template for this purpose?

 

All help appreciated and gratefuly received.

 

 

Vital have a look at my thread in the telecoms thread.

I managed to claim both non-dd fees ans late payment charges after a very long haul with Telewest.

Basically the process is the same,my thread includes some good info and I have made a stickie in that section which gives NTL contact details.

If you need any help with this pm me.

Btw.....how are the cakes going????????

 

 

Link;http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/telecoms-mobile-fixed-broadband/9306-telewest-10-00-late-4.html#post536821

[JonCris]

VS the response might have been negative but it was also unlawful Ask DWP or whoever pays you to help...........sometimes they are quite good at pointing out the banks the error of their ways

[Vital Spark]

Thanks Martin, I'll do that.

 

JonCris, thank you too but I think I'll jsut go ahead with the regular reclaiming but include the fact that these charges are beign taken form an account into which benefits are paid when I produce my court defence.

 

Straight forward's obviously sufficiently complicated and confusing for me. :o

[less2303]

Just to say, I have had this problem with Natwest.

 

Telephoned my local branch yesterday, and they claimed to know nothing about it. Then called the telephone banking who again didnt know, allegedly!

 

Finally got through to the lending department, who eventually conceded the point, and a message has been sent to my local branch to allow me to draw my benefit today.

 

I will be taking the letter as well for the next payments whilst I am in the process of setting up another account for my benefits.

 

I think the thing is do not let them fob you off by claiming they dont know about it, eventually you will get there!

[Fox Mulder]

I wrote the following to First Direct today - for this, I used their online 'have your say' secure electronic messaging system, as I'm wanting a speedy response and usually get one within 24 hours using that system.

 

I've edited out some info that isn't needed here, but am posting in case it might be of help to others:

 

****************

 

I am writing because you have, again, appropriated incapacity benefits paid to me as a result of my being long-term disabled.

 

I received £XXX.XX from the DWP on 06/02 and my account then stood at £XXX.XX, within the authorised overdraft limit of £600.

 

However you proceeded to immediately take from that benefit an overdraft fee of £30.00 and excess overdraft charges of £100. You have pushed me into unauthorised overdraft, and the current level stands at £XXX.XX.

 

I would like to draw your attention not only to the fact that I am currently awaiting the next stage response from the bank to my demand for repayment of all bank charges deducted from my account which I consider to be unreasonable and unlawful, but also the Act of Parliament which prohibits banks and other agencies from taking benefits from the people they were paid out to and intended for:

 

Social Security Administration Act 1992

Miscellaneous

Certain benefit to be inalienable **

 

187- Subject to the provisions of this Act, every assignment of, or charge on-

(a)benefit as defined in section 122 of the Contributions and Benefits Act;

(b)any income-related benefit; or

©child benefit,

and every agreement to assign or charge such benefit shall be void; and, on the bankruptcy of the beneficiary, such benefit shall not pass to any trustee or other person acting on behalf of his creditors.

 

In short, you have never had any legal right to deduct any monies from amounts which have clearly been paid in by a government benefits agency into my account. This has happened on many occasions, leaving me - as today - with zero funds for my welfare, household costs, travel and more.

 

It is with the above in mind that I suggest you immediately repay the excess overdraft fee and overdraft fee most recently set against the account, a total of £130.00.

 

If you do not refund the charges, I will continue to pursue them, and will add them to the statement of charges which has already been submitted. This will be revised as time goes by to reflect any further charges made against my account in respect of returned direct debits/standing orders, overdraft and excess overdraft fees, until such time as the monies are all repaid to me in full or the court is required to make a decision on the matter.

 

However, if you do not refund these charges and ensure that you do NOT take monies from benefits paid into the account in future, you may also expect to receive fortnightly notifications of my right of appropriation in writing, meaning that you will most definitely be required NOT to touch any amounts paid in as benefits.

 

I do hope the bank will recognise the indefensibility of taking every last penny of benefits from a disabled customer. A more enlightened policy might be to charge realistic sums that truly cover the costs you incur - which cannot reasonably be more than £3 per item - and ensure that you do not make life harder for those on low incomes, especially the disabled, through a punitive and greedy charging system.

 

I look forward to hearing from you as to how you wish to proceed, and whether you are willing to be reasonable in regards to this matter. I do hope for a positive resolution.

 

****************

[johnwilsonstorey]

First Direct's answer will almost certainly be that they are unaware that benefits should not be taken as payment against bank charges.

Perhaps you should be ready for that reply and quote the letters between the DSS and Banks making it quite clear the rules about benefits. This link does appear earlier in this thread but its easily missed, be ready with your supprise package.

