Egg - ARC who are the people Ive been paying ever since.

[Deb T]

I've just read through some of the papwork and I have found a payment arrangement from them where they accept my offered amount...

 

but there are some anomalies that don't make sense.

 

In the early part of the year in question they send a letter that they confirm my payment plan and it shows a balance less than the default amount on my credit card) and that they will review it in 6 months time

and that importantly they have suspended all interest charges from the date of the letter.

 

I've now checked the payments and can see that they were paid as they should have been through the 6 month period so...

 

4 Months after they accepted the payment plan I receive another letter stating that they've reviewed the payment plan and although I have agreed to pay them back they've decided to pass the account on to one of their external partners.....the balance on the account should have shown £88 less than the original payument agreement letter but instead shows £240 more...?

 

Prior to any of the above they had already issued a default notice....

 

All seems a bit pete tong to me.

[cerberusalert]

It is your legal right to request a CCA at anytime and for them to be able to obtain a CCJ they would have to produce one to the court, you could bring them to strict proof. Also you could apply to have the CCJ set-aside anyway because of the unfair charges they have added, besides this is all a long way off even if they attempt it.

[cerberusalert]

All of those anomolies that you've found will/should show up with what you receive back from your SAR. For the time being we'll concentrate on the CCA to see whether it's enforceable or not & then we'll be in a better position to advise.

[Deb T]

This is probably an obvious question but having never used a postal order before I assume I find out who the correct person / body to make it payable to and the postal order asks for information from me to be placed on the back...shall I just hand write the initial account number...

[cerberusalert]

Just make it out to ARC Europe and when/if you send the SAR make that out to EGG.

[Deb T]

Ok, I am currently paying this debt off and have been for a number of years, no problems at the moment.

 

I have found out a default notice and a termination letter.

 

I guess I'm clutching at straws with this one...but...

 

The first default notice had two pieces of paper....the first one clearly states on the top that it is a default notice....however if you read it you'd think 'er...I don't think so' ...

 

It can be found here

http://www.partnerpick.com/userspace/user3727/rbs1.jpg

 

The accompanying letter doesn't say at the top that it's a default notice but it does refer to it on the second line down.... The date on this page gives the date of the default notice and that payment must be made 14 days from the date of the default notice ...it gives the date it should be paid on...

This page is here

http://www.partnerpick.com/userspace/user3727/rbs2.jpg

 

and then the termination letter which is dated the same day and the day that the payment be made....seems a bit odd to send the letter out on the very last day of the date payment is required by.

 

Termination can be found here

http://www.partnerpick.com/userspace/user3727/rbs3.jpg

 

I guess these are in all in order....

[Pinky69]

You need to give us the date of the DN and the date given to remedy the breach. Also, the first line states that you are "alleged" to have breached the agreement. That paragraph must tell you that you HAVE breached the agreement - there must be no doubt about it - and the reason for the breach ie you failed to make the minimum payments or a cluase in the Terms and Conditions that you breached. Also the format isn't right - the words underlined must be "more prominent yet" than the rest of the text.

[Deb T]

Ok...I wont give the exact dates as in chronological dates....but what I will give you is the time span as is on the default notice (which I assume is the second page)

 

Date of default notice 5th of the Month - Date given to remedy is 19th of the same month -termination is also the 19th of the same month.

 

I dont suppose it's relevant but the amount of arrears on the default notice is less than on the termination letter.

[Pinky69]

It's your lucky day. They have not given you sufficient time to remedy the breach they are not sure is a breach or not (lol). All they have done is add 14 days to the date on the Notice. They must give you 14 days from the date of SERVICE. The date of service is the day you receive it and that is deemed to be 2 days after they sent it if sent by 1st class post and 4 days after the date they sent it if sent by 2nd class post. They terminated it, which they cannot do without issuing a lawful DN and in doing so they unlawfully rescinded the agreement - it no longer exists. They are not entitled to ask you for any of the capital on the alleged debt but they can claim any arrears. However, as they cannot take you to court having rescinded the agreement I wouldn't worry about it. Goodbye Direct Line.

[Deb T]

OOohh, so this is another that I've been paying for no reason or at least paying them for something they are not entitled to collect....

 

Ok then, I guess it's time to send them a letter as well....it's getting busy.

 

I have another I'm dealing with that I'll post up in a few minutes...I guess it's going to be legal....can't have it all my own way...

 

Thanks for the input Pinky (again)

[Deb T]

Ok, this is further to my recent post re their cca, I have since requested it from their collecting agents, I have the green signed credit agreement, the one that they request they have and it's an Egg 2000 credit agreement...

 

But here is their default notice..

