PPM/Gladstones claimform - 2*PCN Hounslow Travelodge TW3 1JG ** CASE DISMISSED **

[pips1504]

Name of the Claimant ? - Parking and Property Management

Date of issue – 15 Dec 2016

Date to submit defence = by 4pm Monday 16th January(i think)

What is the claim for – the reason they have issued the claim?

 

- DATE 22/08/16 - AMOUNT - £150 - DUE DATE - 26/09/16 -

- DATE 23/08/16 - AMOUNT - £150 - DUE DATE - 26/09/16 -

Total Due - £300

AND THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS

The claimant claims the sum of £305.20 for parking charges and indemnity costs if applicable including £5.20 interest pursuant to S.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 Rate 8.00% pa from dates above to 14/12/16.

Same rate to Judgment or (sooner) payment

Daily rate to Judgment £0.07

Total debt and interest £305.20

What is the value of the claim? £390.20 (£35 court fee, £50 Legal representatives costs)

 

Has the claim been issued by the original creditor

or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim? Parking and Property Management

 

Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? Yes

[honeybee13]

Hello and welcome to CAG.

 

Thank you for giving us the information the guys need to advise you, they should be along over the course of the day.

 

My best, HB

[dx100uk]

get this running to gladdys.

 

 

to the solicitors

[Your address]

.

[Their address [solicitors]

.

[Date]

.

Dear Sir or Madam,

.

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

.

CPR 31.14 Request

.

On (date) I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the (Name) county court.

.

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

.

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of [each of the following / the] document(s) mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

.

1. the contract between [parking company name] and the landowner that assigns the right to enter into contracts with the public and make claims in their own name,.

.

2.proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and Country Planning Act 2007

.

3.copies of the notice to driver, notice to keeper and any other correspondence from [insert Claimant Name] & [insert Solicitors Name} to the defendant that they intend to rely upon in court.

.

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are disclosed at your earliest convenience..

.

Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy.

.

Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

.

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

.

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

.

If you are unable to comply with this request within 14 days and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request please confirm in your response.

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Yours faithfully

.

TYPE YOUR NAME DO NOT SIGN IT

[dx100uk]

now fill this out too please:

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?462118-Have-you-received-a-Parking-Ticket

[pips1504]

1 The date of infringement? 22nd and 23rd August 2016

2 Did you appeal to the parking company? NO

If yes, has there been any response?

If no, have you received a Notice To Keeper? (NTK)

 

 

Did the NTK provide photographic evidence?

 

NTK received 24th & 25th September.

Photographic evidence of windscreen and front seats of car was on the NTK.

3 Did the NTK mention Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA) YES

4 If you appealed after receiving the NTK, did the parking company give you any information regarding the further appeals process?

[it is well known that parking companies will reject any appeal whatever the circumstances]

No Appeal made

 

5 Who is the parking company?

Parking and Property Management Ltd

 

6. where exactly [Carpark name and town] did you park?

Parking at the rear of the Hounslow Travelodge 12 Lampton Road, Hounslow TW3 1JG.

The area is entered from the Bulstrode Road.

[silverfox1961]

Hi and welcome.

Can you lay out the reasons why you or the driver got the tickets.

 

Were they windscreen tickets?

Was this at night?

Were there any signs at the entrance to the car park?

Did you stay at the Travelodge?

 

I have looked on Google and it seems the pictures show no sign at the entrance and the three signs I could see are not lit.

 

It seems strange that PPM are using PoFA as most members of the IPC don't bother.

[ericsbrother]

From what I recall the entrance as you turn in has no signage and the access road serves more than one place so it is difficult to determine where the small signs on the walls further along actually refer to.

 

This should be the main point of your defence along with a lack of planning permission for the signage (check with council).

 

As you didnt respond to the original notices it may well be possible that they are not compliant with the POFA to create a keeper liability so we would need to see them to help us form an opinion on this.

 

 

However, ignoring everything can get the backs up of judges as they dont like to listen to cases where there is an altenative disputes resolution procedure that hasnt been used.

 

 

Tell us everything about the event and we will do our best

[pips1504]

Thanks for the responses. I will hopefully be able to reply fully tomorrow. Once again many thanks for all the responses so far.

[pips1504]

AUGUST

Early evening of 22/08/16 Partner moved car to area to rear of hotel to unload 3 children and luggage whilst I was at reception.

 

 

The car of which I am the registered keeper was parked in an area to the rear of the hotel on an unmarked block paved area.

 

23/08/16 Approx. 18:00 discovered 2 x PCN’s (Dated 22/08/16 & 23/08/16) affixed to windscreen of vehicle.

 

SEPTEMBER

 

Received 2 x Notice to Keepers (dated 24th September 2016 & 25th September 2016)

 

NOVEMBER

Letter before claim received from Gladstones solicitors dated 31st October 2016 detailing both PCN’s and requesting £150 for each.

