NCP/BW ANPR PCN - Cambridge North Station

[EssexChap]

Hello,

new member, hope you can help me!

A member of my family parked at Cambridge North Station, an NCP site,  earlier this year and thought that they'd paid online.  

However they received a PCN letter saying they hadn't paid etc with ANPR shots.

They ignored this letter and the reminder and have now received a demand for £170 from bwlegal, NCP's debt recovery service.

They haven't interacted with NCP or BW in any way.

Am I correct in thinking that a station car park is governed by bylaws which effectively exclude them from using DVLA material to identify the driver/keeper of the car in question?

What is the best way to proceed?

Thanks very much for any help.

[dx100uk]

please complete this

 

bw are not a debt collector nor are they owned by NCP, they are solicitors for hire.

byelaws play zero part in the permission or not for ncp to use the DVLA service.

do not appeal ever.

please scan bothsides of every letter to one multipage pdf after reading upload carefully.

 

dx

 

[FTMDave]

We have other cases where NCP's software has been shown to be useless.

Well done your relative on not appealing.

They can probably ignore this made-up demand for an extra £70 from BW Legal, but please upload it anyway just so we can make sure it's not a Letter of Claim.

While scribbling I see that dx has uploaded the sticky.  Yes, please fill it in and upload all the documentation.

[EssexChap]

Sorry, here's the questionnaire. Thank you so much for responding so quickly! Unfortunately the person didn't keep the other letters, so we only have the bw one that came today. I have attached this. 

For PCN's received through the post [ANPR camera capture] 

(must be received within 14 days from the Incident)

 

Please answer the following questions.

 

1 Date of the infringement 25 Jan 23

 

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] DK
 

[scan up BOTH SIDES as ONE PDF- follow the upload guide] please LEAVE IN LOCATION AND ALL DATES/TIMES/£'s

 

3 Date received DK
 

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?] DK
 

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? Yes
 

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal] No
 

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up n/a
 

7 Who is the parking company? NCP

 

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Cambridge North railway station, Cambridge
 

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under.

NCP is BPA I believe
 

There are two official bodies, the BPA and the IAS. If you are unsure,

please check HERE

 

If you have received any other correspondence, please mention it here

BWLegal letter

Copy the windscreen or ANPR section to your thread and answer the questions...

 

CambridgeNorth NCP.pdf

[FTMDave]

9 minutes ago, EssexChap said:

Sorry, here's the questionnaire. Thank you so much for responding so quickly! Unfortunately the person didn't keep the other letters, so we only have the bw one that came today. I have attached this. 

 

For PCN's received through the post [ANPR camera capture] 

(must be received within 14 days from the Incident)

 

Please answer the following questions.

 

1 Date of the infringement 25 Jan 23

 

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] DK
 

[scan up BOTH SIDES as ONE PDF- follow the upload guide] please LEAVE IN LOCATION AND ALL DATES/TIMES/£'s

 

3 Date received DK
 

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?] DK
 

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? Yes
 

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal] No
 

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up n/a
 

7 Who is the parking company? NCP

 

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Cambridge North railway station, Cambridge
 

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under.

NCP is BPA I believe
 

There are two official bodies, the BPA and the IAS. If you are unsure,

please check HERE

 

If you have received any other correspondence, please mention it here

BWLegal letter

Copy the windscreen or ANPR section to your thread and answer the questions...

I've had to hide your post.  You've left reference numbers for both BWLegal and NCP showing.

[EssexChap]

OOpps sorry. Can I delete and re upload?

 

 

[Nicky Boy]

Already done it

[EssexChap]

Fantastic, thankyou! 

 

 

[FTMDave]

Well the good news is that there's nothing to worry about "immediately".  The letter is not a Letter of Claim, it's just BW Legal trying to scare your relative into thinking the amount has somehow gone up by £70 when it hasn't.

However, it's pretty silly to throw away paperwork when you're in legal dispute.

It's even sillier when the dispute is with a private parking company.  Maybe the company respected the POFA deadlines for keeper liability.  Or maybe they didn't.  Who knows?  The paperwork is in the bin.

Therefore they need to get a SAR off today to NCP (not BW Legal) to get the paperwork back.  They should stick in a Council Tax bill or something as ID, otherwise NCP will use the lack of ID as an excuse to not cooperate.  Get a free Certificate of Posting from the post office.

They also need to so some digging and find out if there are bye-laws.  i see Cambridge North is a new station so the bye-laws issue isn't cut & dried.

Obviously any proof of attempted payment would be useful too.

[EssexChap]

Unfortunately the person concerned is a teenager so silliness is second nature I'm afraid.  Meanwhile I found this elsewhere on this site re Cambridge North which suggests it is covered by bylaws? 

So what do we need to request from NCP via the SAR? 

 

So the above quote suggests to me that NCP at Cambridge North can operate outside the POFA guidelines in any case? See my highlight in red here.

Received a PCN for unpaid parking at Cambridge North station...On Railway Land managed by NCP, we currently enforce under contract law. We are not allowed to use the provisions of The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA) & Keeper Liability as Railway Land is exempt from this. Therefore timescales defined in POFA are not required to be met but there is an expectation that if an operator does not make use of Keeper Liability provisions, they are expected to adhere to the DVLA’s guidelines and contractual requirements to issue the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) no later than 7 months after the parking event.

[Nicky Boy]

11 minutes ago, EssexChap said:

We are not allowed to use the provisions of The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA) & Keeper Liability as Railway Land is exempt from this.

This is the biggie!

If they cannot use POFA, they can ONLY pursue the driver.

So, as long as no-one engages with the fleecers, they will never know who that is...

Can you post a link to this info?

Just click on SAR read and follow the instructions...

[EssexChap]

This is the thread, from a couple of years ago...

Old Cambridge North thread

[FTMDave]

What brilliant digging!  Well done.

However, we have another NCP thread where their rubbish software didn't take payment and where they didn't respect POFA - but they are still taking the motorist to court in the hope the person will buckle and will give in.  So I'm afraid it's the long game when it comes to fighting the fleecers.

Certainly get the SAR off.  There are other things that are probably wrong with the PCN.  It's also highly likely that they will try to pretend that POFA applies until they're challenged by which time they'll have tied themselves in knots.

[EssexChap]

Sorry to be overly cautious but does sending a SAR not count as 'engaging with the fleecers'? 

[Nicky Boy]

Probably wrong choice of wording on my part.

Just don't admit (even accidentally) who was driving...

This is why we don't recommend appealing.

[FTMDave]

Not at all.  It's your right under data protection laws.

[EssexChap]

OK, I'll get the SAR actioned asap and report back as soon as I can. Thankyou so much for all your help, everyone, incredible advice!

 

PS I presume I have to use the PCN reference number in the SAR to give them a reference to work with?

[FTMDave]

Yes, best to include the PCN number and vehicle registration, the poor dears won't be able to find the information otherwise.

Make sure you get a free Certificate of Posting as NCP are not very good with SARs.  In fact if you want a good laugh read this short thread  https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/452147-loc-to-ncp-for-failure-to-supply-sar-paid-in-full/#comments

 

[EssexChap]

OK thanks. Meanwhile he's found the reminder letter but not the original notice. Attached. Don't know if this helps at all?

Reminder.pdf reminder back.pdf

 

God that SAR thread is depressing, isn't it?

[FTMDave]

Have you read as far as the happy ending?