Recieved,a MCOL, for 2 kittens I sold Please any help appreciated.

[Julie Ishers]

Hi, in December I had a litter of Siamese kittens, 3 in total,

 

one went to live in Edinburgh and is as fit as a fiddle and I receive pictures daily of him, the other 2 went to a lady who's relative had already had a kitten from me, she had been to my home and met my cats and fell in love with the kittens that she had brought her relative to see.

 

She had at that time a poorly cat, and said if she had no cat she would deffinately have a kitten. I only hobby breed, last year I had 2 litters, you do it out of love, you would have to have 10 or more breeding queens to make any money out of it as if you love your cats you put s much time and effort into them, they eat the best food, kittens are weaned on the most expensive weaning foods etc, it is very expensive, but you do it because of the joy they give you,

 

anyway, the lady contacted me to say that her old cat had lost his battle and had died, and that she would like to have a kitten from me, preferably 2....I had 2 available, Turnip and Sprout, they asked for pictures which I sent and they reserved them,

 

I did not ask for a deposit, as I prefer that someone meets the kitten and makes their decision,.

 

The day before they came to collect the kittens I wormed them, which is normal as you can then tell them what date they need to be treated again, sometimes a kitten can become sickly after the treatment, again this is normal. sometimes no kitten has a reaction and then sometimes one may, in my case one of the kittens was sick twice the following morning, only bile no food etc and he was playing and running around the house and seemed ok,

 

I did tell the lady as soon as she arrived that one of the kittens had been sick, and explained I had wormed them both.

 

She decided to take the kittens home that day, I would of kept them with me if required but she was happy. The following day I received an email stating that they didn't seem to want to eat much, I said it could be the upset of the journey and the change of home, and to keep an eye on them.

 

2 days later I was informed that one of the kittens had been taken to the vets and had been kept in as he was de-hydrated....which I found strange as they were always in the water fountain here, she said the vet said it was "probably"feline parvo ....

 

I immediately contacted the other lady in Edinburgh to check on the sibling of the 2 kittens in question, I was told he was fine and well and they were very happy with him. I then received an email stating that the kitten who was at the vets had been released home and that it was "probably" AGAIN a bit of flu and a tummy upset...no deffinate reason just "probably"....I was very pleased with the news.

 

There was no mention of vet fees at this point, nor had I been consulted if I would pay towards the vet fees, and as I had been told after the event I had no option to ask for the return of the kitten/s, which I would of done in a heartbeat.

 

Then 3 days later I received an email stating that the kitten had died....I was totally shocked as the vet had sent him home, knowing there was another kitten in the house, and he must of felt that the kitten was well or why would he of sent him home,

 

then a couple of days later I was informed that the 2nd kitten was at the vets, and also subsequently died.....no post mortem was performed on either kitten, all the vet said was that it was "probably" feline parvo.

 

The kitten who went to live in Edinburgh only left his sibling 48 hours prior, he as I said is perfectly well and his new mum is in contact with me almost daily sending me pictures of him.

 

I was totally devastated about the loss of the 2 babies, as I love them and care for them constantly and for something like this to happen has shocked me as I have never heard of it before, I breed one sometimes 2 litter a year, sometimes not at all, and they usually are small litters so they go to family or friends or I keep one.

 

I am unsure as to how to respond to this court document, I feel awful for the lady but I was not given the opportunity to have the kittens back as they told me after the event, or the opportunity to discuss vet fees etc, as again I would of rather had them home with me.

 

All the vet has said is that it was "probably" this and "probably" that, none of which shows that I am to blame, I would not let a kitten go if I believed it to be poorly...

 

I did email the lady after the loss of the 2nd kitten and I said I would help towards the vet bill, only because she was such a lovely person and I was upset, but I had not agreed to do this for any other reason as I wanted to treat her as I would want to be treated, I had bought a puppy many years ago that died within 2 weeks, and I never even got a response from the breeder.

 

Anyway, I am probably boring you all to tears, but I just do not know what to do, if the 3rd kitten had also become ill then I would start to think closer to home, but as he is fit and dandy I cannot understand what happened with his brothers, and without a post mortem result I will never know the cause of their death......please please please any advise would be so helpful....

 

Thankyou for taking the time to read this

Edited March 19, 2014 by honeybee13
Paras.

[Desperate Daniella]

Hi Julie, and Welcome to CAG!

 

The first thing I'll ask you to do is to hit the edit button and break your post up into paragraphs. It's a bit daunting for people to read otherwise and I know you have had viewings but not replies.

 

It's clear you love your cats and kittens and I'm so sorry this has happened.

 

Did you actually have any contact with the vet, or have you been given a written report from the vet? Or is the buyer just telling you what the vet has said?

 

We'll all try and help you.

