Welcome Finance Secured Loan Nightmare

[ozzywizard]

Exelent Rooster, thanks heaps . . as always your a star

[Et Contra Pacem Regis]

Emanevs:

Southern Pacific Personal Loans Ltd v Walker & Anor [2009] EWCA Civ 1218 (12 November 2009)

 

SPPL appealed Halbert's decision. That is the court of appeal's decision. They overruled Halbert.

[emanevs]

bebo, can you upload yout statements if you havent already.

[BEBOBEBO]

Yes I will get them uploaded today, thanks again everyone for your help on this.

[emanevs]

the statements from welscum that is...

[BEBOBEBO]

Here you go Pictures by rottweilermick - Photobucket

[emanevs]

have you read your PM?

[emanevs]

yes you have!!!

[BEBOBEBO]

Is there any letter templates I can use to put the account in dispute? I'm useless at letters and don't really know how to word it.

[emanevs]

can you list your reasons for putting it in dispute. this will help with the letter.

[emanevs]

have a look at this link for letter examples.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/welcome-finance/220445-welscum-respond-letter-any.html

[BEBOBEBO]

Ive contacted the FOS and they are writing a letter to welcome to put this account in dispute for the following reasons :-

 

I was not properly made aware of the Acceptance fee and MIF.

 

I was not properly made aware of the PPI.

 

they are requseting that these are all refunded along with interest.

 

The FOS informed me that on a Secured Loan they can add the MIF to any amount is this correct ? I thought it was nothing under 25k.

I also mentioned about the figures not adding up on the agreement, he didnt seem too bothered about that.

 

Feel kind of confused and dissapointed is my agreement enfoceable after all ?.

 

your help and advise is most welcome.

[Gram1]

 

I also mentioned about the figures not adding up on the agreement, he didnt seem too bothered about that.

 

 

Now that's worrying seeing as most of our unenforceable agreements recently are ones where the APR is slightly out and the figures dont add up! No i'm worried too!!!

[emanevs]

FOS writing a letter to welcome? I thought you would have to as its not their agreement?

 

i dont know why you think your agreement is enforceable?

[BEBOBEBO]

Yes the FOS are sending a letter to them today,

 

I am confused because all the kind advice i have recieved on here says that an agreement is unenforceable if there is MIF on a loan under 25k. But the FOS says otherwise.

 

As i have been made aware the figures dont add up but FOS not bothered about it.

 

I think that FOS are just dealing with it as a missold ppi/ acceptance fee and that the MIF is ok.

 

Whats your opinion and what would you reccommend doing .

[emanevs]

What is mortgage indemnity?

 

 

Mortgage indemnity is insurance which your lender may take out for its protection in case, at some future stage, you fall significantly behind with your mortgage payments and your lender has to repossess your property and sell it. If the property is sold for less than the amount of your outstanding mortgage, your lender can claim on the mortgage indemnity to recover some (or all) of its loss. The basic security for the mortgage is your property. The mortgage indemnity, therefore, acts as a form of additional security for your lender. It is not, however, additional security for you.

 

Lenders have different limits on the maximum loan they will make on a property. These vary from around 75% to 90% of the value of the property, depending on the lender. If you need to borrow more than this, your mortgage will be a high loan-to-value advance and you will normally be charged a fee for it (a variety of names exist for this fee, for example, high percentage loan fee, high lending fee, additional security fee etc). Payment of this fee therefore enables you to borrow more than your lender would normally be willing to lend on the security of the property alone.

 

Some lenders may use this fee to reimburse themselves for the amount they have paid for their mortgage indemnity insurance. Other lenders choose not to purchase indemnity insurance from an insurance company, preferring to use the fee to make other arrangements to cover the risk. The fee is not, therefore, the cost of mortgage indemnity insurance. It is just the cost to you of taking out a high loan-to-value mortgage.

[emanevs]

Borrowed from a fellow cagger!

 

a multiple agreement is where there is more than one catagorie of loan. Example, cash advance is an unrestriced loan but a PPI is a restricted loan, the two catagories cannot be mixed together and must have seperate agreements signed seperately and even paid seperately. The MIF is a restricted loan because you cannot use the advanced loan, as you cannot use the PPI loan. Section 18 as suggested makes this clear.

