Bullying and Harrassment campaign by the DWP Jobcentre Plus - My unfortunate 2 year nightmare....

[Guest Dave Evan]

You appear to be a Glass half empty kinda guy Dave, sorry but its how you come across to me.

 

 

 

 

More like an over-flowing glass, with too much experience, which could be translated into "You will get bored within five minutes and we are scared to recruit you, then see you disappear

for more money elsewhere".

 

 

What do these companies want? someone who can get results and be a real asset, or do they follow the 101 guide on how to peeve off talent. I don't deal with agencies much as I don't trust them, after taking their cut, it seriously

hits the wage packet.... Companies these days are far too picky and with all their silly interview smart remarks and character probing mumbo, looking for that so called perfect employee etc -- yet don't seem to want to know when these types land in their lap, you got to at least see the person face to face before rejecting the poor buggers... now interview selection is all done by keyword - oh great, so now a stupid software program selects jobseekers instead of the human eye and brain - now that's not encouraging.

 

 

They all want perfection - they never want to pay for it..

Edited October 26, 2016 by Dave Evan

[Shoelover]

@ shoelover

 

 

"So JSA is better paid than those entry level jobs?"

 

ofcourse not - but once you've done the bar work, customer services, and other 2-a penny jobs, and reach a certain age, it looks strange and in my vast experience doesn't look good to see a professional

go back to entry level posts. It raises too many questions, even before one gets to the interview stage.

 

 

Oh, it seems fine to do a mundane low-paid job when your up against it, but the ones handing out the advice wouldn't do it - that's for sure.

 

 

You can be certain that I've done it, didn't like it one bit, and although it on that CV, says you haven't been sitting on your hands - it has a demotivating effect that will be damaging.

 

With respect you have no idea what anyone you deal with at the DWP's background.

 

You could put a positive spin on entry level jobs- bog afraid to go back to the floor or get your hands dirty. If you are that good you can work your way back up again.

[Guest Dave Evan]

With respect you have no idea what anyone you deal with at the DWP's background.

 

You could put a positive spin on entry level jobs- bog afraid to go back to the floor or get your hands dirty. If you are that good you can work your way back up again.

 

 

 

 

I got a good idea alright, since I used to work for the Uk's 4th largest agency, supplying training/work placements for the DWP's New deal scheme back in 1997. Also ran a copywriting biz dealing with web copy, CV and article writing... so I think I'd know if these JC fools are qualified or not.

 

 

Sorry what is positive about taking a huge salary cut and a demotion? Might be ok if the post leads to a career change - yeah, fine - but not to still work in the same industry its not a good idea. Besides, it'd be like starting from scratch and take at least 1.5 years to get promoted just one level up, and in some cases 5 years or more to reach management level again. Many don't have the time to begin all over again, we aren't all 20 years of age.

 

 

Afraid to get my hands dirty - really, its just cos I started out as a Painter, then worked in a fashion warehouse in Great Portland Street loading up clothes rails onto vans to go to C & A stores - sorry, what are you trying to say, that I haven't grafted??? I done more graft than most, and I mean real hard work, well you try sanding down radiators and wooden doors all day long and see how you feel afterwards.. and all for £35 pw btw (1987). Back then I could undercoat a door in 8.5 minutes flat, including laying off.

 

I like many others did real hard work, not the cushy 9-5 office jobs for £17k of today.... that's easy.

Edited October 26, 2016 by Dave Evan

[Guest Dave Evan]

"With respect you have no idea what anyone you deal with at the DWP's background."

 

I do, but its not necessary to know...

 

 

You just need to know why they are there, I spoke to several JC employees, and they fall into the following categories:

 

 

 

 

1. They cant get the job they want/or back into previous careers, so they work as a Jobcentre work coach instead

 

 

2. Many crave to work in Recruitment, except few know what it truly entails, but like to think they got the skills - they so don't know...

 

 

3. Work coaches really believe their 'consultants' - unfortunately they lack the in depth knowledge required for such a role. Recruitment is about Sales - and not about being a Consultant Advisor.

 

 

 

 

While working at an agency, you'll begin as a Resourcer, contacting jobseekers, arranging appointments for the real Consultants/sales guys, you wont be allowed anywhere near jobseekers, never mind the clients.

 

 

In other words you need to be a strong sales closer - and not an administrator, which is what the JC work coaches really are.

