Natwest taking me to court ***All 3 Claims Discontinued***

[texanbar]

Hi,

After advice from silverfox, I have put my Nat West enquiry onto this thread.

 

Yesterday I received some official looking paperwork, which came via normal post. (I have scanned through the first page - please see attached). Think it's the start of a process for a CCJ - not sure because I've never had one before. Can someone please confirm.

 

Also, I'm just about to start the process of reclaiming some bank charges they slapped on when I couldn't afford the loan and overdraft (some £1200). Therefore, when I complete this 'official paperwork' which box do I tick?

 

I have the option of:

 

If you admit all the amont claimed and you want time to pay

 

If you admit part of the amount claimed

 

If you dispute the whole claim or wish to make a counterclaim against the claimant

 

If you need 28 days (rather than 14) from the date of service to prepare your defence, or wish to contenst the court's jurisdiction

 

If you do nothing, judgement may be entered against you

 

 

How scary is this.

(There's a bit more background info about my situation on the 'general thread' - I wasn't sure where to start!)

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

[Andyorch]

Hi texanbar and welcome to Cag

 

You have indeed recieved a summons and need to act swiftly and appropiatly with your response otherwise the Claimant will attain Summary Judgement against you (CCJ)

You have 33 days intotal to deal with the claim.Service date add 5 days deemed served.You then have another 14 days to AoS (Acknowledge Service) and should you wish to defend a further 14 days afforded to yourself to prepare any defence should you wish to defend.

With view to what your plea will be only you can decide but as you state the amount contains penalty charges and IMHO should be challenged.

How old is the loan?

Have you recieved a Default Notice and Termination Notice for the Overdraft?

Were you on a payment plan with CMS Telford?

Were you aware of any pending Litigation before arrival of the Summons?

 

If you could provide the above information to flesh the bones a little.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[texanbar]

Hi andyorch,

 

I am grateful for your reply.

 

I think the loan was taken out in 2004. Cannot remember for definite.

However, I received a Default Notice served under Section 87(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 for both loan and overdraft dated 09 November 2005. Got both copies in front of me.

 

Amount outstanding of loan on this credit agreement is £6736.58 and overdraft is £3839.58.

 

Don't think I ever received a Termination Notice for overdraft.

 

Not on any payment plan with CMS.

 

I have consistently made all monthly payments towards the debt ever since. I increased my repayments each time they asked, and I do recall a telephone conversation from someone before Christmas saying the debt now had to be paid within 5 years with a monthly payment of £200 (cannot recall the exact figure). They asked if that could be done, I said no, I then received a letter from Irwin Mitchell (17 December 2008) saying NatWest want all monies to be repaid (£12,256.22). There is no reason for payment to be withheld. Unless payment is received within 7 days further action will be taken against you to recover the amount outstanding which may include seeking a Money Judgment through the County Court and applying for a Charging Order against the property you own.

 

This was the only communication I received before my Summons.

 

If you need anything further, I will be more than happy to oblige. Just let me know.

 

Thanks

x

[Andyorch]

Hi

 

ok should you wish to defend the above claim you need to request some information prior to drafting a defence.This is done by way of the CPR 31.14 request see below.I would also advocate making a seperate section 77 CCA request see templates section letter N If I recall.The CPR request is free the Section 77 request requires a £1.00 PO dont sign anything print name on all requests and retain proof of delivery Spl Del i would advise

 

Dear Sir,

 

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

CPR 31.14 Request

 

On (date) I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the (Name) County Court.

 

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

 

[Prior to the issue of proceedings I had delivered a request for the production of the agreement mentioned in the Claim Form and on which you rely. That request was ignored][delete if no such request was delivered]

 

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of [each of the following / the] document(s) mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

 

1 the agreement. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

 

2 the assignment*

 

3 the default notice*

 

4 the termination notice*

 

5 [any other documents mentioned in the Particulars of Claim]*

 

* delete if not mentioned in the Particulars of claim.

 

[Although your claim is for a sum which is not more than £5,000.00 and will in all likelihood be allocated to the small claims track for determination upon my delivering a defence, at this moment in time I have not delivered my defence and the case has not been allocated to a track. In consequence the provisions of CPR 27(2) are of no effect and you should not seek to avoid compliance with your CPR 31 duties by claiming otherwise]#

 

# delete if claim for a sum exceeding £5,000.00

 

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

 

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

 

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

 

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

 

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

 

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

 

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

 

yours faithfully (print name)

 

Regards

 

andy;)

[texanbar]

Hi andyorch,

 

I am grateful for your reply.

 

I think the loan was taken out in 2004. Cannot remember for definite.

However, I received a Default Notice served under Section 87(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 for both loan and overdraft dated 09 November 2005. Got both copies in front of me.

 

Amount outstanding of loan on this credit agreement is £6736.58 and overdraft is £3839.58. Therefore total is £10576.16.

 

Don't think I ever received a Termination Notice for overdraft.

 

Not on any payment plan with CMS.

