Help with old uni debt please

[tomterm8]

I am no longer welcome on CAG

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[oojakapipi]

The advise I was given:

 

1. I am liable for the tuition fees even though I didn't receive any tuition because I signed the registry (which is apparently a contract).

 

2. I have to admit the claim and wait for judgement.

 

3. There is no point in defending as the Judge will only be interested in the fact that I signed a contract.

 

4. There is no point in going to the court at all as these matters are usually dealt with in an office.

 

5. The uni has 6 years from Oct 2003 to chase the debt.

 

The advisor that I spoke to had to go and speak to her supervisor to gather the above, I gather from this that the advisor is not actually qualified. This is a service that people are referred to if they are eligable for legal aid and need advice.

 

I am going to try and find a solicitor first thing tomorrow, to find out if I can change to a defence and if it is worth it.

 

I have just been asked a very good question:

 

"When the cheque bounced, did the Uni contact me to inform me/offer other ways to pay my fees"?

 

No, the first contact they had with me was in Oct 2006 (a full 3 years later), even though I was in contact with them in Feb 2005 about library debt, no mention then about fees either.

 

They are claiming that they tried to write to me in April 2005. When I spoke to them in Feb 2005 (library debt) they were made fully aware that I was going through a relationship split, and had moved out of the property. They obviously forgot to 'log' that information.

 

I was in constant contact with my ex as we were dealing with taking me off the mortgage/bills etc, and we still talk now, he was always very good at sending me any letters and never obstuctive, I have asked him and he says if there had been letters from the uni he would, of course have forwarded them.

 

This is really annoying as I didn't attend the 3rd year due to it not being paid for. They are claiming that they 'became aware' of the debt in April 2005, I could have finished the course, got my degree and suffered the consequences later. Though I suspect that they check you paid your fees before they award the qualification.

[tomterm8]

I am no longer welcome on CAG

[Zimmie]

Oh... it's not oojakapipi fault. He/she did the right thing

 

I know Tom, I'm not in anyway suggesting it is Ooja's fault. I'm totally behind her/him on this. I just feel that without the stress of the debt collection dept hounding & threatening, Ooja would have been more able to challenge it.

Also Ooja informed a Tutor that she/he would not be attending the 3rd year. The tutor has a responsibility to inform the dept head of this, maybe even try to support Ooja to continue. The Uni was obviously aware that Ooja wasn't attending...that should have alerted them to a problem that they should have tried to resolve.

[tomterm8]

I am no longer welcome on CAG

[oojakapipi]

Ok,

 

I have finally found a solicitor who will see me tomorrow, so I am suspending action until I have seen him.

 

I phoned the court and was told that they havn't received the claim documents yet....... strange indeed as the uni debt collector was like a dog with a bone and now is either on a go-slow or a holiday, can't see that as this is the time students are trying to qualify, so they must be busy checking everyone has paid for the qualification they are about to receive (may they be truly thankfull!!!).

 

Spoke to National Debtline and they said that court action is a last resort, and the court will not look kindly on a case where reasonable (within my income limits) offers have been made, and subsequently refused. It is in the uni's interest to stop the court action and take what I can offer, otherwise they will be looked upon as unreasonable, wasting Judges time and public funds. I was also advised that it was in my interest to attend the court if I can't stop the action, as Judge may want to ask questions.

 

Phoned the SU and waiting for them to get back to me, if they can't help at least I can get the info off them about instalment plans, wording on the registry papers and if there were/are partial refunds offered for students who don't complete.

 

Thanks for all the help with this it is really difficult to know how to deal with them, impossible to establish how the financial departments of universities are governed, I will update when I know more.

[emmaf01]

This is such a complete nightmare for you! Hope the solicitor tomorrow is more help.

 

Keep going- if any of us can help, we'll try. Keep us posted.

[Zimmie]

Ooja, this all sounds positive. I've got everything crossed for you. Go for it and tell about the hell they've put you through. I hope it all comes out in your favour. Education should be free. I'm really rootin' for ya.

Hugs Ooja, Zim.

[oojakapipi]

Zimmie,

 

Thanks for that, you and tomterm8 are really on the ball as I notice that you both mentioned Overriding Objectives earlier in the post, which National Debtline also mentioned and told me to speak to the solicitor about. I am a bit blinded by science and feel like I am on a fast-track legal course!

 

Thanks again for the help.

[oojakapipi]

I have discovered that it is possible to change the plea, and as I was pressured into admitting the debt from c*** legal advice and timescales, it will not go against me in front of the Judge if I get a good defence together. Since this 'lady' seems determined to proceed to court and wreck my employment prospects I will turn over every stone to defend this, nothing ventured nothing gained!

