advice please on jsa sanction re work programme appointment

[arkasha]

My tale of woe....I am a lone parent on jsa and am also attending the work programme.I have restricted hours(school time) on my jsa agreement. When I received my last work programme appointment letter I telephoned their office straight away explaining that the appointment time meant that I wouldn't be home in time for my daughter finishing primary school and asked if I could rearrange it...the lady that I spoke to said that was fine and that another appointment would be sent out to me.Fast forward...I received a doubt letter from the dwp stating that I hadn't attended said appointment so I wrote back with the above explanation and enclosed a copy of my phone record showing the call I had made to the work programme office...The response I got back was that "this is not a good enough reason" and that I have been sanctioned for a month.It does say that I can appeal but I am wondering if it is worth it as I don't know what more I could add to my original letter.Totally stressed and would greatly appreciate any advise especially as to what I have done wrong as I genuinely thought that I had followed the correct procedures.

[Mr.P]

Appeal again - DWP guidance issued to all providers clearly state that allowances must be made for people with care responsibilities, this extends to single parents with small children as well as others looking after disabled and/or elderly relatives.

 

 

http://http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/wp-pg-chapter-3a-22-october-2012.pdf

4. The following steps must be taken on every occasion you want to mandate a participant to do something:

• Ensure that the activity is reasonable in the participant's circumstances.
  

[...]

21. Any known restrictions the participants has will be detailed in the participant's referral. For example, in some circumstances, participants with health conditions, participants with childcare responsibilities or carers may have restictions to the days and hours for which they are available[...]

Any disclosed disadvantage(s) and associated commitments for example drug/alcohol treatment/probation requirements that may limit availability.

Quote the above text drawn from Chapter 3a of the DWP issued provider guidance. Point out that you have restrictions placed on available hours as noted in the JSAg and you do not accept being punished for the providers negligence in failing to acknowledge childcare responsibilities.

 

 

Your only mistake was not getting conformation of the change in appointment in writing - In future, demand written acceptance of changes from the provider and record ALL conversations.

Edited August 3, 2013 by Mr.P

[Mr.P]

When I received my last work programme appointment letter

 

Just a thought - Was the appointment mandatory and include all the correct words in this letter (see Annex A in https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/reque...0final%203.pdf) ?

[arkasha]

Thank you very much Mr P for your response........the letter is worded correctly......but I have taken note of your information and will use it in my appeal.As a matter of interest its now two months ago since I was told that I would be sent another appointment letter but as I haven't received anything yet I was wondering if it is okay to leave it until they eventually do get in touch or is the onus on me to get in touch with them again....after what has happened I just want to keep myself right.

[dyfed]

Yet another reason not to give them my telephone number. Conduct all correspondence by mail, build up the paper tail and evidence. Get every request, mandation on paper.

 

Hope the OP gets the fair result they deserve. Good luck.

[Mr.P]

I have taken note of your information and will use it in my appeal.As a matter of interest its now two months ago since I was told that I would be sent another appointment letter but as I haven't received anything yet I was wondering if it is okay to leave it until they eventually do get in touch or is the onus on me to get in touch with them again....after what has happened I just want to keep myself right.

 

Looks like the link to chapter-3a-22-october-2012.pdf got mucked up bit. On reading that document again, I note:

42. If prior to a participant undertaking a mandated activity, they contact you because they are unable to undertake the activity, you may choose to re-arrange the activity and not follow the compliance doubt process.

You had a verbal agreement to rearrange the appointment due to reasons already given (childcare responsibilities) - The fact that the provider ignores DWP issued guidance demonstrates cavalier attitude towards due process and duty of care towards participants.

 

You say the appointment was two months ago, how long since you received the letter from the DWP about the sanction and outcome of any reconsideration/appeal ?

 

It is the provider's responsibility to "re-engage" you, so unless you are desperate to attend one of their "meetings", wait for them to contact you. Save the money you might have spent on a phone call or stamp.

[atum2013]

It is the providers responsibility to re engage and these appointments are tracked on computer. If your WP provider is Ingeus or one of its partners then that systems called ingeusworks, you may have heared staff swearing at it if youve been in centre a few times.

