esp/gladstones MNPR PCN Claimform - spinningfields estate manchester - received nothing prior to claimform

[mkontheroad]

this is confirmation that i sent the n180 back before the deadline, what else should i do now, wait for them or file anything else

thanking you in advance

[FTMDave]

Well you have none of the original paperwork, Gladstones have ignored your CPR request and the fleecers have refused to respect your SAR, which means you'll be going into court blind unless you can get your hands on the original PCN.

1.  So have a look at post 25 here  https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/452147-loc-to-ncp-for-failure-to-supply-sar-paid-in-full/#comments  Adapt that according to your details and make sure you include the PCN number.  Send off to ES Parking Enforcement Ltd tomorrow and make sure you get a free Certificate of Posting from your much-visited local post office.

2.  As the point of all this is not really to sue them but to get get your hands on the paperwork, I suggest this letter for Gladstones -

Dear Will & John,

Re: claimform no XXXXX, PCN no XXXXX

I enclose a copy of a letter I have today sent to your client, ES Parking Enforcement Ltd.

I received no paperwork regarding this matter from your client prior to the claimform and your client has breached their statutory duty by failing to satisfy my Subject Access Request made on XX April for which I have proof of posting.

I suggest you protect your client's interests by giving them a boot up the backside and telling them to respect my SAR sharpish, otherwise one of the parties involved here will be getting a thrashing in court, and it ain't me.

Yours XXXXX

Send that off tomorrow, enclosing a copy of the letter to ESP, usual 2nd class stamp, usual free CoP.

Hopefully that will get you your paperwork and we can start building up evidence to bat off their claim.

 

 

[mkontheroad]

Just to update I sent with evidence of postage what was needed regarding failure to response to my sar request 

kindly advise should I wait for a reply or any further action I should do 

thanking you in advance 

Edited July 22, 2023 by dx100uk
unnecessary previous post quote removed

[FTMDave]

They have 14 days in which to answer.  So sit tight for now.

[mkontheroad]

Should I file this letter of claim or wait for them to answer 

Ok will do accordingly 

Edited July 22, 2023 by dx100uk
unnecessary previous post quote removed

[FTMDave]

What date was on your letter to them?

[mkontheroad]

12th july which was the letter stating failure to send me sar information 

Edited July 22, 2023 by dx100uk
unnecessary previous post quote removed

[Nicky Boy]

Things are a little confusing...

Was a "letter of claim" actually sent to ESP? or just the copy of the Gladstones letter?

[mkontheroad]

The letter of claim was sent to ES Parking Enforcement Ltd, a copy of this letter was also sent to Gladstones Solicitors telling them that their client had failed to send sar to me 

sorry for the confusion 

 

[FTMDave]

No confusion.

You did exactly the right thing with the letters.

Sorry to keep bombarding you with questions, but there is a reason.  You have got Certificates of Posting for the SAR, the LoC and the letter to Gladstones, right?

[FTMDave]

Well the 14 days are up tomorrow and this not having the paperwork is going to put you at a massive disadvantage when preparing for the court case.

Can you please confirm about the Certificates of Posting?

[mkontheroad]

Apologies for the late reply I was in hospital 

I have it but can’t seem to find it, will keep checking 

thank you 

Edited July 25, 2023 by dx100uk
unnecessary previous post quote removed

[FTMDave]

Sorry to hear about hospital.

I honestly thought involving Gladstones would produce the SAR, but I was wrong.

Not knowing what the hell you're accused of is going to put you in a dire position in the court hearing, unless we can find a solution.

Given that the fleecers will lie and say they never received a SAR request, finding the three CoPs is essential.  Please come back here when you've dug them out.

 

 

 

[dx100uk]

On 27/04/2023 at 15:06, mkontheroad said:

also today I received this email from the lawyers 

they wont do anything nor are they obliged to in a way, they have your email address, which if you'd been reading up, you should have spotted should have been killed the very next day by replying stating dont use email.  writing only .

whilst this persists there is no way they are going to send you anything until 1 min before the court deadline to exchange witness statements.

[Nicky Boy]

I can see an adjournment request looming... On the day would be good, it would cost the fleecers their reps fee.

Not good for mk though...