 

Dates are ..on the letter it states that 'It was sent to you on 4h of June -.....the date they give to pay is 14th June - all references to the date the breach needs to be brought up to date by is 14th June...

 

http://www.partnerpick.com/userspace/user3727/egg3.jpg

 

and the second page

 

http://www.partnerpick.com/userspace/user3727/egg4.jpg

[cerberusalert]

3 out of three 'aint bad. Insufficient time to remedy again.

[Deb T]

What is the time limit? Is it 14 days or 7 ? and if insufficient time is given but the termination notice isn't as quick off the mark then surely the grace period is enough of an extension?

[cerberusalert]

The notice must give a specific date which must be 14 days or more from receipt of the notice, not the date of the notice/letter.

 

Until they terminate the a/c they can reissue the DN at any time so it's important not to let them know. Once the a/c is terminated all they will be able to claim are the arrears on the a/c not the balance. If the CCA is defective they won't be able to enforce any payment.

[Pinky69]

It's 14 days from the date of service - it was amended to 14 days in the Consumer Credit Act 2006. There is no "period of grace" as you call it. If they send you a termination notice any time after sending you an unlawful DN, they have rescinded the agreement.

[Deb T]

Ok...with the above two posts in mind...what would be the next step?

 

I have CCA's two of the three shown....I suspect they won't be able to provide the relevant information but is it not the case that these faulty DN's take precedence anyway?

 

Also, even if they do provide the CCA I should still stop paying them on the back of these faulty DN's? Should i write to them giving them the reasons why I am quitting payment? By paying them any more money it would be as if I was accepting the faulty DN's ..which I don't....

 

As for the 14 days...sorry to press the point...but if it was amended in CCA 2006 but these notices were issued before that date then I guess they are bound by the 1974 act....is that also 14 days?

[Pinky69]

Anything sent before the 2006 Act is subject to the 1974 Act and that was 7 days. You can cease paying them if the agreements are unenforceable or the DNs are faulty and the accounts have been terminated.

[Deb T]

pah! All these agreements are 2004 ...

[Deb T]

Not so much of a PAH, Direct Lines default seems obviously faulty...as in thw wording.....egg gave 10 days...with 2 days for service I guess the 10 days was about as much as they had to give....I think the goldfish notice with no date actually on the default notice but nstead referred to as an accompanying letter is also faulty...

[Pinky69]

It's not the date of the agreements that matter - it's the dates of the default notices. If they were after 2006, it's 14 days.

[Pinky69]

The Goldfish notice is definitely unlawful - the date must be on the Notice itself.

[Josie8]

Ok, this is further to my recent post re their cca, I have since requested it from their collecting agents, I have the green signed credit agreement, the one that they request they have and it's an Egg 2000 credit agreement...

 

But here is their default notice..

 

Dates are ..on the letter it states that 'It was sent to you on 4h of June -.....the date they give to pay is 14th June - all references to the date the breach needs to be brought up to date by is 14th June...

 

http://www.partnerpick.com/userspace/user3727/egg3.jpg

 

and the second page

 

 

http://www.partnerpick.com/userspace/user3727/egg4.jpg

 

 

Its invalid

[Deb T]

Ok, all defaults and terminations Im posting here are 2004 ...

 

I'm with you re the Goldfish one....their is no date...and it's clearly faulty...

 

I think the RBS one is pants now that light has been shed on the wording such as 'it's alleged' and other such anomalies on it.

 

In regards to the Egg.....credit agreement 2000, account default notice and termination 2004....but on what grounds are you saying that it's invalid Josie8?...or anyone for that matter.

[Josie8]

Ok, all defaults and terminations Im posting here are 2004 ...

 

I'm with you re the Goldfish one....their is no date...and it's clearly faulty...

 

I think the RBS one is pants now that light has been shed on the wording such as 'it's alleged' and other such anomalies on it.

 

In regards to the Egg.....credit agreement 2000, account default notice and termination 2004....but on what grounds are you saying that it's invalid Josie8?...or anyone for that matter.

 

 

It ddoesn't comply with the prescribed form.

 

As to the time period the 4th June 2004 was a Friday so sat 5th and sunday 6th not included in postal service rules. DN should have given you till 15th June 2004 to remedy breach. It didn't so it is invalid

[Deb T]

Ok, I need a bit of clarification here...

 

Default notice is covered under the 1974 act...which is seven days....

 

but is that seven working days etc?

 

The below is consistent with days on when it was sent

 

If the default notice was issued on a Saturday which was the 1st of the month....and they were requesting payment by 11th of the month which is a Tuesday ...

Edited July 30, 2009 by Deb T
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