Your WP provider is responsible for providing travel expenses AND child care expenses, as well as being required to take these things into consideration. They frequently try and wriggle out of the childcare costs, it simply doesnt get mentioned and i know of quiet arrangements in place with JCP and local WP providers to simply not mention it. Information is available on the DWP website and this has been the case since day one of the programme .Payments only made to registered child carers, but you have always been entitled to it.

The fact that the sanction was raised is more to do with the financial benefit to the WP provider, and to their monthly stats, they are monitored on attendance rates/absences and hence sanctions raised.

[atum2013]

Its sad but I have frequently seen examples of peoples circumstances not being taken into consideration with regard to appointments. I know of people in rural locations, their situation well documented with provider, but having sanctions raised as they did not attend an appointment that was at a time there was no way they could attend as they were reliant on public transport to make a 30 mile round trip to get in. First bus he could catch at 9.40. Arrives about 10.15. Poor lad keeps getting appointments for 9 am.

[Charlotte_Henderson]

My tale of woe....I am a lone parent on jsa and am also attending the work programme.I have restricted hours(school time) on my jsa agreement. When I received my last work programme appointment letter I telephoned their office straight away explaining that the appointment time meant that I wouldn't be home in time for my daughter finishing primary school and asked if I could rearrange it...the lady that I spoke to said that was fine and that another appointment would be sent out to me.Fast forward...I received a doubt letter from the dwp stating that I hadn't attended said appointment so I wrote back with the above explanation and enclosed a copy of my phone record showing the call I had made to the work programme office...The response I got back was that "this is not a good enough reason" and that I have been sanctioned for a month.It does say that I can appeal but I am wondering if it is worth it as I don't know what more I could add to my original letter.Totally stressed and would greatly appreciate any advise especially as to what I have done wrong as I genuinely thought that I had followed the correct procedures.

 

What utter idiots they are!

 

Of course it is worth appealing especially if you are losing benefits over it.

 

A friend of mine has also been sanctioned except his is for 3 months as he missed 2 appointments.

 

First one cos he was ill with sick and diarrhoea, and couldn't leave the house, he phoned ingeus and explained the situation and his advisor was fine with it and told him he wouldnt get into trouble and he'd simply

 

Make him a new appointment..

 

Waited for new appointment to arrive in post but it never did, 3 weeks later he phoned them to ask what had happened to his appointment,

 

and advisor said oh we sent you one the next day. you should of been here last wednesday. because you didn't turn up and because you didn't turn up to the other appointment aswell, you're getting sanctioned

 

for 3 months....

 

He has appealed but lost his appeal and now has to go without for 3 months

Edited August 6, 2013 by Charlotte_Henderson
spelling

[Zamzara]

If they agreed to rearrange, then there was no failure to attend, that's all there is to it. Good reason therefore isn't a factor.

 

Apply for a hardship payment (which will be a reduced amount) and appeal the sanction as well - to a proper tribunal, not just the DWP's own reconsideration.

[Charlotte_Henderson]

If they agreed to rearrange, then there was no failure to attend, that's all there is to it.

 

Totally agree with 100% shame they dont see the same way, if you have phoned in and asked to rearrange the appointment how can you havew failed to attend?

 

I once heard my advisor on the phone to someone who couldn't make their appointment the next day. he told the person on the phone yes no problem, we can rearrange and no you wont get into trouble for it. soon as he got off the phone he rung the JC to report them...

 

What lovely people they are NOT!!!

[Mr.P]

I once heard my advisor on the phone to someone who couldn't make their appointment the next day. he told the person on the phone yes no problem, we can rearrange and no you wont get into trouble for it. soon as he got off the phone he rung the JC to report them...

 

I would have been sitting there with pen and paper in hand (along with a tape recorder running) making a note of the name of the claimant and "adviser". On returning home, writing a letter to the DWP reporting a blatant breach of client confidentiality and naming names - Something I have done on at least two occasions which, judging by "adviser" reactions at subsequent meetings, resulted in backsides being kicked from a higher level