Letter Of Claim for death of cat now Court Claim received.

[danyboy72]

hello,

i am being taken to the small claims courts.

i need advice on what to do please.

parts of the claim is untrue/unsubstantiated.

the person is trying to inflate the prices for fraudulent financial gain.(ie: £192 for a jcb digger to dig a grave for the cat!)

 

here is what happened:

 

i was walking my 2 dogs in a rural area and they were off the lead on a public footpath up ahead of me and apparently they chased and attacked a cat that was in the verge of a field. i did not even see a cat or the incident. i am only relaying what the cat owner said as they said they saw my dogs bite it. the cat owners said they got my dogs away from the cat. the cat ran off after the incident. my dogs have scratches on their faces due to the fight between the cat and dogs. as i came up to where my dogs where, the owner came over to me screaming abuse and her partner physically threatened me before i even had chance to say anything or apologise. 

 

i tried to call the police on my phone due to the threats and abuse but he wouldn't allow me to as he was threatening me and shouting that he was a police officer himself. when they eventually called the police, the police said there's been no crime committed and its a civil matter. at this point i knew he was not a police officer 

 

the first problem i have is that he detained me against my will and impersonated a police officer.

i had no intention of leaving and tried to apologise , i told him i would contribute toward a vet bill but not pay for the entire amount from the vets as the incident was 50/50 and i treated my dogs injuries myself. i was physically shaken and frightened because this man was overtly aggressive saying he goes to the gym and he's in training and 'pumped up' (steroid rage?)

 

i phoned the police the next day for advice about the intended violence from the man keeping me against my will and under duress, i also told the police i am willing to pay towards the vet fees as im a fair person and an animal lover. the police said i had no obligation to pay anything, i told them i have a conscience and want to contribute, they insisted i haven't done anything illegal., on the other hand they said the man can get in trouble for impersonating a policeman.

 

they only evidence i have of him impersonating a policeman is the 999 phone call at the time he made to the police, as in the background i was saying "he told me he is a policeman" as i wanted it recorded on the phone call and then he shouted to me "shut up..shut up" as he knew it was a lie and was not a policeman.

 

i have since had numerous threatening text messages with demands for various amounts of money for various different things that i did not agree to...also demands for cash for bills from two different vets. i believe the texts could constitute as harassment as they are excessive/demanding/rude/false.

 

since all of this I've had a 'letter before action'.

 

most of the accusations are untrue and the amounts of money are unsubstantiated.

 

i have attached a photo of the letter ive received and the points that are untrue are as follows:

 

1. QUOTE = "entered my property" : my dogs did not enter her property at all - they was on a public footpath and then a field.

 

2. QUOTE = "you accepted you where at fault and assured me that you would cover all of my out of pocket expenses" : this is untrue. not at any time did i say it was my fault as the incident was 50/50. i did not at any time tell her that i would cover ALL of her out of pocket expenses - I told her as it was 50/50 and the cat come out worse i would CONTRIBUTE toward a vet bil ie: £300 one off payment.

 

3. QUOTE = "attend two different vets" : why would you take your pet to 2 different vets? surely you'd just take it to your regular vets.

 

4. QUOTE = "as a result of your negligence" : i was not negligent, my dogs where under supervised exercise and ive done nothing illegal. unlike her cat which was allowed to roam the roads and countryside unsupervised.

 

5. the cat owner has not produced any receipts for the money she is trying to claim from me ie: the 2 vets bills.

 

she has not told me

how many miles she drove to the vets or produced evidence and petrol receipts (and i know the local vets and no way would the trips add up to the amount she is saying the petrol costs). 

 

has not shown any bill for the jcb digger to dig the grave for the cat! 

 

is also now claiming the initial cost of the cat for £500...there is no receipt for the cat or proof of purchase for the cat...and i didnt even see the cat! it could of even been a stray...and needless to say, i never said i would cover the cost of the cat or any other expense as the police told me i dont have to.

 

at the end of the day my dogs did not kill her cat as the cat ran off. the cat could have even been in bad health before the fight that the vets discovered when taken there .. as she mentioned the cat was ill with a hernia in a text.

 

.and the fight could have contributed to the death but not actually caused the death?  who knows.

