PPI: About to take on HSBC

[dx100uk]

no

 

see no.1. below

 

dx

[slinky252]

[ATTACH]44429[/ATTACH]

 

Hi Guys,

 

I am going to respond back to hsbc regards there offer which i feel is incorrect. just wanted to know which is the best way around this.

 

i paid off the loan with a consolidation of another loan but dont know exactly when.

 

i also requested a sar from hsbc and this information is not in it because they could only give me records back to 2006. this surprises me when they worked out there redress when they dont have any details of it.

 

Anyway what i propose to do is resend back the statement with the loan amount and this also shows the £1173.93 front loaded ppi. I will also send them a statement which shows how much i paid back on the loan monthly along with a sreadsheet off your site showing the monthly part of the ppi paid over the full 48 months. I think was the term of the loan which would have completed in 2004 and again before any of the details they sent in my requested sar.

 

I will also put down in the letter the way i have worked out the part payment of the ppi in the monthly payment.

 

Please find new spreadsheet i will send attached.

 

Also guys even though i dont know when i settled this loan and the fact that they did not send any details of it in the sar would this be the best way to respond to get the right amount back.

 

And are my calculations correct.

 

Thanks again for all your great advice.

[ims21]

Ask them for a full and detailed breakdown of their offer.

 

You won't be able to work out the correct figure unless you know what date the loan was repaid and whether there was any PPI rebate given at that point. Their detailed figures may help you establish that.

[slinky252]

Thanks ims will do,

 

Best to respond in writing yes?

 

Ims if you request a sar, should all this info be in there, i mean i dont understand what figures they work off if they have no info and if they do have data of this kind why did i not recieve it in the sar. to me it all seems a bit strange how this all works?

[ims21]

Hi

 

Yes...absolutely everything in writing. If ever you need to get fos involved you will have a paper trail of events which demonstrate the behaviour of the bank.

 

A SAR should include ALL data they hold on you (unless your SAR just specified specific information you wanted).

 

When you get their detailed breakdown you can compare the data they have used to the data you got from the SAR. If they have clearly used older data then you need to question them as to why it wasn't supplied and then lodge a formal complaint to the Information Commissioner.

 

What you need to remember is that banks have absolutely no interest in dealing with their customers (victims) fairly. They will do all they can to frustrate a process which is going to cost them money, although of course they are more than happy to have fantastic and efficient processes in place to relieve you of yours!

 

They will interpret the Limitations Act to suit their own ends and attempt to get away with things that are just not correct.

 

As I have said, there are threads on here where older data has been obtained when the banks have been pressed or threatened with legal action to force compliance with the Data Protection Act. Indeed there are cases where they have played their game right into court and then lost.

 

Remember ....... Never Trust A Bank.

[slinky252]

Great Ims thanks for this,

 

I have a few more questions sorry.

 

shall i include in my letter that i have still not recieved any offer on my credit card ppi that went in 17 weeks ago same time as the loan or keep issues i have with them seperate?

 

i requested a full sar and there is no data regards the loan whatsover should i remind them that i had a full sar and why was this data not given to me within the sar and thus i have grounds to lodge a formal complaint to the information comissioner or should i be patient and hold fire?

 

Sorry i am just eager to put some weight behind this because i dont think they are playingf ball at all.

[ims21]

I'd keep the two separate myself. If they have taken 17 weeks then that is more than double the time allowed. Demand from them that they refund you within 7 days or you will immediately refer it to fos which will cost them another £850 for a fos case fee.

 

I'd hold fore on the SAR bit.....see what they come up with as a result of your demand for the detailed breakdown. If it is clear that they have referred to old data then they have shot themselves in the foot and you can then provide evidence to the ICO that they have deliberately misled you and failed to provide data which they had and to which you were entitled.

[slinky252]

Thanks loads, will keep CAG posted

[slinky252]

Hi Team,

 

Still no answer on credit card which fast becoming a joke, but i have received a so called detailed breakdown from them regarding the loan front loaded ppi and it reads like this.