[emanevs]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/welcome-finance/245270-welcome-finance-multiple-loan.html

[BEBOBEBO]

Refering ozzys kind calculations below which dont match my agreement. Do I need to inform Welcome of this dispute or should I try to inform the FOS of this? as surely putting all other discrepanices aside, wrong figures on an agreement is unacceptable. if this is the case could someone help me with a letter??

 

 

 

Ok Bob, hope im ok to call you bob lol, actually your a gurlie right so will go for Bobby hehe. . .

 

To start off the MIF is a serious no no and incorrect.

There should also be a signature on the agreement from welcome and an address of who loan is secured with.

 

ET asked you Quote:

Did you recieve a "pre-contract information" copy of that agreement, and have 14 days to think about it prior to signing in the branch?

You say you cannot remember, this is important........ please discuss with your OH and come back with an answer if you possibly can.

 

ET is also correct in his post that if the MIF or acceptance fee is included in the credit it is unenforceable.

 

Ok time to do some number crunching on your loan.

 

Your loan is £14,776.85 over 120 months at 27.5% apr

 

thats a monthly repayment of £331.40

interest £24,991.80

total payable £39,768.65

 

Insurance

 

Insurance £3815.05 over 120 months at 27.5% apr

 

interest £6,452.32

monthly payment £85.56

total payable £10,267.37

 

total interest is £31,444.12 plus loan of £14,776.85 is 46,220.97 plus insurance is total amount repayable 50,036.02 ok sorry still not finished we now add the acceptance fee of 235 and the MIF of 1625.45 to give grand total of 51,896.47 divide by 120 to give a monthly figure of £432.47 . . this is a huge loan and welcome are seriously out on their figures as paying welcome their monthly figure would leave you to pay at end of contract an amount of no less than 1833.67.

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[emanevs]

40 days SAR, CCA is different.

 

Dont jump the gun, wait until they give you all the information

[BEBOBEBO]

another thing ive noticed on the statement is we must have had about 6 payment holidays agreed by the branch, suprise suprise they are not listed in the statement.

[BEBOBEBO]

Bump

[emanevs]

For us to get a clearer picture:

 

1) Wen did you send off your Subject Access Request, and did you send it off recorded delivery?

2) Wen did you send off your CCA request, and did you send it off recorded delivery?

3) Wen you have all of this, then you can add up all of the unfair charges etc, and formally ask for these back. There is a process for this, including letter before action etc.

4) wen they refuse, you pay the court fees and make a money claim. there are templates for your particulars

5) Write to the sc*m stating why you feel your agreement is unenforceable etc.

6) they will issue you with a final response.

7) wen you have final response, report them to FOS, etc.

[BEBOBEBO]

Thanks for your reply emanevs, answers to your questions as follows ;-

 

1) I sent the CCA request 14 days ago by recorded, ive not done the subject to access request

 

2) I recieved my CCA last thursday which I uploaded on here.

 

3) having read your replies on my thread I contacted the FOS who didnt seem bothered about the figures or the MIF.

 

4) FOS have put the account in dispute (by writting to welcome) due to me not being properly informed of the MIF, acceptance fee and mis sold PPI.they are requesting these back.

 

5) FOS say welcome have 8 weeks to send a Final response.

 

I feel the FOS are treating it really as a mis-sold PPI, MIF and Acceptance fee compliant didnt really seem bothered about the other errors, quite dissapointed.

 

Reading other threads has anyone actually got an unenforeable Welcome aggreement? There is a lot of talk of bad agreements but not alot of comfirmed results. kind of worried.

[beyondhope]

For us to get a clearer picture:

 

1) Wen did you send off your Subject Access Request, and did you send it off recorded delivery?

2) Wen did you send off your CCA request, and did you send it off recorded delivery?

3) Wen you have all of this, then you can add up all of the unfair charges etc, and formally ask for these back. There is a process for this, including letter before action etc.

4) wen they refuse, you pay the court fees and make a money claim. there are templates for your particulars

5) Write to the sc*m stating why you feel your agreement is unenforceable etc.

6) they will issue you with a final response.

7) wen you have final response, report them to FOS, etc.

 

Sorry to Hijack BEBOBEBO just a quick question for Emanevs - is point 5 and 6 what should happen or what will happen I only ask as I am at a bit of a stalemate without help and writing to them once again would give me abit more time to research and them abit more time to ignore me Im struggling to find the right points in CCA for me to be able to put my arguement across ive found a few but not enough

 

Sorry again BEBO