 

DD

[renegadeimp]

We had a somewhat similar thread last year that may offer some advice. I'll have to dig around and find it.

[honeybee13]

Hello Julie.

 

I've put some paragraphs into your post so people trying to help you will find it easier to read. Please try to put some spacing into what you post.

 

HB

[honeybee13]

We had a somewhat similar thread last year that may offer some advice. I'll have to dig around and find it.

 

This one which was settled. Looking at Julie's thread title, I think she may have read it.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?397988-Received-a-MCOL-for-a-kitten-I-sold-**SETTLED**&highlight=kitten

 

HB

[Julie Ishers]

This one which was settled. Looking at Julie's thread title, I think she may have read it.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?397988-Received-a-MCOL-for-a-kitten-I-sold-**SETTLED**&highlight=kitten

 

HB

 

Hi thankyou yes I found that last night after a search, it is very upsetting, they emailed me copies of the vet bills which I cannot actually read as they are so small, I do nor dispute that they have vet fees, they are as I say lovely people, I dispute the fact that they did not give me a chance to have the babies back, and the fact that the vet allowed the first kitten home after treatment, and he died, then sadly the 2nd kitten......ive never had any experience of court in my 54 years on this planet and it has upset me so much,

[hightail]

Hi Julie, had these kittens had their full course of vaccinations before leaving you?

[Julie Ishers]

Hi, no I offer vaccinations before they leave, but my vet is quite expensive and people prefer to go to one of the pet vaccination clinics, where they are half the cost, plus with Siamese they are so small compared to a moggy, I do not start vacs until they are 12 weeks, which means I keep them with me for a further 2 weeks, I have found that people would rather take them at approx. 10 weeks, where as there are some people who will wait till they are 14 weeks.

[steampowered]

Can you type out the Particulars of Claim word for word? For you to get sensible advice we need to know the basis on which the claim is being made.

[Julie Ishers]

I bought 2 kittens from ......on the 16th December (not the case they collected on 14th) she advised us that one of them had vomited a couple of times which was probably due to the working medication she had given them the day before. on taking them home one of them was unwell on the Monday 19th ( again wrong it was then then 16th) he was taken to the vets and kept in for 3 nights, (I was not informed till after the event) and then released.

 

He was then unwell again on the 22nd and was taken back to the vets , the vets were unable to save him and he died on that day.

 

On Friday 27th Dec his brother was taken ill with same symptons the vet suspected feline parvo and it has an incubation period of 3-7 days... he died on sunday 29th the vets suspected parvo, and that he must of contracted it from kitten number 1....

 

Mrs........ has repaid the purchase price and \I am claiming the vet fees.......( I was not informed that the 2nd kitten had gone to the vets and wa told 3 days after he had died......plus the litter brother who had spent the last 9 weeks with his brothers, is alive and well in Edinburgh, and has had no illness what so ever.

 

I am totally confused, never had anything like this before, and cannot understand it at all. and would of had the babies back in a heartbeat.

Edited March 20, 2014 by citizenB

[Julie Ishers]

The problem I am having with this is that I was always informed after the even, sometimes days after, also I cannot understand why a vet would firstly suspect Parvo, then say its probably just a bit of flu and a tummy bug, and allow the kitten home knowing there was another kitten at home, I just cannot get my head round it.

[Sparks_]

I wonder what the ladys old cat died of? Could the kittens have caught a virus left behind from the old cat?

[Julie Ishers]

I had also thought of that, but the lady is so lovely I do not want to even suggest that, I just feel that I was not given any options to have the babies back, and if the other brother had also had problems then I would hold my hands up even though I would still have no idea what had happened as the babies only see their mummy, they do not go any where near any other of my pets and have a room to themselves with their numerous toys etc, I have never had any illness with my cats, other than an older girl some time ago who had a problem with her kidneys......I am devastated with all of this, I feel ill with worry and saddened with the loss, I had reared the babies played with the babies and loved the babies for 9 weeks, they never had a days problem, then I let them go and they have both died.....devastated x

[Sparks_]

I can understand how upset and devastated you are but I think you have to try and put to one side how nice the lady was and start looking at how you can defend yourself! as you said there is nothing wrong with the 3rd kitten and the two that went to the other lady were ok when they left you, how is the mother cat? She is well? I still would ask the lady what her old cat died of as she did say it was poorly....is there a vet report available for that cat?