 

APR 13.9%

Amount of loan facility £5600

Loan term 60 months

PPI Paid 53 %

Monthly premium excluding ppi £128.00

Payment protection payable £1172.0

Monthly premium including ppi £154.00

Total ppi cost £849.00

Protection start date october 2000

Protection cancellation date may 2002

Calculation date june 2013

 

PPI REDRESS £872.83

Plus taxable interest at 8% £790.74

 

Total £1663.57

 

This info is not in the SAR and also there is no rebate in the breakdown, if i finalised the loan in 2002 have they got this right. The front loaded ppi amount was £1172.00 and would a rebate included in breakdown be able for me to calculate the right award i am to recieve.

 

What do you reckon is my next move ICO? OR ACCEPT?

Edited July 4, 2013 by slinky252

[ims21]

You need to get hem to confirm the amount of PPI rebate at the point the loan was settled.

[slinky252]

Hi Guys,

 

I was speaking with a lady at hsbc data compliance yesterday and asked them about what they have regards my credit card

because they are taking so long to give me an offer,

 

they told me they do not hold anything longer than 2005 and nothing on microfish.

 

Also stated that other banks may do but hsbc dont.

 

i asked how come they can give me an offer on a loan from 2000 when they dont have the info, you will have to ask the ppi team.

 

They still have not given me an answer on confirmation of the rebate at the point the loan was settled

been 24 weeks now since original complaint.

 

Starting to lose patience with them.

 

they sent a letter back saying they are looking into it regards the credit card ppi but nothing since that letter dated 17th june.

 

said i have the right to go to fos due to taking longer than 8 weeks

but they state that there is no regulated service level agreement in respect of time limits for further responses.

why are they stalling,

they have a few statements from me from 1997 to 2006 and they are taking ages.

 

how do i get this going a little faster with them?

 

When i asked the data complaiance lady that i have heard other people have recieved data back to 1989/90 she said if the account has been closed like mine has then its to 2005 for people with active accounts its different. Also asked about destructon certificates for data of mine they have destroyed she also dismissed this.

 

just in need of some advice to kick them up the backside now guys.

Edited July 19, 2013 by slinky252

[slinky252]

also guys i still cant get my head round compound interest and 8% simple. Am i entitled to compound interest on every payment i have made , because this bumps up your claim considerably, can someone put to me in simple terms so i can finally get my head round this.

 

For example on my loan for one payment on 6th november 2000 my first payment back on my loan with ppi is ppi premium that month £26 so £26 at 13.9% interest on the loan 12 compounded monthly based on a 360 day year to todays date is total amount due £156.10 accrued interest of £130.10. thats just on one payment i understand without 8 % simple either.

 

I am using a calculator on your site to get these figures http://www.egalegal.com/compoundWindow.html

 

For my credit card i have a payment of £3.28 purely a ppi premium payment on the 20th june 1997 and this works out to £83.41 with interest accrued at £80.13 on a 20% rate of interest again without 8% simple. looking at these i would have a substantial claim, so why does my first offer on my loan not include compound interest which would bump it up well a lot.

 

Is this something i should send them in a spreadsheet or am i completely wrong on this issue.

 

sorry if i am being completely stupid regards this matter.

[dx100uk]

loans and credit cards are diff.

 

loans

unless you can prove the monthly outstanding bal had the loans int rate charged EVERY MONTH [compounded int]

then you can only claim back the PPI portion of EACH monthly payment at 8% stat int

[as you have already paid the loan int in the PPI portion of you repayment [cant reclaim 'twice' the int]]

 

credit cards

 

they charged int at their rate EVERY MONTH

so you can claim compounded int in return.

however.

if for some reason [say the card closed, or int was stopped]

 

you can only claim CI to that point.

 

from that point till today, you can claim 8% stat on the CI total.

 

see the links below

 

dx

[dx100uk]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?330996-Latest-Spreadsheets-PPI-Claims-and-Charges-Claims-Dec-2011

 

our spreadsheets

 

dx

[slinky252]

Thanks dx,

 

i had this card from 1995 to 2007 which was when i finally stopped using it and paid off in full. so i can claim compound interest from 1995 when i opened the card to 2007 and then 8 % simple on the total i get from the compound interest between 95 and 2007 is that correct?

 

also is what i worked out earlier today seem correct re the credit card it does look like it could be a substantial claim if correct?

