You Soo Realllly Must Read This!!!!!!

[crikey cor blimey]

Hi All,

I really do need some advice - I transferred £1200 from my PayPal account to my Barclays bank account...sounds pretty straight forward eh? Well, I made an error - the account number that I used transfer the money into was my OLD account number not my NEW one. The problem is that this account number has been re-allocated to another person!!!!

I didn't notice this until I got my statement. I then contacted my Barclays bank. They told me that they needed the account holders permission to take the money back out, so they wrote and tried to phone this person who has my money, but they didn't get any reply to their letters. Months(!) later, they contact the bank and say that can't have it back as they've spent it!

So, next stop the police eh? Yep. I contacted them and they are going to go around to see the person and warn them that will be arrested if they don't pay up - result eh? No. The police officer did tell me that IF this person has no previous criminal record, then they will be let off with a caution!!! which means that the only way to get my money back will be through the civil court - so this could mean that they only pay a quid or so back per week

**There is something else though as well! - during the time the bank tried to contact this person (and didn't) get a response, I also tried, by giving a letter to my bank to pass on to the person concerned. The bank made an error though - they gave ME this persons name and address by mistake!

 

What should I do? The police told me to say nothing about this because I may lose a civil case due to the banks stupidity. Could I use this information against the bank (ie tell them that I can't get my money because of them?) would they be liable?

[kennythecelt]

Hi Crikey:)

 

Firstly, a very warm welcome to CAG. You should find all the help and assistance you need here.

 

Please read the site rules:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/forum-rules-please-read/

 

This sounds like quite a mess on the part of paypal and I can understand why you are upset.

 

Have paypal admitted the mistake? Do you have any of this in writing? Have the bank put anything in writing?

 

Cheers, Kenny

[Mr lex]

Hiya Crikey, and welcome.

 

This is a very, very strange case. Can you tell us how old the Barclays account is ? It is so unusual for any bank to reallocate a account number. They have by law to keep records for six years at least.

 

My first thoughts are that you get back to the bank and demand a explanation of how this could have happened. I think you should only do this in writing and make sure you send your letter by special delivery.

 

A very interesting case this. I wish you well.

 

Lex

[Simon7685]

Hi and welcome to the site. This is a very interesting situation but I don't think the blame can be apportioned to Paypal can it?

 

Surely they have only followed the instruction you gave and transferred the money to where you told them to.

 

The fault as such must be with Barclays I would have thought. How you will go about getting your money back I do not know, I'm not clever enough for that but it certainly is strange!

 

Have you thought about contacting Watchdog? They may take this on and possibly get things sorted for you, it is just a thought and maybe worth an enquiring email to them.

 

Good luck and I hope you get your money.

 

Simon:-)

[buzby]

Don't overlook a formal complaint to the FSA - You'll need a letter from Barclays saying they're not going to assist you in recovering the funds.

[davethorp]

Am I the only one who didn't think banks ever reused account numbers?

[JonCris]

I'm with Mr lex I find it very strange that the bank should claim they have reallocated the account number - Such behaviour if true could lead to all kinds of banking errors & not just debiting the wrong accounts

[nicsussex]

Am I the only one who didn't think banks ever reused account numbers?

 

No you're not - seems highly unusual to me.

[crikey cor blimey]

Hi All,

The 'Old' bank account number was about 3 years old.

The error in providing PayPal with the wrong number was mine - I hold my hands up to that. It was not a fault by any of the banks - they did what I asked them to do.

When transferring money - PayPal require 3 things: Account Name, Account Number, and Sort Code.

But here is the strange thing - the Barclays bank do not look at the name - they ONLY use the account number and sort code.

(Had they used the name it would have been rejected as it would not have matched the other person)

*HERE IS ANOTHER STRANGE THING: Not only did the bank re-allocate the account number - they also re-allocated it to the SAME sort code!

(Again - if these had been different then the money would have been rejected).

 

What do you guys think about the DPA breach? Do you think I've got a case that I could use that against the bank to get my money???

[kennythecelt]

Do you have any of this in writing? Have the bank put anything in writing?

 

Cheers, Kenny

 

Have you put anything in writing to either of them??

[crikey cor blimey]

Hi Kenny

All I have from Barclays is that they tried their hardest to get the money back from the person but failed (by hardest that meant writing letters and trying to contact them by phone).