 

 

Letters between Secretary of State and British Bankers Association chief executive regarding difficulties of people obtaining direct payments because of banking problems : The Department of Health - Pubs and stats: Letters and circulars

[Fox Mulder]

johnwilsonstorey, thank you so much for that helpful input. It is enormously appreciated.

 

I received the following electronic message in response today:

 

To: XXXXXXXXXX

Re: Charges Query

 

Thank you for your message dated 08-Feb-2007.

 

I have noted your comments regarding charges recently incurred on your account. Your query is currently being investigated by our Customer Relations team, you will receive a full response to this matter by 15-Feb-2007 as advised to you in our recent communication.

 

I confirm the 130.00 pounds charges which you refer to in your electronic message will also be taken into consideration with the above.

 

Regards

 

Claire Carress

Credit Services

 

 

 

Now this gives no response whatsoever to what I actually wrote (see my earlier post), so I wrote this reply to her:

 

 

With respect, your response does nothing to answer the charge that you have taken from my account state benefits paid to me on account of my disability, and in so doing have left me in a position of having zero finances for the very things that benefit is paid by government to enable me to purchase - food, rent, household sundries, travel, and other bills.

 

I expect the £130 taken most recently in charges to be refunded to my account immediately.

 

Further, I would draw your attention to the letters between the Secretary of State and British Bankers Association chief executive, regarding difficulties of people obtaining direct payments because of banking problems.

 

The relevant correspondence can be accessed at:

 

Letters between Secretary of State and British Bankers Association chief executive regarding difficulties of people obtaining direct payments because of banking problems : The Department of Health - Pubs and stats: Letters and circulars

 

Clearly, in respect of that correspondence and the Act of Parliament aforementioned, you are in breach and should immediately redress the situation as instructed.

 

I await your response, and the funds being refunded to the account before the close of business today.

 

Yours sincerely

 

 

XXXXXXXXXXX

 

Now it remains to be seen what comes of this. I will check my account messaging system in a few hours to see if I have had any response...

[johnwilsonstorey]

It is possible that at the Bank does not allow their empolyees to access the internet. I think that you should copy and paste the letters and send to the bank already opened so as they are in no doubt as to their content.

Hope you dont mind me saying but if you dont know how its done and I didn't until very recently PM me John

[Fox Mulder]

That's a really good point, and I was kind of aware of the possibility but am hoping for an immediate refund - they've done the occasional in the past, begrudgingly, always no more than fifty per cent of whatever they took, and that was when I didn't have the help of this forum.

 

I really need that money back now, obviously enough as it was paid to me for a good reasons. But if they don't respond satisfactorily today, I will be printing the letters off and posting them. I have kept copies of the electronic messages today, locally.

 

I realised a sneaky little thing in her (so far, first and only) response, regarding the date by which I can expect a response to my first demand for payment (not the benefits per se - the whole darn lot, over 3k now, going back three years). So I wrote again the following:

 

In further response to the electronic message sent to me earlier today by Claire Carress of Credit Services, I would point out that when you state I 'will receive a full response to this matter by 15-Feb-2007 as advised' , you show complete disregard for the terms outlined in my approach letter of 29 January, in which I demanded repayment of all charges and gave you 14 days from the date you received my letter to respond appropriately and satisfactorily.

 

That letter was sent by signed-for, next-day delivery but I allowed two days’ grace, not one, in calculating the 14-day period. This means you have until 13 February.

 

I have received a letter from First Direct acknowledging receipt, but it does not in any way address the contents of my own letter, nor does it make any offer of payment, and therefore the time limit of 14 days in which to reply remains in place, unaffected.

 

Should that 14 day period expire without any response from you having been received – or with an unsatisfactory response having been received – I shall immediately proceed to the second and final letter demanding repayment of charges. At that time, you will be given another 14 days in which to comply, after which there will be no more letters and I will issue my claim upon expiry of that second deadline.

 

I made all this quite clear in my letter of 29 January but as it has clearly not been taken on board, I believe it was necessary today to remind you of the timetable I have set in place and ask that you do not attempt by any means to extend the deadlines I have set you in accordance with my rights under UK law.

 

You may start showing a constructive response by repaying the funds onto my account that were taken this week in defiance or ignorance of the law governing the handling of state benefits, and the fact that such payments are intended for the welfare claimant's welfare, not the bank's.

 

Yours sincerely

XXXXXXXXXXX

 

By the way, is it just me or does a name like that - Claire Carress - sound made up?