Both employed and self-employed - CJRS furloughed

[chaoticj]

Hi,

 

I am both employed and self-employed and have done this for years all above board, tax returns submitted etc.

 

Due to COVID-19 my employer intends to furlough me on the CJRS and advises during that time I am not allowed to do any work for them.

 

Furthermore, the agreement I have signed says I am not allowed to do work for any other organisation or myself during furlough and if I do I have to tell them and may be liable to repay anything paid to me under CJRS if they become liable to repay it to the government.

 

Does this mean I have to cease my self-employment during furlough? Or is this simply uncharted territory right now? The employer wants to cover all bases regarding any potential occurrences? Also, for avoidance of doubt, I carry my self-employment out from home so it isn't affected so much by lockdown (it would be safe to do it).

 

Thanks in advance.

Edited March 26, 2020 by chaoticj

[honeybee13]

Hi.

 

I expect someone here knows the answer, but this is new to all of us and we're finding our way. I'm sure will be along soon, please bear with us.

 

HB

[honeybee13]

I don't know if this reflects your case, but it seems to be government rules. They may need to be adjusted, reading this.

 

https://www.buzzfeed.com/alexwickham/coronavirus-britain-food-industry-labour-crisis-shortages

 

HB

[chaoticj]

Hi,

 

Looks like I won't be allowed to carry out any self-employment - at least anything that generates revenue. Presumably if one produced goods, they could be prepared for sale but not actually sold? Unless I'm misinterpreting.

 

The self-employed scheme says it can only be claimed upon if you are primarily self-employed.

 

Regards,

chaoticj

[ericsbrother]

you have hit the nail on the head.

 

[chaoticj]

Hi,

 

I am a bit confused, it says on the government website CJRS page: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/check-if-you-could-be-covered-by-the-coronavirus-job-retention-scheme "If you currently have more than one employer. You can be put on furlough by one employer and continue to work for another."

 

So it seems to suggest you can't just go out and get another job but you can continue on a pre-existing job. Does this apply to self-employment?

 

e.g. I've been furloughed by my employer but I was already self-employed so can I continue to generate some revenue..? It says on my agreement that "During your Furlough Leave, you may not work for any other organisation, or on your own account. If you do you must tell us and may be liable to repay any sums we have paid you under this scheme if we become liable to repay it to the Government."

 

I've read online something about 'on your own account' and to me it sounds like if you were a freelancer at a company, they can't furlough you, it seems to refer to the self-employed who have the company as a client..

 

Anyone have some ideas about this please?

 

Thanks in advance.

[unclebulgaria67]

Your employers set those terms of your agreement about you not working elsewhere while you were furloughed ? If so they were probably concerned that if you worked elsewhere, it may affect them being paid by HMRC the 80% of your pay. 

 

I think you need to clarify with your employers.   

 

From what I understand the furlough scheme allows a second job or secondary self-employed work, as long as the self-employment is not related to your employment by the company who furloughed you. 

[Ethel Street]

If your employer says it is the CJRS that prevents you from working for another employer or in self employment while you are furloughed then they are wrong. The Scheme rules are clear about that. But the Scheme does not not override normal employment law. So if your contract of employment normally prevents you working for another employer you are still prevented by your contract from doing that even when furloughed. 

 

Check with your employer the basis of what they are telling you.

 

While you’re on furlough

Once you are on furlough you will not be able to work for your employer. You can undertake training or volunteer subject to public health guidance, as long as you’re not:

• making money for your employer or a company linked or associated to your employer
• providing services to your employer or a company linked or associated to your employer

 

 

Whilst furloughed your employer cannot ask you to do work for another linked or associated company.

 

If your contract allows, you may undertake other employment while your current employer has placed you on furlough, and this will not affect the grant that they can claim under the scheme. 

[ericsbrother]

generally if you work for someone else it has to be a different sort of job, so furloughed work rocket scientist- you cant work for another co or yourself making rockets but you can be enmployed as a hearse driver.

Your employers agreement regarding self employed status wil still be applicable and I suspect they are worried that it may be considered as being in the same field so have put a blanket ban on everything to make their paperwork easier