Paypal emailed me to say that it was my fault (yes!) that i gave them the wrong account number.

 

That's it so far really.

 

What should I do? Any advice on what I should do next?

[midge61]

Hi

 

Yes Barclays do recycle account numbers apparently

 

Barclays admits to recycling old account numbers | Money | The Guardian

[Conniff]

So what happens now if the op decides they need to S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) for some reason and wants all the stuff from that account, what will they get?

 

I think Barclays have made a boob here and it is up to them to do a refund and then try to get the money back from the other party.

If they need to keep records for six years then they cannot alot it to someone else.

 

In fact going back to my first sentence, it may be worth doing to see what happens.

[davethorp]

Hi

 

Yes Barclays do recycle account numbers apparently

 

Barclays admits to recycling old account numbers | Money | The Guardian

 

That is terrifying!

[midge61]

Perhaps it would be worth ringing the ICO to ask for advice.

 

If op did a S.A.R for that account and got someone elses details then surely that would be a breach of DPA.

[Conniff]

Perhaps it would be worth ringing the Information Commissioners Office to ask for advice.

 

If op did a S.A.R for that account and got someone elses details then surely that would be a breach of Data Protection Act.

 

Exactly.

[Mr lex]

I don't know about you guys, but I am all for Crikey sending a S.A.R. asking for all information on this account No.

 

I feel that this is the best place to start. This is about the most frighting thing I have heard for a long time.

 

Crikey, have a look at this and amend the details to your own.

 

:- http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/516-1-data-protection-act.html

 

Watching with great interest.

 

Lex

[saintly_1]

Im with you on that Lex ....... get a SAR sent for the account you payed the money into ...

[Mr lex]

One more thing Crikey,

 

You might like to post your letter here before you send it. Please make sure you remove your personal details first, then we can take a quick look before you send it.

 

ANY letters you send now should only be by special recorded delivery. Then at least you have a record.

 

Lex

[davethorp]

This is about the most frighting thing I have heard for a long time.

 

Glad I'm not the only one frightened by this. I should also be scared for anyone who has ended up with any of my old bank account numbers

[Mr lex]

This is probably a good time for a passing Mod. to move this thread to the Barclays forum please.

 

Thank you.

 

Lex

[slick132]

Call me old fashioned but I would say the bank is evading its' responsibility and is liable for the loss.

 

The name and a/c no did not tally and the error should have been spotted at the time by the bank. When they realised the error had been made, they should have reversed the credit and pursued the 3rd party for any debt.

 

The fact that the 3rd party has spent the money seems to me irrelevant, as is the re-use of an old a/c no.

 

Complaints need to be made to the FOS to get the money back and to Information Commissioners Office about the disclosure of 3rd party data.

 

Inform Barclays Head Office that these complaints will be made in 14 days if the money is not refunded by then. Id also threaten going to the Press, BBC's Watchdog programme and Jessica Gorst-Williams of the Daily Telegraph.

 

The SAR may run into trouble itself because of Data Protection or Confidentiality issues.

[Simon7685]

I still think it is worth a speculative call to someone like Watchdog, as well as a SAR and any other action.

 

If they took it on, I am sure you would get your cash back asap but more importantly it would get this into the public domain on a far greater scale. That can only be a good thing as I bet not many people would actually believe that banks not only do not check all details match in transactions but they are also recycling old account numbers and re allocating them.

 

It really is bad and something everyone could do with knowing.

 

You could even try and interest the media in your story.

 

Good luck

Simon:)

[JonCris]

Having read the Guardian article, & besides being appalled, but unsurprised, at their actions, I think the OP may have good grounds to demand the bank repay the money.

It does appear that their problem is not a one-off & goodness knows how many more there are over their whole customer base.

I would write back & point out that they now know their problem to not be an isolated one caused primarily by the bank reissuing old account numbers coupled with their obvious reluctance to pursue the person who received these monies, as shown in the article.

Also IMHO there is a good argument to be made in that they did not check the actual name on the account as had they done so they would have identified that the details were wrong

http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2007/aug/11/accounts.saving

[JonCris]

I agree that the OP should also 'advise' Barclays that unless they deal with the matter to the OP's complete satisfaction then they will go to the press.

 

Furthermore this makes the OP wonder, once publicised, how many more similar incidents, over the whole customer base, past & present, will see the light of day

 

That should get the a**l gland twitching:grin: