someone please give advice for large catalogue debts

[vonny1]

Thanks,

I dont think I've ever signed anything, and made the orders originally by telephone not filling in an order form.

 

Hi Brigadier, I'm not sure what you mean, of course I would of had to of ordered goods from the catalogue companies

or I wouldn't have a debt with them now.

 

Most of the advice given to me on here has been to send a CCA request to both catalogue companies,

and if they cant produce one signed by myself then the account would be in disrepute.

 

Are you saying that this is only worth doing if goods had been ordered and no payment was ever made to pay off the goods?.

 

I have offered the catalogues as much as I can afford

 

many thanks

[paulwlton]

The contract appears to be unenforceable.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Catalogoue accounts even currently have this method of opening an account over the phone online or by post, they very simply state that on acceptance ofbthe first order has been accepted a ''credit account'' is opened for you and there is usually a copy of the T&Cs included with the first order.

 

The arguments I'm afaid that suchh accounts are unenforceable are misleading to say the least.

You are doing the right thing by offering an affordable amount and asking for interest to be frozen.

[paulwlton]

Catalogoue accounts even currently have this method of opening an account over the phone online or by post, they very simply state that on acceptance ofbthe first order has been accepted a ''credit account'' is opened for you and there is usually a copy of the T&Cs included with the first order.

 

The arguments I'm afaid that suchh accounts are unenforceable are misleading to say the least.

You are doing the right thing by offering an affordable amount and asking for interest to be frozen.

 

The agreement was entered into prior to April 2007. The borrower has not signed a requisite agreement. The borrower has not ticked a box post 2005 by online application therefore, the contract is unenforceable.

[Bazooka Boo]

Only a judge can decide if it is unenforceable.

If the catalogue can provide evidence of the account being used by the OP then the outcome wouldn't look too good.

 

The fact that I've never heard of a catalogue debt being taken to court is a different matter entirely, plus it will be full of reclaimable fees/charges which can be reclaimed and the fact that it is a non-priority debt, so can be paid at the rate of £1 a month for the rest of time.

[paulwlton]

Only a judge can decide if it is unenforceable.

If the catalogue can provide evidence of the account being used by the OP then the outcome wouldn't look too good.

 

If theres no compliant agreement the courts have deemeed use of credit funds a gift.

The fact that I've never heard of a catalogue debt being taken to court is a different matter entirely, plus it will be full of reclaimable fees/charges which can be reclaimed and the fact that it is a non-priority debt, so can be paid at the rate of £1 a month for the rest of time.

 

 

I wouldn't pay someone who has levied unlawfull fees and charges a penny more than I needed to.

[vonny1]

So does this mean that obviously there is a debt I'm not trying to deny that,

but as long as I am paying something towards the debts every month even be it just £1,

 

It is extremely unlikely that either catalogue would take me to court (as they know you cant get blood out of a stone).

 

Does this also mean that it would be very unlikely for me to get any CCJs for these debts?.

 

Obviously my credit will be trashed for ever more as by paying a small amount off the debts every month I will probably be in the grave before they are paid off.

 

Sorry if I'm sounding stupid but I am a complete novice in these matters as Ive never been in this position before.

 

Thank you to all for the advice it really is greatly appreciated.

[paulwlton]

Wait until you receive the response from the CCA 78 request, in the mean time look up why agreements are unenforceable.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?105315-Is-My-Agreement-Enforceable-Useful

 

Regards

[vonny1]

thanks I think I understand a bit better now. But to my previous post do you think its likely I will get taken to court as I'm really worried about a Charging Order. many thanks

[paulwlton]

thanks I think I understand a bit better now. But to my previous post do you think its likely I will get taken to court as I'm really worried about a Charging Order. many thanks

 

They are precluded from enforcement until they satisfy your sec 78 cca request. Sit tight and see what they come up with.

 

Take a look at the thread below.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?166878-My-Mrs-v-Barclaycard-***WON***

[vonny1]

Hi I

received a letter from Shop Direct Finance Company (K&co) today.

 

It says , We refer to your recent request for a copy of your credit agreement.

Please find enclosed a copy of your current credit agreement, which includes all applicable contractual variations and amendments that have taken place since your account was opened.

 

It goes on to say my account was opened in 2006

how much I owe and that if the account is not brought up to date I will receive default charges.

 

They have just sent two A4 pieces of paper which are titled,

 

Credit Agreement Regulated By The Consumer Credit Act 1974.

No name or signature.

 

Could someone tell me what my next step is please,

 

Thanks.

 

Heard nothing from Simply Be yet.

[paulwlton]

Hi I received a letter from Shop Direct Finance Company (K&co) today. It says , We refer to your recent request for a copy of your credit agreement. Please find enclosed a copy of your current credit agreement, which includes all applicable contractual variations and amendments that have taken place since your account was opened. It goes on to say my account was opened in 2006 how much I owe and that if the account is not brought up to date I will receive default charges. They have just sent two A4 pieces of paper which are titled, Credit Agreement Regulated By The Consumer Credit Act 1974. No name or signature. Could someone tell me what my next step is please, Thanks. Heard nothing from Simply Be yet.

 

Could you scan and post the agreement/letter. Seems they've failed to satisfy sec 78 as a "true" copy of the original agreement is also required.

 

Paul

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

If they are attempting to pass the off as a ''reconstsituted'' agreement then they have failed.

A recon MUST have Your name and address as at the date it was signed, the same information

for the creditor, the terms and conditions throughout the life of the agreement.

 

So send the following to SD Finance addressed to the Data Controller.

 

 

Ref: use theirs.

 

Sir/ Madam

 

Failure to comply with section 77/78 request under CCA 1974.

