Unusual Mortgage Problem

[redjax]

Can anyone advise what I should I do. We changed our mortgage to the Woolwich 5 years ago and every month up to Dec 06 we received a statement saying payment received and showing a reduced balance.

 

In Dec 06 we got a letter saying a situation had arisen with our mortgage and would we contact them. When I contacted them I was told that due to their error when they input the details onto their system, (I have this in writing form them) we had not actually made a payment for the entire 4 years that we'd had the mortgage with them. The DD was set up wrongly and someone else had been making the payments. I almost had a heart attack and at once thought I was going to lose my home. They assured me this wouldn't happen and that they would sort it out.

 

Anyway to cut a long story short, despite letters from me and phone calls we still have not paid any mortgage, so it's now over five years. They sent us a new DD to complete which we did, but they sent it back saying we had put the wrong details on it. We signed another one but left the account numbers blank so they could fill in the details for us. It was again sent back saying it had the wrong details on it. I asked for a payment book so I could make manual payments, nothing was ever received.

 

They made me an offer in March 07 to wipe out the arrears that had built up between them finding out about the problem in Oct 06 and then. They said if that wasn't acceptable I should tell them what I thought they should do. I refused and said they should wipe out the arrears altogether and get my mortgage back on track, plus think of some form of compensation for the stress they had put me through over the last few months. I got a reply saying the matter had been passed to a senior manager.

 

I heard nothing except that they were investigating and would contact me within 4 weeks. Every four weeks I received a copy of the same letter. Then of course the Woolwich was taken over by Barclays. Despite my numerous letters, all I got back was a two line letters saying we are investigating and will contact you shortly.

 

In desperation in July 07 I made a formal complaint to the Financial Services Ombudsman. All I have had from them are letters saying due to heavy caseloads we have not yet been able to allocate a case worker to investigate your complaint. I have had no reply to the last three letters I have sent to Barclays.

 

My husband and I are in our 50s and are running out of time to pay this mortgage. My husband has also been suffering from severe depression (I wonder why!) for the last year or so. Can I take any kind of legal action against this bank for not sorting out this problem and helping us. They have put us in so much debt it is frightening.

 

When we took out the mortgage it was for £100,000 with an overdraft facility of £14,000 which we needed to build an extension to our house. We did not want to ever be over £114,00 in debt. As it stands, we now stil have the orginal £100,000 mortgage, plus and overdraft of almost £23,000, plus mortgage arrears of something like £12,000.

 

I am now unable to sleep, eat or even think straight with worry that we are going to have to sell our house. Can anyone offer any advice or tell me who I can get to represent me against the bank and get this matter sorted before I consider jumping off a bridge!

[make them aktiv runners]

Surely you would have noticed that a substantial monthly payment was not leaving your bank account?

[redjax]

No, I know this sounds mad, but I never used to check the statements. I only checked the first page and that said payment received so that was good enough for me. I can't believe the person who was paying it never realised for 4 years either!

[karenjen]

I stil don't understand how you didn't realise from your bank statements that the money was not being debited. I know it isn't a helpful comment but I am very curious.

[The GodMother]

Rite i would first start with speaking to the coucil for mortage lenders about this and getting on to the FSO saying you need this sorting sooner rather than later as you are now having other problems.

 

I would speak to them on the phone rather than write to them as they cant really say to you about iwe can do anything ATM.

 

You may need to be instant with them.

 

Chrissi

[gizmo111]

Like other posters I am at a loss to understand how you didn't notice you hadn't paid anything towards your mortgage. However the past cannot be changed and how you manage your

budget now is important.

 

I am not sure where you go from here, but I will seek another opinion.

 

Are you paying the correct amount now?

Can you afford to catch up?

If you have been paying nothing so far, can you pay the monthly mortgage.

 

My initial thoughts are to ask the woolwich to extend any fixed term offer you have by 4 years, if this is to your benefit.

 

I assume the woolwich will pay back whoever has been paying your mortgage - who will compensate their lost interest?

[diskmandave]

As gizmo111 states, I too am at a total loss as to how you could miss your mortgage payments, as this is your primary outgoing...

 

Given your circumstances now, I do feel that you should contact either National Debtline....

National Debtline, for FREE CONFIDENTIAL and INDEPENDENT ADVICE call 0808 808 4000

 

or... The Consumer Credit Counselling Service...

CCCS - Free Debt Advice from the UK's Leading Debt Charity

 

Given the option personally, I would contact National Debtline first, as I know from colleague advise that they are better trained...

 

Best wishes, Dave.

[The GodMother]

I tho am still also bemussed how they did not notice this sooner. You would assume the mortage lender would have noticed something wrong before they did.