[Julie Ishers]

Mum of the kittens is fit and healthy and sprawled on the cushion with my Chihuahua, I know I have to start thinking of me a little, also they brought their relative to my home to choose a kittens some weeks prior to them contacting me for a kitten, she chose 2 !! and they are fit and healthy, I am very lucky as when I do have a litter, they are usually already booked by friends and family who all adore my cats, I only have 3 girls, and one male, they are truly all very well and happy and are pets not business items, they are all part of the family, and after this awful even I had decided not to have another litter, but then I think about the lovely kittens I have and how happy are owners of my cats, ie regular pics and emails, thanking me for a fab family member etc, I did offer to pay towards the vet bills, as I was shocked, but after talking to other breeders, people who breed on a regular basis, some of which shocked me with their responses, ie, 'I would not of even replied to them as they did not inform you until after they had received treatment etc' .... I am in a position where I really do not know what to do.....I want to do what is right but I also will not accept that I willingly allowed the kittens to leave my care knowing they had some kind of virus,

 

I strongly believe that the vet must of thought that kitten one was fine or why would he allow it to return home when there was another kitten there, I feel that I am the one whi has suffered the most as I had nurtured the kittens for all that time only to have 2 die out of my care....I totally agree that it must of been awful for this lady, but she had only had them a short time. I just need to know how to respond, should I offer half of the vet fees as a good ill gesture, or just fight it. though I don't feel like I have much fight in me anymore ;(

Edited March 20, 2014 by citizenB

[Julie Ishers]

I have been so sad about the whole event, that the other night I went to bed hoping that I didn't wake up, and that is not like me.

[steampowered]

As far as I can tell from the POC, there is no obvious legal basis for the claim made against you. Unfortunately this kind of thing does happen - young animals sometimes get sick and die.

 

I think you need to file a Defence briefly explaining the health of the kitten when they were sold, stating that the kittens were sold in accordance with the sale contract and denying liability for the vet's fees. Be careful not to miss the deadlines.

[Julie Ishers]

Thankyou for that, it is so nice to hear that someone understands my dilemma ...... I can get so many letters from people who have had a kitten from me in the past to say just how much love and care my pets receive, I love them more than humans, and would never wish any harm or illness on them, most people come back for another and another ! I have a lady who now has 4 of mine and is still wanting another, she states she has never had such loving beautiful cats, I sleep with the kittens in their room till they are 3 weeks old, then start to wean them on the most expensive food I can buy, I never have a holiday as I wont leave the pets, I devote every moment of my life to them, and this awful situation has deeply hurt and saddened me, I did inform the lady that one of the kittens had vomited rwice on the day they came to collect them and would of been more than happy to keep them both in my care until there was no sign of sickness, but again this can happen when they are treated with worming solution, I know I have to fight, but I feel very low about the whole event, and do not want to cause any more upset for the lovely lady.

[Desperate Daniella]

Hi Julie,

 

You said you offered to help with the vet fees? Did they ever respond to that?

 

Also, before starting a Claim they are supposed to send a Letter Before Claim setting out what they are asking for and why. Did you ever receive anything like that before you got the MCOL?

 

I agree that the vet's treatment of the first kitten is puzzling. If the kitten had parvo, or even symptoms which could have indicated parvo, she should not have sent him home.

 

DD

[Desperate Daniella]

I know you think she is a lovely lady, but if she just started a MCOL without any attempt to negotiate some payment towards the veterinary fees, especially as you had offered to do this, I don't think she is that lovely!

[renegadeimp]

I thought a pre-req of using mcol was you must have exhausted other means of restitution? I have my concerns that the new owners have done something to the animals, and are now looking for their money back and for you to pay their bills.

[Julie Ishers]

I replied to an email stating that I would contribute to the vets fees as I was very upset about it all, I had also paid her in full for the 2 kittens, she just sent an email with the receipts from the vets, and did not state if she would consider a contribution, I have n ever had any letter sent to me setting out what she would like as I would of responded immediately, just this official notice I received on Tuesday......I also read that there should of been some sort of mediation offered? I might be wrong on that but I did read it somewhere, she had my address so she could of hand written to me but I have not had anything. I had forwarded the emails from her to my new email account as I had cancelled the other one as I was getting awful messages from my ex husband, I am so glad I kept her emails or I would of had no proof of what she had said, especially about the vets stating that it was probably this and that, and then letting him go home to the other kitten.......

[Julie Ishers]

Again can I thank you for your help. it is the first time I have smiled this week, it has all knocked me for six...thankyou

[Julie Ishers]

I would say hand on heart that the lady did not do anything to the kittens, they were so happy to have them, I cannot say what has happened and just wish they had had a post mortem done on at least one of them, but I understand how upsetting that can be, it is a mystery. one that no one can truly say what has happened.

[Desperate Daniella]

I think you said you can't actually read the vet's bills. You should ask her to send you clear photocopies of them.

 

She was certainly supposed to attempt a settlement before issuing the Claim.

 

You have 14 days to respond to the Court by sending back the Acknowledgment and I think you should do that now, putting Defend All in the relevant box.