 

I have consistently made all monthly payments towards the debt ever since. I increased my repayments each time they asked, and I do recall a telephone conversation from someone before Christmas saying the debt now had to be paid within 5 years with a monthly payment of £200 (cannot recall the exact figure). They asked if that could be done, I said no, I then received a letter from Irwin Mitchell (17 December 200 saying NatWest want all monies to be repaid now balance sits at £12,256.22. There is no reason for payment to be withheld. Unless payment is received within 7 days further action will be taken against you to recover the amount outstanding which may include seeking a Money Judgment through the County Court and applying for a Charging Order against the property you own.

 

This was the only communication I received before my Summons.

 

If you need anything further, I will be more than happy to oblige. Just let me know.

 

Thanks Andy

x

[texanbar]

Thanks Andy, you're a star

x:)

[texanbar]

Andy,

 

Sorry where does the CPR 31.14 Request go to NatWest or Irwin Mitchell?

 

 

,

[Andyorch]

To their Sols Mitchell bros they will forward it on

 

 

Regards

 

Andy

[texanbar]

Thankyou

[texanbar]

hello Andy,

 

Another question if I may. Can I just do my 'Acknowledgement of Service' on-line and then complete the N1 form by hand and drop them in to my local court (as I'm in Northampton) and once I've got my defence sorted. Or is it the case that once you've started the claim on-line you have to continue with it?

 

This is the last thing to complete on my checklist for today. I've already sent off x11 £1.00 PO to my other creditors requesting CCA's, £10 off to NatWest for a Subject Access Request and a letter to their solicitors requesting the CPR 31 (special delivery).

 

Feeling quite liberated today.

[Andyorch]

hello Andy,

 

Another question if I may. Can I just do my 'Acknowledgement of Service' on-line and then complete the N1 form by hand and drop them in to my local court (as I'm in Northampton) and once I've got my defence sorted. Or is it the case that once you've started the claim on-line you have to continue with it? I would advocate sticking to one system rather than mix the two it is possable but open to error much simpler to do all online.

 

This is the last thing to complete on my checklist for today. I've already sent off x11 £1.00 PO to my other creditors requesting CCA's, £10 off to NatWest for a Subject Access Request and a letter to their solicitors requesting the CPR 31 (special delivery).

 

Feeling quite liberated today.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[texanbar]

Hi Andy,

 

As I live in Northampton, I can hand-deliver the Acknowledgement of Service and will stick to this system for the duration of my 'case.'

 

Thankyou

[Goldlady]

This is the last thing to complete on my checklist for today. I've already sent off x11 £1.00 PO to my other creditors requesting CCA's, £10 off to NatWest for a Subject Access Request and a letter to their solicitors requesting the CPR 31 (special delivery).

 

Feeling quite liberated today.

 

Oh I remember that feeling so well. Best of luck with it all;)

[texanbar]

Thanks Goldlady, just reading 'Womble's' thread - haven't got to the end yet, but I have to say that the people on here are just legends (including you!)

 

I cannot begin to tell you how I have started to feel since finding this website.

 

I am actually having days of seeing the light at the end of the tunnel and hope to really turn our lives around as a family. Thankyou - truly.

[Goldlady]

Texanbar you are truly welcome. I lived in fear of answering the phone for a long time, and if anyone knocked at the door I would lie on the floor incase it was a DCA. I haven't forgotten what that felt like and even now when the phone rings I think twice before answering it. Door is not so much of a problem as we have three dogs:D

 

But I can't bear to think of anyone else going through what I did. And what worries me more is the people who haven't found CAG... yet

[texanbar]

Hi everyone,

 

An update - I have now hand-delivered my AoS form to the court and need to prepare my defence by 23/01/08 (next Friday).

 

I have not received anything back yet from their Sols or themselves. Should I be chasing their sols or is that not advisable. If I don't receive the documentation in time, how do I go about asking the courts for more time before the judgement is entered against me.

 

Many thanks

[Goldlady]

You will need to send the 'embarrassed' defence which I don't have to hand at the moment but basically you need to say that you are unable to submit a defence as the claimant has not complied with your request under the civil procedure rules for further information. I think I did a basic one on Womble's thread but shout if you need help.

[texanbar]

Great, thankyou Goldlady

 

x

[texanbar]

Hi everyone,

 

An update...

 

Today, I received 84 pages of printed statements from Natwest.

 

I'm assuming this is from my CPR31.14 request as my £10.00 cheque has also been cashed. I was expecting to receive a bit more correspondence from them other than just the statements from my current account. In my letter I had also requested details regarding my personal loan with them - they have not provided any information at all. I was expecting to at least have a copy of my CCA from the personal loan.

 

Goldlady - may I still use the template from Womble's thread requesting more time for my defence (deadline is this Friday 23rd January) and shall I be sending a letter to Natwest Sols again requesting the above information? Is there a template letter I can use?

 

In the meantime, can I start a claim alongside my 'court case' to file against all the bank charges?