 

the same could have happened to my dogs as they suffered injuries but i just chose to care for my dogs myself rather than taking them to the vets and then sending the bill (or an inflated bill) to the cat owner.

 

I have googled the 'practice direction on pre action conduct under the civil Procedure rules' and paragraph 13-16...but i do not understand any of it at all as its all a bit vague?

 

could anyone please advise me on what to do and what the civil procedure thing means????

 

thanks in advance,

Dan.

 

Letter of Claim.pdf

[danyboy72]

 

Hello FTMdave,

thanks for your advice.

 

I am willing to contribute £300 towards their vet bill. this is the amount i have told them from the start i am willing to make as i have a conciounce even though my dogs were injured aswell but i treated them myself.

i have not put this in writing.

i have told them in a text that i will pay £300 but this was mainly to stop them from keep texting me...basically harassment texts from the cat owners mother - she has texted me well over 10 times...texts at like 6am in the morning etc

........

 

thanks for your advice bankfodder,

 

yes i will tell them i'm not accepting responsibility and will ask them for all expenses incurred out of interest.

 

i will also ask for pictures of the cat etc.

 

in regards to burying the cat...i have suspicions that she will have obtained a false invoice for it if she produces one...the reason being is that she runs a livery for retired horses and she is incahoots with a local landscaping firm just up the road from her livery that do all her landscaping/digging the graves for her dead horses with their diggers.

 

should i ask for proof that it is an actual cat buried there?

 

thanks.

[danyboy72]

yes bankfodder i will post it here - i will do it tomorrow.

what do you mean conficted oriented?..im not good with htis sort of stuff which is why i asked what to do/what to put in the letter/ask for proof the cat is actually buried as i think they are just pulling a fast one to get money for nothing

[danyboy72]

sorry i think i know what you mean ...

i meant that im willing to pay £300 toward the vet bill as i intially told them at the time...

but im not taking responsibility for her out of pocket expnses ie: the jcb / the other vet bill / the £65 petrol costs which in reality was probably no more than £10

[danyboy72]

of course im prepared to do that..as i said before - i will post it tomorrow - i didnt think there would be any harm in asking what to put in the letter?

[danyboy72]

ok ive done a quick letter pointing out the relvant parts in response to her letter...and copied and pasted the parts you and FTMDave have told me to put/ask.

 

 

I have received your letter.

Yes I have received probably too many text messages that your mother has sent and at rather inappropriate times of the day, ie: at 6am disturbing my sleep, these texts should have been sent at a more acceptable and considerate time of day, after 8am for example.

 

On the day of 28th of January my dogs were being exercised off the lead and supervised on a public path which is not illegal and they did not enter your property.

You allowed your cat to roam the countryside unsupervised and was on a verge of a public road and a field.
I did not witness the incident, I only have your partners say so that it happened. I have not seen any proof that the incident and damage took place on your cat.

 

Your partner flew off the handle and detained me under duress by showing excessive aggression, he told me he was a policeman and did not allow me to call the police to verify his identity. Your partner refused to tell me his police badge number. This was extremely distressing for myself especially as he abused and discriminated me by saying "you're not going anywhere you fat Piers Morgan - ive been to the gym and im pumped up ready for you - im a lot fitter than you so your not going anywhere".

When your partner phoned the police I raised my voice the police could hear me asking for his badge number to which your partner shouted at me "shut up, shut up" and still wouldnt tell me or the Police on the phone his badge number.

 

If your partner is indeed a police officer then his behaviour must be brought into question as I was told this by the Police myself when I rang them a couple of days after the incident.

 

I have suffered mental anguish and depression since this abuse and behaviour from your partner. I have proof of his demeanour in the transcript recording of the 999 call, it also has recorded me saying "There's a Police Officer here present but he wont tell me his badge number".

 

I did not accept I was at fault and told your partner whilst he was on the phone to the police at the time that I would 'contribute' toward the vet bill if there's any injury to the cat and it would be as much as I could afford BUT I did not say I would assure you or pay the entire vet bill amount and I certainly did not say I would pay any of your out of pocket expenses.

The offer was made to pay £300 at a later date to your mother via text and I explained the most I could afford is £300.