 

As the situation has been the mortage lenders fault threw not checking the DD details is there anything they can do.

 

Is there a clause where if the lender has caused the problem they cant claim for that amount of time they did not notice the problem or something?

 

is redjax entitled to any type of compensation, even if it is put towards the mortgage?

 

Chrissi

[Weird Al Yankovic]

This is a rather bizarre turn of events.

 

However, I'm not of the opinion that payments were or were not being taken from the account and not noticed by the OP, at this point anyway.

 

Do they have their own business, are self employed etc etc?

 

If so, like me, it was a struggle to keep up with my accounts, especially when I was doing well.

 

£300 or £400 or whatever was always going in and out of my account on almost a daily basis.

 

Also a monthly mortgage statement was produced showing payments received.

 

I am surprised that the FSO has taken since July 07 to take up this complaint and have still not investigated.

 

I'd see a solicitor straight away.

[paulwlton]

I have a mortgage with the Woolwich, and know how it works. You say you had an overdraft on the mortgage which you borrowed for an extension. The payment on the overdraft needs to be made separate to the original amount borrowed. It is your responsibility to either make monthly payments to clear the OD, or pay lump sums as and when, as long has the OD is paid off when the original mortgage term is satisfied there's no problem. It is my suspicion that although you may have been making mortgage payments you have not been making payments on your overdraft therefore interest as accumulated.

 

You also need to check bank statements to see if you have been making any payments.

 

I would contact the Woolwich /Barclays and see if this is the case.

[JULI99]

I cannot offer any legal advice but maybe some wisdoms on the Wollwich/Barclays or whatever they like to call themselves nowadays.

 

I have a Woolwich mortgage and reserve account and I ask everyone with 2 separate products with this company to be very careful.

 

The monthly interest for our mortgage and reserve account combined is added onto our mortgage account each month. However the direct debit form that we recieve from time to time from the mortgage department is for about £150 less than the combined monthly interest. (I pay by cheque each month. No way I am filling out a DD, I do not trust them to action it correctly.) This is the reserve account interest. If you call the mortgage department they will tell you they do not know how much the reserve account interest is but the DD payment is correct. You will have to call the reserve account department if you need to know how much the reserve account interest is for. You call the reserve account department and they will tell you as the interest is added onto the mortgage account you will have to call the mortgage department.

 

From what I have gathered over the years there are different departments dealing with different aspects of the mortgage. (On mine there is the mortgage, the reserve, and the arrears department, although I am not in arrears. There is probably a department which deals solely with overdrafts).

 

None of the computers seem to be linked.

 

Interest is added on 3 different days of the month depending which department you are dealing with.

 

Even if you have it in writing or can prove something is or isn't happening there standard reply is "You must be mistaken" or "That cannot happen."

 

It appears to take 3 weeks for a cheque to clear.

 

Once tried to pay into my reserve account using my debit card and was told I couldn't pay money into that account.

 

Each department thinks they know how the system works but unfortunately it is at odd with how every other department thinks it should work.

 

Once spent 5 hours one day on the telephone trying to sort out my up to date mortgage and came off the phone shell shocked, shaking, and having achieved absolutely nothing.

 

I feel for anyone trying to deal with company

[supersleuth]

Dear Redjax,

 

If you have written receipts from the Woolwich acknowledging payment of the mortgage, then it may be the case that you have, what is legally known as "good receipt".

 

Plus, it is possible that the Barclays could be "estopped" from arguing that you now have mortgage arrears and/or denying your good receipt. Essentially it seems to me that Barclays are the ones who are suggesting that the Woolwich did not get the payments. When Barclays bought the Woolwich the bought the assets as well as the liabilities. Therefore, in principle, Barclays cannot be said to deny the "good receipt" that the Woolwich gave you.

 

I find your experience interesting as I had a letter from Norwich Union suggesting that another person had been paying my insurance by DD. It casts asperisons which imply that you had done something wrong thus making you feel unnecessarity guilty and fearful of not being able to prove your innocence, whereas in fact, the banks have made the mistake and avoid taking responsibility for their own mistakes. In my case I did not even have a policy with Norwich Union, having not renewed the policy. When I enquired as to why they "thought" I had a policy, it transpired that Abbey had apparently arranged the policy.

 

Therefore, you are not alone with this new ploy of the banks suggesting that another account has paid your bill. Ask them for details/name of the account that they are suggesting paid your mortgage. Bet they give you the Data Protection line. On this point, I suggest you do a Data Protection letter to them to get copies of all the documents. There are plently of sample letters on this site.

 

Hope this gives you a few more positive pointers to think about. Don't crumble - fight back.