 

The uni have been sent a request for the terms and conditions and the contract. I will also be requesting a copy of all information held by them on me, but its not an S.A.R. at this stage.

 

If you are reading this thread because your uni is claiming a debt against you for fees for a course you didn't attend/ended in early stages, then the advice given by previous posters is the route to take. At my stage it is now unfortunatly a bit more complex.

 

The Student Union is looking into it.

 

I am also drafting an email to send to all and sundry media/political parties/watchdogs.

 

Will post more when I have more info.

[oojakapipi]

I have had a thought preventing me from sleeping so thought I would just have a little look at the Data Protection Act.

 

This is from the Information Commissioners Office website:

 

 

How do I know if my problem is a data protection problem?

It is possible that you might have a data protection problem if you have been denied any of your rights, including your right to see the information an organisation holds about you, or if the information about you is used, held or disclosed:

 

•

unfairly;

•

for a reason that is not the one it was collected for; or

•

without proper security.

 

Or, if the information about you is:

 

•

inadequate, irrelevant or excessive;

•

inaccurate or out of date; or

•

kept for longer than is necessary.

 

For more information about these requirements, please see our website

(Information Commissioners Office – Information Commissioner's Office) or call our Helpline on 01625 545 745.

 

 

 

I was contacted at my Dad's home on his telephone which was the first contact I had about this debt by an Enquiry Agent appointed by the university.

 

The only reason that the university had my Dad's details is for the purpose of next-of-kin detail requirements, NO other reason. There is no way that this Enquiry Agent could have obtained information about my Dad and his phone number without the university giving it to them.

 

Furthermore, the university have confirmed that they have appointed a third-party in a letter to me:

 

Dear oojakapipi,

 

 

We have been trying to contact you at an address we had on file, (my old address), but received no responce. We therefore instructed Enquiry Agents to find your whereabouts and they report that you have returned to live with your father at ................. on a temporary basis until you move to your new home. They further reported that you said that you would telephone this office yesterday (date). We did not receive a phonecall. An Administration Charge of £xx.xx has now been added to your debt.

 

 

I like the way they say I had returned to live with my Dad, I have never lived there, and when this Agent phoned I made it perfectly clear that it was not my address.

 

Any opinions on the above gratefully received. Now I'll try and get some sleep

 

 

 

 

 

[tomterm8]

I am no longer welcome on CAG

.

[emmaf01]

These "agents" will phone everyone in the phonebook with the same surname as you, saying they "heard" you were living there.

 

Getting emergency next of kin info off the university is low- but it may have been held on your contact details page, which they probably just photocopied to pass to the agency.

[oojakapipi]

Believe me, without going into personal reasons there is more chance of them linking me to Mrs Tiggywinkle than my Dad through 'enquiries'. The fact that they have passed on his personal details to a third party is a breach of Data Protection, as the only purpose they were given his details is to tell him if I had been taken ill whilst on university premises. He was not taking any financial responsibility for me, I was a mature student who was paying my own fees. The only reason I put him as next-of-kin is because they asked for 2 next-of-kin details and I had already put my partner's details.

 

I have also now remembered a telephone conversation where they admitted that to me. I asked the debt collection 'lady' how their 'agent' was able to contact my Dads home, she said his details were in my file, I asked why his details were in my file, she said for next-of-kin. In any case they have admitted it in writing to me and then charged me for the privilege of them breaking the law to locate me. As I had pointed out to the 'lady' in our (very long) conversation, I had not been hiding under a rock, I had no reason for hiding from a debt that I wasn't aware that I had and their 'agent' could have quite easily found me on the electoral roll/phone book in the last year.

 

I have spoken to my solicitor this morning about the Data Protection and charges and he perked up considerably!

 

tomterm8, I am (until my solicitor receives the contract and attendance information) hanging my whole argument for changing my plea on the fact that they have claimed for unlawful (in more ways than one) charges. I don't think I can defend the whole claim on that basis, but any opinions would be gratefully received.

 

Thanks for the replies and taking an interest.

[pugsley]

my uni deregisters student who do not turn up for 3 classes in a row, surely this should have happened to you, ask why your attendance wasn't monitored and what processes they comply with to make sure this event does not happen again.

 

Did you receive your student loan for this period too, because this would probably be repayble too if you failed to attend.

