HSBC no CCA

[Old Cogger]

Hi Nod

 

6 months on and I return to read your post, thank you.

 

Had a lot going on and little contact with HSBC/Metroplitan since, just letters going back n forth "You owe us", "Er, no I dont" kind of stuff.

 

Now been passed to DG Solicitors (ooooo scary) and their 'Pre-sue Unit', looks like they have never heard of litigation.

 

I am very confident they have no idea when the card was sent out as they have said 'sometime in 1996', 'January 1996' and 'around 1996', the recon sent does not meet the requirements set out in CCA or the conditions Judge Waksman required in the case they won, Carey v HSBC!

 

They are asking me to pay over the phone with a credit card or debit card, thought that was not allowed by the OFT (encouraging the increase in debt)

 

Will probably be on here more often for a while, been really stretched for time in last 7 months

 

 

HSBC idiots for you, such as repeats from that Bank and lack of staff training? DG non solicitors i..e. next desk to metro gits.

[spartathisis]

Well after a number of letters back and forth to DG Solicitors, they insist that the 'recon' and cc statements show an agreement existed!

Yes I know, 'Balance of probabilities', but as I have just informed them the statements show transactions took place and not that a contract exists or ever existed.

 

Yet they also inform me they are passing me onto Credit Security Ltd to 'understand my position and help me work through my difficulties', oh thanks.l

 

Want me to tell them what is not compliant about the 'recon' too! They again avoid answering query's on

data processing, simply referring to 'my contract', presumably the 'recon' with no basic info or mention of data processing either.

 

I have just sent a letter to the data controller to stop data processing and listed the requirements by the ICO and the DPA 1998 & EU Directive 95/46/EC on data processing.

I cannot find any reference to 'implied consent' as previously posted here, only that it must be obtained lawfully and with my knowledge in advance, neither which happened.

 

Has anyone had any success with the CRA and can they direct me to a thread or other info? I have had a search but lots out there (and on CAG) not sure who has success.

 

Ta.

[spartathisis]

Can folks have a quick look at this default notice for me please, not sure if there is anything out of order or not. Looking at the amount to be repaid if the alleged breach is not remedied i.e. not the full amount they say is outstanding but only the overdue bit, does this mean that is all they expect to be paid? Yes it is from last year, but just checking to make sure it is valid, bearing in mind there is no agreement to be found (never signed one) and they sent a recon that had no prescribed t & c's.

 

no guidelines were included either.

 

3 images posted up here:

http://imgur.com/vfaSnVP,x7zZRvE,bLuUA5E

 

Thanks.

[Gallahad]

It appears valid to me as it has none of the usual faults.

G

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Yes the DN is correct, yes all you have to pay is the arrears by 20/06/ had you done so no default will be placed..

[spartathisis]

What about the 'will terminate the agreement without further notice to you, demand immediate payment of the monies due being £1089.10 together with accruing interest'? This is the amount required to remedy the breach, surely the whole amount becomes due on termination?

 

Thanks for reply.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

What about the 'will terminate the agreement without further notice to you, demand immediate payment of the monies due being £1089.10 together with accruing interest'? This is the amount required to remedy the breach, surely the whole amount becomes due on termination?

 

Thanks for reply.

That is what happens if the default is not remedied.

[spartathisis]

yes, but they are not asking for the whole amount to be repaid if the breach is not remedied, just the overdue amount. They terminated the agreement and then said you have to repay the 'money due' and stated an amount = £1089.10.

 

What I want to know is this correct, it doesn't make sense (to me at least) that the amount they are asking for after termination is not the total but a lesser amount.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

You are reading this out of context I think to remedy the breach, pay £aaaaa if you don't remedy the whole amount becomes due on termination, ie £6K +

[spartathisis]

Yes that it what I think it should be, dont remedy pay the overdue amount (£1089.10), but it states in writing that by not paying £1089.10 (the breach) once it is terminated then £1089.10 + interest is due. That is where I feel there is an error, it surely should say £6k+ interest is due and payable.