 

Any help is greatly appreciated.

 

x:)x

[Andyorch]

Hi everyone,

 

An update...

 

Today, I received 84 pages of printed statements from NatWest.

 

I'm assuming this is from my CPR31.14 request as my £10.00 cheque has also been cashed:confused:. I was expecting to receive a bit more correspondence from them other than just the statements from my current account. In my letter I had also requested details regarding my personal loan with them - they have not provided any information at all. I was expecting to at least have a copy of my CCA from the personal loan.Then they are in default if the request as exceeded 12 + 2 days

 

Goldlady - may I still use the template from Womble's thread requesting more time for my defence (deadline is this Friday 23rd January) and shall I be sending a letter to Natwest Sols again requesting the above information? No Is there a template letter I can use?

 

In the meantime, can I start a claim alongside my 'court case' to file against all the bank charges? I would not advocate this why pay for a claim when you can offset yours against theirs

 

Any help is greatly appreciated.

 

x:)x

 

Texanbar I will post you a short defence shortly

 

Regards

 

Andy

[texanbar]

Thanks for a swift reply Andy.

 

x:)x

[Andyorch]

_~'tJ. ".~: =-,.>.;:;. ·,,,'et::.:;,·"""_ ~:::

_ .U.~ =e . =~..;"":U •• ,."t--,"§:

By agreement(s) entered into between the '

Claimant and Defendant, the Defendant has

failed to pay the sum of 12256.22.

The Claimant has requested payment but the

Defendant has failed to pay the full sum

demanded. The Claimant claims the sum of

12256.22 and interest under $.69 of the

• County Courts Act 1984 at a rate of 8% per

annum from 02/0112009 until judgment or

sooner payment. Costs. The claim does not

include issues under the Huu'ian Rights Act

1998.

The

 

 

A defence should deal with the claimants pleading and not be complicated and long in these matters. It should not contain references to cases etc. Do not forget you may have to argue that which is contained in your defence and so you need to understand that to which you are endorsing a statement of truth. Until the claimant pleads in an appropriate manner, you should not reveal all your 'cards'. I suggest a defence as follows:-

 

 

Defence

 

 

I Texanbar make this statement as my defence to the claim brought by RatsNest

 

1.The claimants particulars of claim are vague and fail to disclose any cause of action, they appear to be an abuse of the process in that they fail to deal with the basic rules of pleading in accordance with the CPR

 

2.No documents supporting the claims in the particulars have been offered which the defendant needs to establish what agreement it is that this action is based upon

 

3.Without clarification of the claimants claim, the defendant is extremely disadvantaged and the claimants claim appears without merit

 

 

4.Further to above the defendant is unable to plead effectively or at all. The defendant is embarrassed.

 

 

 

Statement of Truth dated

 

 

 

 

The above is all you need to place in the defence.

 

You should write to the claimants solicitors as follows:-

 

' Herewith copy defence by way of service, the same having been filed with the court.

 

Please serve amended particulars of claim and plead yor clients case in an appropriate manner within 7 days, so that I am aware of the case I will have to meet at trial. I request that you attach to the particulars a copy of the agreement and Default Notice upon which the claimant relies. The matter will be transferred to my home court and the claimant will have to produce the document, in any event. In those circumstances you should plead in accordance with the CPR.

 

Failure to provide that requested in the time period provided for will result in application to the court. I confirm a copy of this letter will be produced to the court when the question of costs falls to be decided'.

 

 

Yours Faithfully

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Send Rec Del and retain proof dont sign print

 

Regards

 

Andy

[texanbar]

Wow, thank you very much. Shall put it on some nice paper now and hand-deliver on Friday.

 

Thanks again

 

x:)x

[texanbar]

Hi again,

 

I just phoned up the courts to find out what time they were open tomorrow and was told I actually have until 31st January 2009 to submit my defence. I was originally told by the receptionist when I took in my AoS the deadline date was tomorrow! Also because the 31st January falls on a Saturday they said the deadline is 4.00pm on Monday 2 February, 2009.

 

I can now wait a bit longer to see if Natwest provides me with the information l originally asked for.

 

Must admit starting to feel a little anxious over the whole thing! I'm definitely going to see if I can sit in on a few before I get my hearing date. Thanks everyone for your wonderful support.

 

x:)x

[womble72]

Hi Texanbar,

 

Just been reading your thread and we are two peas in a pod.

 

Same problems different amounts of money. As by reading my thread i did not do the defence in time so Goldlady gave me a great piece to send to the courts. Paul Walton and Goldlady have been helping me and they both have been great.

 

Now with the loan have they not sent you any information regarding it. Like a true copy-terms and conditions or a signature ?

 

Overdraft- difficult to defend unless there is unfair charges on the account.

Goldlady told me i would have £1,400 of unfair charges but the overdraft is nearly £8,000 !

Have you let anybody look at the statements yet and leave your defence until the end of the month because the crapwest might send more paperwork.