[slinky252]

Hi Guys,

 

Just sending a letter to hsbc explaining to them regarding the offer they have given to me on the personal loan

they say will be used to pay off my debt on a dmp.

 

i have part of my debt with metropolitan collection services, which was only for an overdraft and nothing to do with my loan or credit card which were both settled in full.

 

Is the statement i am writing in my letter correct before i send it.

 

I have spoken with fos but just want to make clear what offsetting against notified arrears means.

 

Does this mean that the debt on the dmp is not anything to do with the loan or card and so any refund should come to me.

 

The statement i have put in the letter is as follows:-

 

With regards to the offer on the personal loan,

you have stated that this will be used to reduce the outstanding debt with HSBC,

 

after again getting advice from FOS; they have advised me that this is not correct.

 

You can only offset against notified arrears.

 

The outstanding debt I have with you on my DMP is for an overdraft I had with you and has nothing to do with the Personal loan and credit cards I had with you, which were both settled.

 

This also puts you at an unfair advantage against other creditors within my DMP. This is all stated within FOS guidelines.

 

Thanks for any help.

[dx100uk]

as already explained

if it was with the same banking group they can offset

 

if the debt has been sold however they cannot.

 

who is the DMP with/

 

dx

[slinky252]

hi dx,

 

The dmp is with stepchange (CCCS) And shown on that has metropolitan collection services. FOS said that they can only pay off any arrears with that are to do with whatever they miss sold you and because the overdraft is nothing to do with the settled loan or card then the money will go to me, there is a link even on here in which involves metropolitan collections and this states something you posted. the link is below.

 

i guess where i am confused is offsetting against notified arrears is that what the overdraft debt is, notified arrears ?

 

 

 

 

and with fos saying they cant offset it against debt for an overdraft when the ppi in question is regarding products that have been settled.

 

whos correct

 

apologies if im being a bit thick here, but now i am confused

 

heres the link to that thread

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?325417-ppi-claim-to-be-paid-to-HSBC-METROPOLITAN-COLLECTIONS

Edited July 27, 2013 by slinky252

[citizenB]

I think you will probably have more luck pushing the fact that you have other debts which should also benefit from this refund. You have the statement from the Financial Ombudsman which also clearly points this out. .

 

Is the overdraft still with them, even though you are paying it via a DMP ?

[citizenB]

I would think they could probably claim that an overdraft is all arrears, but IMHO and obviously according to the FOS, even though you do have a debt with them. They should not be allowed to prioritise their debt over others.

[slinky252]

!!

Edited July 28, 2013 by slinky252

[citizenB]

Sorry, your post does not make any sense

[dx100uk]

the fos are correct in what are saying

 

they can offset against notified arrears

 

I wonder if you have been getting NOSIN [notice of sums in arrears] letters?

 

dx

[slinky252]

Thanks guys,

 

i have not been receiving NOSIN letters. Only my dmp update sheet every month, which shows what is happening to my debt. Which thankfully is coming down a lot. I have been on this dmp for 4 years now.

 

So this overdraft that is the only debt i had with HSBC, now with metropolitan (Which i believe is part of HSBC). Can they use the award off the personal loan ppi to pay off the overdraft debt on the dmp. Even though FOS stated they can not pay off debt from ppi that has nothing to do with the product they miss sold you on.

 

Cant Imagine that FOS are incorrect on this point ? just getting different points on here, And not really a clear answer on this issue from peoples experiences on here ? I would feel that the FOS answer is the correct one?

Edited July 28, 2013 by slinky252

[slinky252]

Found this quote on which also

 

If you're in a debt management plan

If you receive a PPI refund, it's likely the lender will want to knock the refund off whatever you owe them. Any surplus will be returned to you.

 

As debts are not usually written off under a DMP, but rather are rescheduled, a PPI refund will help you in the long run by reducing any outstanding arrears and meaning you'll pay off your debt quicker. This could be of particular help to people with mortgages who are at risk of repossession.

 

Una Farrell of free debt advice charity Consumer Credit Counselling Service (CCCS) said: 'While any funds received as part of a claim would be claimed as part of the IVA or bankruptcy, someone on a debt management plan could probably keep it. CCCS would advise them to do full and final settlement where possible.'