[Guest Dave Evan]

After 2 failed attempts at trying to get the Independent Case Examiner to deal with my case - my next step is to approach the Director General of Operations.

 

(Andrew Rhodes was appointed Director-General, Operations, at the Department for Work & Pensions (DWP) in April 2016.)

 

As far as I can see - the ICE wont deal with complaints until they been forwarded to the Director General - maybe someone can confirm this... All complaints were forwarded to my local Jobcentre using email:

 

correspondence@dwp.gsi.gov.uk then to ice@dwp.gsi.gov.uk and got the standard auto reply cobblers. Seems the only way is to physically write to the Director General as email seems to be a major stumbling block for Jobcentre and DWP staff - too difficult to handle maybe???

[dx100uk]

Threads merged

Please keep to one thread

[tomtom256]

I got a good idea alright, since I used to work for the Uk's 4th largest agency, supplying training/work placements for the DWP's New deal scheme back in 1997. Also ran a copywriting biz dealing with web copy, CV and article writing... so I think I'd know if these JC fools are qualified or not.

 

 

Sorry what is positive about taking a huge salary cut and a demotion? Might be ok if the post leads to a career change - yeah, fine - but not to still work in the same industry its not a good idea. Besides, it'd be like starting from scratch and take at least 1.5 years to get promoted just one level up, and in some cases 5 years or more to reach management level again. Many don't have the time to begin all over again, we aren't all 20 years of age.

 

 

Afraid to get my hands dirty - really, its just cos I started out as a Painter, then worked in a fashion warehouse in Great Portland Street loading up clothes rails onto vans to go to C & A stores - sorry, what are you trying to say, that I haven't grafted??? I done more graft than most, and I mean real hard work, well you try sanding down radiators and wooden doors all day long and see how you feel afterwards.. and all for £35 pw btw (1987). Back then I could undercoat a door in 8.5 minutes flat, including laying off.

 

I like many others did real hard work, not the cushy 9-5 office jobs for £17k of today.... that's easy.

 

So you don't want to take a pay cut?

 

You already have as your jobless, surely keeping busy in a job is better than rotting on JSA which would look odd on a CV when you could be doing other jobs.

 

It just doesn't make any sense to me. Its not about what you did but what you can do.

[Shoelover]

Tell us. Why do you think that you have not got work after two years? JSA is not much to live on, you will be on income based which means you don't have any savings to speak of.

 

Do you really think that's better than a junior post? Are you posting in your real name? You do realise prospective employers often Google people. Perhaps you could get a job as a work coach on account of you being so well versed in these matters

[Guest Dave Evan]

So you don't want to take a pay cut?

 

You already have as your jobless, surely keeping busy in a job is better than rotting on JSA which would look odd on a CV when you could be doing other jobs.

 

It just doesn't make any sense to me. Its not about what you did but what you can do.

 

 

Agreed totally

 

Actually its about not what your worth - but what you can negotiate.... infact a millionaire I worked for said to me "Over qualified = qualified with extra benefits, so makes me angry when employers reject so many based on what I view as stupid thinking....

 

 

 

Ive taken pay cuts a few times in the past eg: went from being a Department Mgr (£8,200 pa - 1991) to a Bar Person (£3.00 ph - 1995) with a pay cut of £4600, which seems a relatively fair amount to lose out on, plus in effect a severe demotion as well don't forget.

 

 

Ok, I and others have recovered and got back to a previous type positions, but what frustrated me throughout my career was I trained to a fairly respectable level, stayed loyal to many companies where they should have promoted me etc, and yet I earnt more as a Security Officer (£27k) than I did as a professional manager (£13k) - but the Security job hours were crazy and would have stayed there for a few years otherwise. But then again, I wouldn't have set up my own business if I didn't take the risk, which I learnt other skills which mostly no other jobs will teach - so nothing is ever wasted and filled my CV with a Consultancy position of authority, which sets me apart from many hundreds of thousands of people much higher qualified than me.

 

 

"Perhaps you could get a job as a work coach on account of you being so well versed in these matters"

 

Ofcourse it crossed my mind and appealed at one point, but such positions are quite scarce and the Private Training sector - companies go bust frequently, so having been there it makes me nervous to attempt to go back to doing it, even though I really enjoyed the work. And I have all this on my CV anyway on 3 jobsites so am playing the waiting game for the right position - perhaps credit controller, yet these posts also seem scarce. But to take a junior post at 47 years of age just looks weird as if you have no ambition in life and we are all judged severely enough without adding fuel to the fire...