Still, IF the sar non compliance runs full course, at least mk would financially cover some of the time he's wasted on all this.

[mkontheroad]

Thank you for kindness regarding being in hospital, feeling much better 

I was in a dilemma could not find the proof of postage but astonishingly today got what I assume is sar from them, kindly advise what should I do etc 

thanking you in advance 

 

 

sar return.pdf

[FTMDave]

OK, a lot to read through.

Well done for running through a brick wall and eventually getting these idiots to send the paperwork.

It's not really important, but if you're up for revenge you could report them to the ICO for ignoring your SAR, and only jumping into action when you threatened to sue them in the county court.  When they eventually replied there was proof that they had received your communications and simply ignored them.

It is however concerning that you couldn't immediately find the CoPs.  You're in legal dispute with nasty pieces of work and paperwork can't go missing again, otherwise these vile fleecers will take full advantage.

So - is it definitely your car on the Spinningfields Estate?

Is the address on their letters your real address?

I think they have ballsed up the timings to create keeper liability under POFA, but others more knowledgeable will confirm.  This is not an ANPR caputure.  They refer to MNPR.  About 20 minutes after the original photos it looks like some creep has walked up to your car and taken a photo.

Their own photos show their signage to be pants too.

[dx100uk]

so for an mnpr the pcn should have been attached to the windscreen at the time of the incident, 21-14 2022-10-22 not sent in the post on 2022-10-28.

and thus ofcourse the ntk would have been sent out to early but thats not included in the SAR...interesting - they already KNEW they'd screwed up so didnt send one.!!

 

 

[lookinforinfo]

Very strange PCN. It looks as if it was sent out to you on time but there is nothing to say that if the driver does not pay within 28 days that the keeper then becomes liable for the charge. This would seem to suggest that perhaps Spinningfields is subject to Byelaws so the Protection of Freedoms Act  does not apply.

But over the page of the PCN it says that the transfer of liability [from the driver to the keeper ]will occur by 25.11.2022 if the charge is still unpaid.. So the upshot is that the PCN fails to comply with the  Act therefore the keeper is not liable for the charge-only the driver is now liable. 

 

[Nicky Boy]

Dear oh dear,

Where do we start with all this?

Well, let's start with a biggy...

This is an incomplete SAR response!
P6 of PDF
Status Log: only displaying back to 2.12.22. This debacle started on 22.10.22 nearly 6 weeks earlier.
So, we have no way to cross reference whether all documents have been supplied.
(Does this mean that the SAR non-compliance claim can be actually started?)

Failure to declare 3rd part recipients of personal data
P1 of PDF
Fleecers declare Gladstones as a recipient of data.
However there are other recipients:
KnightPark... pages 3 to 6 of PDF (bottom of all pages)
ZZPS... page 3 of PDF

Purpose of processing data
P2 of PDF
"PCN is an attempt to recoup lost revenue"
As far as I can see there is no instance of "lost revenue" in this case, so their claim is totally invalid and why are they processing personal data?

Mitigation
P14 of PDF
This looks suspiciously like it might be a (redacted) pic of the driver. So why didn't Daniel Swift (the operative) just ask the driver to move on?

Won't accept postal communications?
P9 of the PDF
Last sentence at bottom of the page. Is this lawful?
They obviously accept post (SAR request). Are they denying the victim the opportunity to evidence their communication with POP?

Out of interest is there any photographic evidence still available online as stated on P9 of the PDF?

And of course "stopping v parking" has already been done to death on the forum.

[mkontheroad]

Here are all the photos, did not think were relevant, 

thank you

sar photos.pdf

So - is it definitely your car on the Spinningfields Estate? yes my car

Is the address on their letters your real address? yes correct but for sure did not receive anything from them apart from the claim form

It is however concerning that you couldn't immediately find the CoPs.  You're in legal dispute with nasty pieces of work and paperwork can't go missing again, otherwise these vile fleecers will take full advantage - indeed a massive lesson learned, 

Please advise what steps I should take 

Thanking you in advance

[FTMDave]

You've sent off the N180/DQ, and got the evidence from the fleecers, so the immediate tasks are done.

Ar some point the case will be allocated to your local court and they will inform you.

The best thing to do is to use this "down time" to read similar threads so you get up to speed with the court process.