Long term casual worker and sending of P45

[resources]

1.

it is post number 43

 

2.

I would like to add that another finding of my research in the library is that in case of breach of a contractual disciplinary procedure I can claim also for the work that I would have done during the time the disciplinary procedure would have lasted if my employer would have used it against me and this even though I do not have one month continuity to claim for non-compliance with the one week notice.

[resources]

I would like to know if the disciplinary procedure for casual workers applies also during my probation period according to the following information about it?

 

1. It is not made any reference to the probation period in this disciplinary procedures for casual workers

 

2. It is stated in this disciplinary procedure that it applies to all casual workers

 

3. I signed this disciplinary procedure at the start of my probation period and not at its end

 

4. In the terms & conditions it is stated that there is a different pay rate during the probation period.

 

5. This disciplinary procedure concerns also poor quality of work and low productivity and not only bad behaviour

 

6. Casual workers can also misconduct during their probation period so there should also be some kind of disciplinary procedure covering also this period and there was only disciplinary procedure for casual workers

[becky2585]

Either post the redacted procedure or the text from it. Nobody can help you any further without that.

[resources]

The defendant should have filed and served on me its defence by the beginning of last month but it made an application for a 28 days extension to file its defence.

 

 

Therefore the defendant should have filed and served on me its defence by the beginning of this month.

 

 

However the defence has not yet been served on me.

Therefore today I phoned to the County Court Money Claims Centre which told me that the defendant instead of filing a defence has made an application to have my claim strike out.

 

However the defendant has not filed on me a copy of this application to strike out my claim with its evidence

 

I would like to know if the defendant should have served on me a copy of this application to strike out with its evidence

 

I would like to know if the fact that the defendant has made this application to strike out my claim removes its duty to file a defence on time.

[martin2006]

What is the claim all about?, impossible to offer any help with no facts.

 

Could you post the Particulars of claim you have filed without any identifying info please?

[BankFodder]

...and why haven't you applied for judgment?

[BazzaS]

If they are requesting strike out of your claim, that is a defence of sorts (they are claiming that your PofC has no grounds for success).

 

Likelihood they'll succeed? Who knows without seeing the grounds in their application and your PofC.

 

CPR 24 deals with summary judgment, including when they can't be sought.

CPR 23.4 deals with service of an application on 'the other side'

[ThedaBara]

...and why haven't you applied for judgment?

 

You can't apply for default judgement once they have made an application to strike out... TB

[dx100uk]

usual game with this user

never ever tells us the full story

loads of like threads already

 

 

dx

[cchange]

Strike out and or summary judgement is the pitfall of starting a small claim as they occur just before allocation to track meaning costs can be claimed for.

It is possible and it happens all the time leaving the losing side down by £1500+ (the applicant applies for more but has difficulty getting it through due to cost basis) only a few weeks after the claim is started.

 

In these circumstances, judges seem to dispense with all the service rules and paperwork, witness statements, skeleton arguments etc are served days or minutes before the hearing.

[resources]

I split my thread into two parts

 

I have a contract called a ‘zero hours contract’ with a new firm. I was offered a two-week project. Unfortunately my supervisor did not like something on me and I was removed from the project at the end of the first day but without providing me with any good justification that I frustrate the performance of the contract.

 

Issue number 1 is that my contract does contain a clause which says that my employer reserve the right to withdraw any work offered to me and already accepted by me

 

1.

I would like to know if I can claim for breach of contract for the remainder of the two weeks because I heard that ‘zero-hours contract’ do not have a specific meaning in law because there is no statutory definition of them and all depends of the terms of our contract. However my contract contrary to other zero hours contracts does not contain a clause where it is stated that my employer reserves the right to cancel the work that he has offered and has already been accepted by the casual worker

 

So what could be the difference between a zero hours contract which has such a clause and one which does not have it. The issue is what happens to the zero hours contracts which do not have such a clause? Does this mean that the employer can remove the work that he has offered to the casual worker and which has already been accepted by the casual worker only if he has good reasons which frustrate the contract and make impossible the performance of the assignment for example the assignment is completed earlier than expected or the casual worker performs very badly his work and is in breach of contract himself for this reason?