Edited November 16, 2016 by Dave Evan

[Guest Dave Evan]

"Tell us. Why do you think that you have not got work after two years?"

 

Its a nightmare buyers market.... 1.96 million unemployed in 2014, with 6% being unemployed and 73% not leaving their secure jobs, huge influx of foreigners to the Uk might have something to do with it. Lord knows what the 2016 figures show - I think last time I checked it was 150 applications per job, any job - actually its more like 5000 applications per job likely.... and three quarters of those poor buggers wont even make the interview shortlist.

 

 

I pulled the stats from the web - so who knows the true accuracy of that, since it comes from the Government, and we all know the figures are false. What was it, they piled a load of unemployed onto training courses, then made out those on courses cannot be 'unemployed' - yet still not officially classed as employed.

Edited November 16, 2016 by Dave Evan

[WarrenBuffet]

There's loads of work for brick manufacturers and wall builders both here and the US of A., if you are interested Dave.

[Shoelover]

If you are 47 then you have many years left to work - at least 20 and that's if the goal posts don't move, which they will. Enough time to start a new career that you might enjoy. So when you look at it you are a youngster really

[Guest Dave Evan]

There's loads of work for brick manufacturers and wall builders both here and the US of A., if you are interested Dave.

 

 

 

 

Well, am not a qualified bricklayer Warren, so that suggestion/option wont happen.

 

 

 

"If you are 47 then you have many years left to work - at least 20"

 

mmmm, don't fancy retiring at 67 years, and only having 8 years of retirement until I croak it thanks.... Na - my plan is to become a property developer, have at least 3 houses by the time I'm 55, and run multiple businesses, live semi-retired until 57 and sell off what I own for 1 million plus... then start again with another property etc etc, build another business, sell off etc.. I do hold 14 business accolades to my name, been featured in the National media - and over the years ran 3 businesses - so am not your average Joe.

 

 

I mean who the hell works until their 67? I did hear about a guy that worked into his 80's, woke up each day, got into his suit, drove to work, grafted etc - dunno what happened to him... Then again my mum worked into her early 70's, qualified teacher - but you wont catch me doing that, and I imagine not many others would do it. I went self-employed for 5 years cos there was no work, and so glad I did, as I achieved many things you just don't get to do, had experiences that many would dream about, won awards, got media coverage and was my own boss - what a life! and wouldn't change it for anything.

 

 

You know, owning a company is a terrific life - you learn stuff not many know about

Edited November 16, 2016 by Dave Evan

[Shoelover]

State retirement age will be 70 soon.... so lots of people work past 67.

[Guest Dave Evan]

State retirement age will be 70 soon.... so lots of people work past 67.

 

 

Lets say everyone works until 60 years - better off joining employers pension scheme and also starting a personal pension plan for the next 10 years.

 

 

The state one is pants.... only about £4000 per year

[honeybee13]

Lets say everyone works until 60 years - better off joining employers pension scheme and also starting a personal pension plan for the next 10 years.

 

 

The state one is pants.... only about £4000 per year

 

I think this thread is starting to stray off topic. We've had many scenarios quoted, but from what I can see from the OP, this is about Dave's treatment by Jobcentre Plus.

 

I don't see how it's going to be helpful discussing plans that Dave might have when at the moment his beef is with JCP.

 

HB

[Shoelover]

After 2 failed attempts at trying to get the Independent Case Examiner to deal with my case - my next step is to approach the Director General of Operations.

 

(Andrew Rhodes was appointed Director-General, Operations, at the Department for Work & Pensions (DWP) in April 2016.)

 

As far as I can see - the ICE wont deal with complaints until they been forwarded to the Director General - maybe someone can confirm this... All complaints were forwarded to my local Jobcentre using email:

 

correspondence@dwp.gsi.gov.uk then to ice@dwp.gsi.gov.uk and got the standard auto reply cobblers. Seems the only way is to physically write to the Director General as email seems to be a major stumbling block for Jobcentre and DWP staff - too difficult to handle maybe???

 

The DWP do not accept emails containing personal details from non government email addresses. Snail mail it is