Smart Parking ANPR PCN - HAVEN BANKS ,EXETER - mistyped

[toplad69]

Hi

On 27/1/18 I parked in this car park operated by Smart Parking.

 

The closest machine was out of order so I walked across the car park to obtain a ticket, which I am sure more than covered the period that I was parked - BUT, I no longer have the ticket.

 

I received the attached notification on 2/2/18.

 

I have no intention of paying this but I'd be grateful if you could advise of next steps.

 

Should I raise an appeal or leave to run its course ?

 

Thanks

SPrinter3418020617320.pdf

[honeybee13]

Hello and welcome to CAG.

 

Could you post up the relevant questions and your answers onto this thread please? Here's a link.

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?462118-Have-you-received-a-Parking-Ticket-(1-Viewing)-nbsp

 

Best, HB

[dx100uk]

PCN number on att

hidden it for you

[ericsbrother]

read up on this car park

 

be ready to tell them that you are aware that their machinery is known to be broken and unfit for purpose

to be prepared to prove that you didnt pay by producing copies of every ticket issued and every ANPR capture.

 

I bet you didnt mistype judging from the number of complaints about the same thing at this car park.

 

They have cancelled a number of their demands when people have outed them as not maintaining their equipment.

 

Also,

when we do suggest you write

copy the letter to your MP and add the back story so they can see that this isnt asking for money owed under a contract but just outright fraud

[toplad69]

1 Date of the infringement: 27/1/18

 

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date]: 1/2/18

 

3 Date received: 2/2/18

 

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [y/n?]: No

 

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event?: Car entering and leaving car park

 

6 Have you appealed? {y/n?] post up your appeal]: No

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up: No

 

7 Who is ompany? : Smart Parking

 

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] : Haven Banks Retail Park Exeter

 

Hi ericsbrother

 

For the purpose of clarification.....

 

Are you suggesting that:

* I claim that I DID purchase a ticket, and

* that I suspect that the reason that they have been unable to match ticket to car is because their machines are notoriously faulty

- as was the case with the one closest to the place that I parked ?

 

When do you suggest that I make contact with them and by letter or using their route of appeal ?

 

Thanks

[silverfox1961]

Hi and welcome,

This particular site has appeared over the last couple of weeks with a worrying regularity. Whatever you put in an appeal, Smart Parking will reject it but they MUST give you a POPLA code.

 

It may be that you typed the wrong reg number just as likely it is the machine that is faulty and not registering the numbers typed. As this site is ANPR controlled they will only have the two photo's of your car but the important thing is that the machines have stored all the numbers inputted. A simple query with those details may just show a number similar to yours. They should have checked this first before assuming you haven't paid.

 

I suggest appealing to them over this just to get a POPLA code then appeal to them. Smart Parking are well known to discontinue cases when POPLA have become involved.

 

The POPLA annual report also bears this out

https://popla.co.uk/docs/default-source/default-document-library/popla-annual-report-2017-final.pdf?sfvrsn=2

[toplad69]

Thanks silverfox1961, for the prompt reply.

 

It seems that POPLA are there to assess the evidence (the facts). Given that I don't have the parking ticket, there are no facts other than the details of the vehicle entering and leaving the site. What happens if the POPLA appeal is lost ?

[DragonFly1967]

What happens if the POPLA appeal is lost ?

 

Daft Parking will say that you must pay.

 

You don't! Hoopla decisions are not binding on the motorist.

 

To make you pay they would still have to take you to court and win, and that is far from a certainty as Daft will have to produce a great deal more evidence to win at court rather than just pulling the wool over Hoopla's eyes.

[ericsbrother]

there are loads of other threads about this site,

read them and realise you are being rooked.

 

The bandits will cancel if you use the right arguments,

 

namely you know their system is garbage and has been broken for months and are happy to recite a number of other victims of their chicanery to your local court when they are dumb enough to try and collect a non-existent debt.

 

If you are going to appeal use such wording and let them know that you are taking advice from a number of sources so you are well aware as to how big this problem is.

 

Do not be polite and do not mitigate anything so even saying you might have punched the wrong numbers is a no no.

 

there machine was out of order,

tough luck,

it doesn't say no parking when they cant be bothered to maintain their mickey mouse systems so no breach and no debt

 

if you want us to reword this as an appeal to dumb parking then be glad to do so

[toplad69]

Thanks all for your input - really appreciated. I lodged an appeal with Smart Parking and it turns out that the alleged offence is for overstaying my time rather than an invalid reg as I had at first thought. This is the appeal I posted.......

 

Smart Parking Ltd evidence shows the vehicle entering at 14:06:38 and leaving at 16:18:09 - a total time of 2hrs 11 minutes and 31 seconds.

 

Please confirm the time allowed on the ticket purchased as I no longer have the ticket. Please also confirm the amount of money entered into the parking machine to obtain this ticket.

 

Reasons for Appeal

1. There is no (or very poorly visible) signage at the entry point to the site. In this case, I could not know that the "Duration of stay is calculated by the ANPR cameras from the point of entry to the point of exit".

2. There is no time display at the entry point. I could not therefore have known the entry time of my vehicle, upon which you have apparently calculated the "duration" of my stay.

3. At no time during the time that my vehicle was on the premises was I advised of its entry time according to the ANPR cameras, either at the point of entry or at the point of buying a ticket.

4. Some of the signs that I remember seeing do not even mention ANPR entry and exit times.

5. I eventually found a space close to the bowling alley, shortening the distance I would have to carry my autistic son. Logically, I went to the closest ticket machine directly outside the bowling alley. THIS MACHINE WAS OUT OF ORDER - which no doubt your records will verify !!

6. I had to use another machine at a considerable distance, which further delayed the time between entry and obtaining a ticket. At this point I also was not informed of my time of entry.

7. There was a considerable time between leaving the parking space and leaving the site, but I cannot say how much because I was not informed on leaving, of the time of my leaving.

 

In summary, I was not reasonably informed of your draconian practices at the point of entering the site. Nor was I informed of the ANPR recorded times. Accordingly, I did the only reasonable thing - made sure that my vehicle was in the parking space no longer than the time allowed according to my ticket. I could not say what time I either entered or left the site.

[DragonFly1967]

If they don't allow the appeal (and let's be honest, they probably won't, there's no profit in allowing appeals). If they try to take this to court, their claim is garbage anyway and will be easily defeated.

 

As you've mentioned bowling, I'm assuming that this was the retail park car park adjacent to Tenpin, Matalan & The Range? If so, they're going to have a problem proving an "overstay" at 2:11:31.

 

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@50.7162795,-3.5314861,3a,15y,1.63h,88.18t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sSdPqoIFsizooUyZpRJByNw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

 

If that sign now says 2 hours and not 3 (bearing in mind that the image above is from Jul '17) who has decided to reduce the time limit? Have they applied to vary the terms of any planning consent? What did the original planning consent say? Do they even have planning consent for their advertising signs & ANPR equipment?

 

Start doing some research with the council now, it will buy you time in the long run as you won't have to deal with it (along with everything else) if they decide that they're going to make an example of you and take you to court. The more ammunition you have, the better able you'll be to fight the war

[toplad69]

Yes, DragonFly1967, that's the car park. Thanks for the advice.

[ericsbrother]

too much irrelevant detail and too polite, exactly the opposite of what I suggested.

thety will now reject an have you down as a wavereer who will likley pay up if they apply a few more lies to a piece of paper