 

2.

Terms in my contract require me to confirm my availability to do an assignment and to notify immediately if I am unable to work hours agreed if I have accepted an offer of work. However my contract does not set out the terms that will apply where work has been offered by the employer, accepted by the casual worker and them withdrawn by the employer. I would like to know if these terms are not missing in my contract and give me rights to compensation for breach of contract for having been removed from the project the first day without any proper justification

 

3.

I would like to know if there is not also a problem of basic contract law about offer and acceptance because one term of my contract says my employer is under no obligation to offer me work and me I am under no obligation to accept work. However the issue is what happened when work has been offered and has been accepted by the casual worker because I heard that according to contract law when an offer is made and it has been accepted there is a binding contract?

 

4.

In these circumstances I would like to know if my employer has not understood the difference between the right to offer work and the right to refuse it and the right to withdraw work which has already been offered and has already been accepted by the casual worker?

 

ISSUE NUMBER 2 is to know if I was offered one day work only by my employer or the entire project in order to determine if he has complied with his promise to offer me the work that he promised me before removing me from the project to determine whether or not he was in breach of contract

 

5.

My employer in my contract uses several times the work ‘assignment’ to describe the work offered to me. The issue is what in my contract is meant by the word ‘assignment’? Does it mean a ‘specific task like a project’ or it could be only one hour work during a shift?

 

If my employer could remove me from a project when he wishes it would mean that each separate hour of work is a separate assignment and because in my contract it is stated that a normal shift is seven hours and I am paid by hours this would mean that I perform seven different assignments during a shift

 

My employer in his email makes reference to the duration of the project and he told me that it will be two weeks. My employer asks me if I would be available for the entire project.

 

My employer could says that he does not have any obligation to provide me with a minimum number of hours of work but I was entirely removed from the project after the first day what is a different matter that cancelling shifts occasionally for operational reasons. Moreover the other casual workers remained in the project because the project was not terminated

 

By removing me from the project my employer made impossible the performance of the contract i.e. the possibility of giving me work even if he wishes. Once I was removed from the project this issue of giving me work only if he wishes is redundant

When at the end of the first day I was removed from the project my employer told me that he has to cancel all my shifts for this project

 

6.

Another issue is what could be the intended meaning of ‘work or hours of work’ used in a term of my contract. I have googgled this expression but I found nothing. I would like to know if ‘work’ means a specific task like a project and ‘hours of work’ means that a project is not given to me to do but I can be asked to work on it occasionally

 

7.

I would like to know if what matter is the expectation of the parties to a contract because I could have refused to work for another company to work for this company because my employer causes me to believe that I will do a two-week project because there is no clause in our contract which says that he can remove me from a project at his discretion without any good reasons after I have already accepted the work offered to me.

[BazzaS]

Is this hypothetical? Real?

 

I ask as because of your previous (mostly land law questions), and previous concerns that you were looking for people to do your law coursework for you.

 

On the one hand people seeking advice from CAG shouldn't feel put off. On the other, how many complex legal questions can one person have before "are they trying to get us to do their coursework?" becomes a legitimate question??

[obiter dictum]

Having done quite a few over the last few years i can spot a legal problem solving question when i see it as part of course work, but stand to be corrected

[BazzaS]

Just in case this is a "real world" question and the OP is after 'advice' rather than coursework:

 

Ask if there is any work for you with a different supervisor.

If not : move on.

 

As for you turning down other work to take up the first placement : that is a risk that comes with any 'temp' work and isn't actionable on its own.

 

Apologies if you feel these replies aren't accompanied by the level of explanation I usually provide. "advice" vs. "Coursework" and all ......

[resources]

It is real. I am currently negotiating with my employer. I would like to prove him that he is wrong and to convince him to pay me the remainder of the two weeks or better to take me back and it is why I need advice from your.