 

Not being deliberately obtuse, but it appears rather strange to not be saying you will pay all we say you owe us if you dont remedy.

[spartathisis]

Just checked my credit file again and noted the date the DN was entered on my credit file was 5 months before I received the DN in the post, are they able to do that?

 

Defaulted before having the chance to remedy the breach of a non existent agreement?

[spartathisis]

Also had a look at an old DN from another CC co, that notice specifically states the clause breached eg 2.5 (i) Monthly payments and states what is expected if the breach is not remedied ie FULL outstanding balance to be repaid immediately. The one posted earlier just says 'payment clause of the agreement' and asks for outstanding amount to be be immediately if breach not remedied.

 

I am confused now.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Basically the terminology seems complete, the manner in which it is phrased and the order that it is placed in on a dn is not relevant .

The time scale to remedy is the most important imo it must be a specific date eg o6/06/13.

[spartathisis]

Checked another DN and it too states the FULL amount must be repaid if breach not remedied.

 

Any more opinions would be appreciated.

[spartathisis]

Sent a request under s77/78/79 of the CCA 74 for a copy of my agreement on the 8th June 2013, enclosed a £1 PO to cover the cost.

 

HSBC have just replied stating their final response of (dated 2012) still stands and they will not correspond on the matter any further.

They are refusing therefore to supply a copy of any alleged agreement they may have (none, but a recon), what is my next course of action?

 

All the info I have was based on a SAR, never actually asked for a £1 copy before. Mid May I sent a Section 10, stop processing my data letter, and had no response from that either.

Do I contact ICO and complain?

 

Ta

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

You have had their final response, which leaves you free to complain to any regulatory body including the FOS.

[spartathisis]

Ta

[goodatresearch]

Any updates on this?

[spartathisis]

Well, I sent a s77/78/79 request for a copy of the non existent CCA (previously sent a SAR, so theoretically the account was not in dispute!), the stated they had had their final say on the matter and would no longer communicate with me!!!!!!!!!!

 

Nothing from sols/debt collector, nothing ) I imagine they are getting staff to search down every nook and cranny looking for a CCA, but I never signed one so it is a wild goose chase.

 

They are of course in breach of lots of things, but refusing to comply with a s77 request is rather silly if they ever want to go to court.

 

I have also sent a 2nd to the data controller demanding they stop processing my data, no contract ever signed = no permission. Even if they claimed assumed permission over the years, I have now clarified the position for them. Have given them until August 1st to get in touch and stop, or give a reason (as specified by the ICO). If they don't then I will complain to the ICO and contact the CRA's informing them of the situation. They will say they will contact HSBC, but I will insist they remove any poor recordings or face litigation. Worth a punt methinks.

 

I am also not convinced the DN is valid due to the amounts they are stating need to be repayed, but thats for a later date.

[spartathisis]

Can anyone tell me what 'extra' information I am likely to receive by sending a SAR rather than the £2 credit report application?

 

thanks

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

A SAR requires the recipient to supply ALL personal data they hold on the data subject, a CRA report hold data supplied by individual companies that the data subject has accounts with.

[citizenB]

Hang on a second and I will dig out the SAR that I sent to them..

[citizenB]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/content.php?552-Data-Protection

 

You can send the one above ^^^^^ short and sweet, or.. the one attached ...

 

 

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]46430[/ATTACH]

Edited September 15, 2013 by citizenB

[spartathisis]

Cheers both.

 

Cit B, not able to click on the link for some reason. Downloaded the pdf ta.

[spartathisis]

'True copies of any s87 (1) Default Notices or Enforcement Notices that you hold that supports any adverse Default related Data that you have ever published, and confirmation that appropriate steps were made to confirm that a valid Data Consent existed in relation to such adverse Data such as, for example, confirmation that an enforceable and properly executed Regulated Credit Agreement was made, one that also included the necessary Data Consent.'

 

Interesting section. This is my reason for the SAR, HSBC no CCA ever existed but still trading my data & now refusing to correspond with me