 

07/11/16 - I sent a letter disputing the debt and asking for a letter compliant with Practice Direction Protocols.

 

Letter received from Gladstones dated 21st November 2016 saying Annex A is no longer part of the practice direction

 

DECEMBER

02/12/16 – I sent a letter once again disputing the alleged debt and that I maintained that their original Letter before Claim was not fully compliant with the Practice Direction.

 

Claim Form received dated 15th December 2016 claiming £390.20 (£300 – PCN’s, £5.20 Interest. £35 Court fee and £50 Legal reps costs)

 

I acknowledged on MCOL website on the 22nd December 2016.

 

23/12/16. I sent a letter to Gladstones for a CPR 31.14 request.

merged.pdf

Edited January 1, 2017 by dx100uk
30Md of docs merged to <2Mb - dx

[ericsbrother]

as they are relying on the POFA then the maximum they can ask for is the £100 and not £150 per event.

They know this but hope that you dont and likewise the judge isnt au fait with the details of the POFA.

 

Also the wording of the signage should make it clear whether the money is due as a contractual charge or for breach of contract.

 

 

The summons says for parking charges so that means it is a contractual sum.

the signage should then say

" by parking here you agree to pay some bandit £100 if therse conditions are not met"

I bet they have the 2 confused so you can make mileage of this and if the judge is on the ball you will win just on this point.

 

 

However, if the signs say

"permit holders only"

then any other parking is prohibitive and that is not a contracual matter.

 

 

Again we dont know this until we see the signs that make the offer.

 

As for what you were doing,

it is totally irrelevant so dont waste any time explaining any of that.

You are being sued as the keeper.

 

As for Gladdys refusing to show their client has a cause for action and locus standi you should explain that they have failed to do this and therfore it is not possible to offer a proper defence as they refuse to produce this evidence of a right to claim and therefore you ask that the claim be struck out under CPR 16.4 and ask for full costs recovery under CPR 27 if the matter does proceed to a hearing.

[pips1504]

I took a photo of the sign at the time the PCNs were issued but it is not great quality and difficult to read. I have found an almost identical sign online and crossed out the only differences between the 2.

 

Regards

Pips

[ericsbrother]

then a simple defence is that

 

 

1.the claimant has not shown a cause for action nor locus standi

 

 

2. the signage is not a contractual offer but one of prohibition and therefore only the landowner may claim for damages for trespass.

[pips1504]

Thanks for the response.

 

 

So what do i have to do next?

 

 

Do i have to state my defence on the MCOL website.

 

 

Is there a particular format i have to adhere to?

 

Regards

pips

[dx100uk]

post 12 will do

 

 

yes on MCOl

respond to a claim box

[dx100uk]

have gladdys replied to your 31:14?

[pips1504]

I haven't heard anything back yet from Gladstones.

 

With regard to my defence...should I complete online with mcol as soon as possible or should I leave it to as late as is allowed?

 

Regards

Pips

[dx100uk]

not due till/by 17th 4pm

[ericsbrother]

so, whenyou do sned in your skeleton defence you can say that they have failed to show a cause for action by failing to respond to a CPR 31.14 as well as the other points

[pips1504]

Defence submitted this evening on MCOL. Many thanks for all your assistance so far. Could anyone tell me what happens next?

 

 

1. The claimant has not shown a cause for action nor locus standi.

 

2. The signage is not a contractual offer but one of prohibition and therefore only the landowner may claim for damages for trespass.

 

3. The claimant has failed to show a cause for action by failing to*respond to a CPR 31.14 which was sent on the 23rd December 2016.

[dx100uk]

they have 28 days to do 'something' else it gets auto stayed.

 

 

dx

[ericsbrother]

this defence will make them now put up or shut up

 

You need to do your homework now regarding position, size and wording of signage.

Measurements useful as far as how far from public highway signs are,

 

can they be read BEFORE you enter the private land they are applicable to,

 

how big are the signs,

 

how high up are they,

can they be read from the drivers seat of a moving car etc.

 

Content of the signs also important,

 

do they offer a contract or are they prohibitive?

 

Is the money claimed a contractual condition, breach of contract or just a penalty or deterrent?

[pips1504]

Hi all

 

I have received an email from Gladdys with a 19 page witness statement attached.

 

Apart from preparing myself to be ready to appear next week in Court is there anything i need to send to the courts and to the claimant?

 

I was planning on working on it at the weekend but now wondering if there is any thing that i need to send in to court prior to the hearing.

 

Thanks

Pip

[dx100uk]

dunno you've not been here since January

I gather you did your own witness statement?

 

 

dx

[pips1504]

The last thing i sent in was as per post #19. Do i need to elaborate on this prior to the court date?

[dx100uk]

If you have a court date

You must have completed an n180 and received your own directions questionnaire where it required you to file a witness statement