 

I think that my thread raises interesting issues about employment law

[BazzaS]

Likelihood they'll take you back working with that supervisor : next to nil, hence why I said about seeing if they have any other work with a different supervisor.

 

If there is no alternative work under a different supervisor, likelihood that you'll get a successful claim for any amount making it worth the time & effort required : also approaching nil.

Hence the real world advice offered.

 

Just because it raises interesting issues (hey, didn't you try that slant on things on at least one of your land law threads?) doesn't mean the real world advice will be any different ....... so if potential contributors want to offer advice and not risk doing your coursework, they might choose to give advice without getting into "interesting discussions"...

 

Again, it comes down to which is more important to you, the advice or the discussion.

[resources]

You say that my chance are 'nil' can you please expand

 

I am interesting in both the advice and the discussion

 

As I say it is real. Moreover there is no chance of anyone doing a potentiial course work because I ask only a short advice and not that someone write several pages of course work

[honeybee13]

How did you get the job, resources, was it direct or via an agency?

 

HB

[BazzaS]

You say that my chance are 'nil' can you please expand

 

Sorry, not 'expanding', for the reasons already stated.

If others disagree with my advice, they can give their advice (with or without reasons).

 

If others agree, they can say so (again with or without their explanation).

 

I'm content with offering advice and not doing your coursework (neither in detail NOR in brief) for you.

[sangie5952]

Employment law 101 - irrespective of any contractual status, employment during the first month can be terminated without notice. For any reason that does not fall within the limited exceptions.

[sangie5952]

It is real. I am currently negotiating with my employer. I would like to prove him that he is wrong and to convince him to pay me the remainder of the two weeks or better to take me back and it is why I need advice from your.

 

I think that my thread raises interesting issues about employment law

 

He is right. You are wrong. And no it doesn't.

[resources]

I got this job directly and not through an agency

 

According to employment law it is necessary to have at least two years service to claim unfair dismissal and to have at least one month service to claim for breach of contract for non payment of notice. However I do not want to claim for unfair dismissal or for non-payment of notice. I want to claim for breach of contract for the remainder of the two weeks that I could not work

 

This issue of work being cancelled often without notice is very important for people on zero hours contract. Therefore this issue of whether or not an employer needs to have a clause in the zero hours contract which says that he reserves the right to withdraw work which has been offered even if it has already been accepted by the casual worker is an important, unexplored and interesting issue. Some zero hours contract have such a clause and other have not it so what could be the difference?

 

There are so many people on zero hours contract so this issue could be important for many users of this forum

[honeybee13]

I agree. I see you had another thread about breach of contract on a zero hours contract. Could you tell us how that went please?

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?469394-Breach-of-contract-in-a-zero-hours-contract

 

HB

[sangie5952]

The terms of zero hours contracts are actually quite well determined in law. This is, however, a red herring. Regardless of ANY type of contract, an employer has the right to dismiss with immediate effect in the first month WHATEVER the offered contract consists of. That has nothing at all to do with unfair dismissal. It has to do with the law. The OP may not like the law, but they aren't going to change it.

 

However, if it is the case that they cannot manage to last more than a day or two in a job, then they perhaps need to address greater concerns. Such as what is wrong with their performance.

[BazzaS]

Or, why they keep getting into complex legal situations (zero hour contract dismissals Sept 2016 and now) and complex lease queries.

 

You were advised about the leases ; if they are that complex, and you don't trust the LL's - rent elsewhere. Yet, you asked more than once (aparently about a different property the 2nd time, too)

 

2 different complex leases? Dismissal from 2 different zero hours contracts?

 

You've been advised about the zero hours contracts (the previous threads & this one) : don't (start to) fight a loosing battle.

 

You say you want advice : but you don't seem to want to take it when it's offered....... multiple times now.

You say you want discussion : but on that last zero hours contract thread it was noted that what you meant by "discussion" wasn't discussion but instead : asking the same question over and over - hoping to get the answer you wanted.