[oojakapipi]

Hi pugsley,

 

interesting point about removing you from the register, unfortunatly all universities have different rules and proceedures (I have been doing extensive research) and don't seem to be regulated. I have been searching my particular uni website and found a very small statement which says 'it is not our responsibility to contact you if your fees are not paid'. This statement is made on their on-line payment facility which did not exist in the year they are claiming I owe them.

 

I didn't take a student loan as in 1992 I had started a BSc that I just didn't enjoy so left in the first year. As I still had a loan from that time which I had the usual problems of deferment that everyone else has had, I wasn't entitled to a loan in 2001-2003. My student loan was fully paid off in 2005.

[tomterm8]

I am no longer welcome on CAG

[pugsley]

for a non lawyer ! wow

 

 

I just found out that I'm registered with my uni for this term only by chance, (i have a resit in August) do not need to go to classes, it would have been more appropriate of them to inform me of my reregistration by post rather than on the computer service direct. I just happened to log in and check my registration status, that is the only way I found this out.

 

As for your problem I think your offer is reasonable, and as said before should be accepted or will go against your university. County court judgement's can be settled within 30 days after the court hearing I believe and if so no mark will be on your credit file and it will take awhile hopefully for a court day to arrive, so it gives you a bit of time, although I don't see why it should have to go this far. If there are no regulations as to registration and attendance I would be very surprised, (although I'm still angry at my uni for messups so I probably shouldn't be).

[oojakapipi]

Yes, tomterm8 is very impressive and has spent a lot of time helping me with this.

 

The problem with my (possible) future employer is that the job involves a high level of trust. I am assuming that the company won't just do credit checks once, on offer of employment, but occasionally during too. In any case due to the level of trust involved I will have to be completely honest about it. I have an interview early next week and can get away with not mentioning it then as there is still no court date and negotiations are still being attempted. But, if they insist on going to court I'm stuffed.

 

Good luck with your resits pugsley!

[pugsley]

thanks although I'm totally bored with uni now, not worried about the resit as I didn't fail it just didn't turn up and will be capped at 40% anyway. I've been doing law lol

 

 

I'm in a similar position to yourself, I want to start the 2nd year conveyancing course I have planned to do for ages but I have to sign a form saying no unsettled defaults and I'm expecting the CLC to check this but don't know for sure if they will (risky). I think I can get my credit file cleaned up but it will take some money and time. I'm currently studying bookkeeping at a low level (and home schooling my daughter) just to get ready for the clc's bookkeeping and accounts Landlord and tenant course which is going to cost roughly £1,500 all in..... MOAN

 

I think you should be able to pay this university debt off if you get the job and luckily at the moment you can be checked out and pass.

 

I don't know how they expect you to pay them first if you are not paying your basic mortgage etc.

[emmaf01]

I was going to try for law at uni- but if they see my credit report, they'll runa mile! Better think of something else...

[pugsley]

I think alot of students start with a good credit record and come out with an awful one, well that is unless they are willing to sell their organs or pole dance.

 

luckily universities do not credit check you, they just throw money at you and then let you go into the scary world of debt.

[oojakapipi]

I think alot of students start with a good credit record and come out with an awful one, well that is unless they are willing to sell their organs or pole dance.

 

I feel guilty for laughing because that statement in painfully true but so funny.

 

The majority of students go to university straight from school so have no experience of managing finances and the cost of living. The credit providers literally throw money at sudents. I was out on a field trip with uni and heard a man in the factory we were visiting describe my fellow students as 'fresh meat'. I think that is how the credit providers regard students.

 

I don't think either of you should feel discouraged from studying law just because of your financial history. You wouldn't believe how difficult it is to find a debt specialist solicitor who will work for legal aid. I was told by one solictor she could help me but it would cost £280 per hour, I politely told her that if I had £280 I would put it towards my mortgage! I live in hope that there are people like you who understand the debt nightmare and go and qualify to help people who are trapped in the debt loop, of which sadly, there are millions.

 

Anyway I shouldn't be going off topic here, maybe we should set up a 'Student Bar' on this board to discuss all things student/debt related.

[tomterm8]

Yes, tomterm8 is very impressive and has spent a lot of time helping me with this.

 

LOL

 

So... have you called the courts to see if they've got the paper work, yet? It seems to be taking longer than normal:-| Maybe they are reconsidering... now you've got a soliciter to send 'em a letter.

[tomterm8]

I was going to try for law at uni- but if they see my credit report, they'll runa mile! Better think of something else...

 

I really don't think you should reconsider law just because of a bad credit report... lets face it, by the time you finish a law course part time, your credit record will be clean anyway:D One way or another, LOL.