 

I am in receipt of SD Finances reply to my request and must immediately reject the alleged reconstitute agreement which fails to meet the parameters laid down for a reconstitute agreement therefore this account is in dispute.

 

No doubt SD Finance should be aware what information is required in regard to a ''reconstituted'' agreement an I would suggest that it should research the case law on this subject, also you should be aware that with pre April 2007 agreements the original document is required to enforce the debt in court.

 

Therefore I do not acknowledge any debt to SD Finance.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Vonny please keep to one thread for this subject.

[vonny1]

Thanks Paul and Brigadier, I will try my best tomorrow to scan and post the agreement they sent me (never done it before) and I will send that letter off to them tomorrow also. It doesn't look like a proper credit agreement just a photo copy of a basic credit agreement with no names dates etc. What is likely to happen after they receive the letter, as I'm sure they wont just write off £10'000. Will they just have to accept the minimum payment I can afford to pay every month?? Thank you so much.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Vonny look at any post by dx100 uk there is a superb explanation on how to handle the attachments, BUT please be careful to remove all personal identifiers, account numbers and barcodes if any.

[paulwlton]

If they are attempting to pass the off as a ''reconstsituted'' agreement then they have failed.

A recon MUST have Your name and address as at the date it was signed, the same information

for the creditor, the terms and conditions throughout the life of the agreement.

 

So send the following to SD Finance addressed to the Data Controller.

 

 

Ref: use theirs.

 

Sir/ Madam

 

Failure to comply with section 77/78 request under CCA 1974.

 

I am in receipt of SD Finances reply to my request and must immediately reject the alleged reconstitute agreement which fails to meet the parameters laid down for a reconstitute agreement therefore this account is in dispute.

 

No doubt SD Finance should be aware what information is required in regard to a ''reconstituted'' agreement an I would suggest that it should research the case law on this subject, also you should be aware that with pre April 2007 agreements the original document is required to enforce the debt in court.

 

Therefore I do not acknowledge any debt to SD Finance.

 

Brig

 

Why do you continue to advise members that pre April 2007 original agreements are required to enforce?

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

A recon merely satisfies a request made under the relevant sections of CCA 1974, a judge MAY decide if a recon is sufficient to conclude that a liability still subsists.

[babydoll0141917]

After 2007 Recons are exceptable in court..PRE 2007 they need the original

[paulwlton]

After 2007 Recons are exceptable in court..PRE 2007 they need the original

 

 

Could you point me to the relevant legislation and/or case law please?

[babydoll0141917]

Could you point me to the relevant legislation and/or case law please?

 

Sorry I cant ..Havent got a clue where it is or would be..Im just going by what Ive read and been told on CAG

[vonny1]

I'm very confused now!!

 

Kays haven't come up with a signed or dated Credit Agreement and

 

my account was opened in 2006 so dose this mean they could take me to court for the debt or not?

 

I'm not sure whether I am to send them the account in dispute letter or not?.

 

As Ive said before I dont want to deny the debt as they are most unlikely to write off £10k,

 

I would just like the peace of mind that they are very unlikely to take me to court for the debt

even though I can only offer £10 per month off the debt,

and give me a CCJ and

then go for a charging order against my house.

 

Please give advice I'm more worried than ever now. Thanks

[paulwlton]

I'm very confused now!! Kays haven't come up with a signed or dated Credit Agreement and my account was opened in 2006 so dose this mean they could take me to court for the debt or not? I'm not sure weather I am to send them the account in dispute letter or not?. As Ive said before I dont want to deny the debt as they are most unlikely to write off £10'000, I would just like the peace of mind that they are very unlikely to take me to court for the debt even though I can only offer £10 per month off the debt, and give me a CCJ and then go for a charging order against my house. Please give advice I'm more worried than ever now. Thanks

 

You have a defence to any claim.....you never signed an agreement and It may be worth advisng them of this in your letter.

 

I advised my other half on four catalougue accounts in 2008. Accordingly she wrote and stated no further payments would be sent and that any further correspondance should be in writing however, you may feel moraly obliged to pay back what you borrowed, that is up to you. Furthermore, a debt becomes statute bared by virtue Sec 5 Limitation Act 1980 if there's a six year gap between yor last payment or acknowlegement (acknowegement MUST be in writing)

 

Paul

[vonny1]

Hi again

 

I have been having a good read on here in the cat section and am confused by it all.

 

A lot of the advice given is that catalogue companies cant do a thing about the debt owed to them

just pay them £1 per month, they wont take you to court and no chance of bailiffs.

 

Then I just read a post that said someone was handed a Statutory Demand at their doorstep

but they had ignored all letters and telephone calls and never paid anything!

 

Is it the case that as long as you are seen to be paying something even a mere £1 they cant touch you,

and if they cant come up with an original signed credit agreement

this just helps deter them from taking you to court??

 

I just want to know whats the worst they can do,

then I might be able to start sleeping again.

 

many thanks for any advice.

[paulwlton]

Hi again I have been having a good read on here in the cat section and am confused by it all. A lot of the advice given is that catalogue companies cant do a thing about the debt owed to them just pay them £1 per month, they wont take you to court and no chance of bailiffs. Then I just read a post that said someone was handed a Statutory Demand at their doorstep but they had ignored all letters and telephone calls and never paid anything! Is it the case that as long as you are seen to be paying something even a mere £1 they cant touch you, and if they cant come up with an original signed credit agreement this just helps deter them from taking you to court?? I just want to know whats the worst they can do, then I might be able to start sleeping again. many thanks for any advice.

 

Read post above.

 

They may try a stat demand but this is easily set-aside with a costs award. Cat agreements are subject to the CC Act therefore they MUST go down the route set out in statute to enforce...they cannot circumvent statute.

 

Regards