 

This incident is regarded as 50/50 due to my dogs sustaining cuts and scratches on their faces from your cat and I tended to my dogs wounds myself.

 

I dont accept any responsibility for the out of pocket expenses but I would be interested to receive any evidence of injury or damage and expenses incurred.

For example I require pictures of the cat before and after the incident. I would also require a report from the vet which apparently treated the animal. If there are two vets then I require a report from each of them including invoices for any expenses incurred.  

I understand from what your partner was saying at the time that he was a police officer and so therefore I'd like to have his collar number.

I would also like clear and accurate documented mileage for your petrol costs and the miles per gallon of the model of your car.

I would also like detailed proof that your cat has been buried by using a 'JCB Digger' and a receipt for said work done.

In respect of your claim that the cat is a pedigree Bengal cat, I require to see any registration documents and evidence of pedigree and the bill of sale which you must have received when you originally bought the animal but I must point out that the £500 price paid for the cat is not enforcable now, ie: as an example if I bought a £10k car 15 years ago and it got written off now..the value is significantly less..say £500 not £10,000. The law is quite clear on this.

 

So just to reiterate, I am prepared to offer you £300 towards your vet bill as originally stated, I do not state and have not stated I will pay any of your out of pocket expenses.

I do not accept any entire liability or fault as the incident was 50/50 due to all animals involved suffered injury.

 

 

p.s. i like the way the filter has changed his C word to 'peirs morgan' lol

[danyboy72]

thank you bankfodder and everyone else that has helped.

 

ive just the letter youve revised for me bankfodder - thanks - i forgot to mention that the cat is not kept at her home address - the car lives on a field/in stables at her mothers property as her mother runs a retired horse livery.

there are numerous cats living in the field..she mentioned another bengal and she has feral cats there aswell....i dont know if its significant but thought it may be worth mentioning.

[danyboy72]

(map/location photos uploaded)

yes thats right bankfodder - the mother of the cat owner has a field that has retired horses on it, the cat owner lets her bengals roam free in her mothers field and they sleep/live in the barn along with other feral cats that they like having around to catch the mice.

the cat owner has the brother of the dead cat living in the barn to catch mice...the field is not secure to hold cats..they roam free.

neighbouring field owners said that they have to regularly stop in the road when driving and beep their horn to get get the cats to move as they sit in the middle of the road.

 

the cat was on the side of the road on the day the incident happened and the cat owners partner (the policeman) came out of the bushes on the side of the road in the photo. these bushes/wooded part is an area of about 20-30 foot that is not her property - it is a verge in front of her property. the boundary of her property at that part after the verge is not even fenced off with a horserail (post and rail) as its so delapidated its laying in the bushes as it fell down.

Screenshot 1.pdf

 

Screenshot 2.pdf

[danyboy72]

8 minutes ago, BankFodder said:

Are you able to get a good photograph of the dilapidated fence

 ive gone on to google street view and gone further along the road to see if i can see anything...the first part nearer to the incident that isnt obscured by trees and bushes is screenshotted and uploaded...it doesnt show the delapidated part but shows the horserail fence (which is inadequate to keep cats in) and the distance detween the road and her property which is about 20-30 foot. it was on this verge that the incident took place which is not her property.

thanks bankfodder.

Screenshot 3.pdf

[danyboy72]

yes no probs - the next time im out there i will photo the delipidated fence. thanks for your prompt help

[danyboy72]

ok thanks - i wont contact them and will report back straight away

 

i have had a text picture from them today ..harassing me with picture of them posting the letter through my door saying its been 1 week now etc..i havent replied

[danyboy72]

BankFodder...ive just realised... the part in the letter that says: "In terms of the contents of your letter, I'm afraid that your recollection is completely different to mine" would maybe need changing as the cat owner was not even there.

The 2 people that were there was the cat owners husband (the policeman) and the cat owners mother (who owns the horse field).

but the catowner is the one seeking money/letter claim

 

should i put:

"In terms of the contents of your letter, I'm afraid that your interpretation of the incident is completely different to mine considering you wasnt even there" ?

[danyboy72]

cat in field.pdflol, i have took advice from bankfodder and ftmdave which have provided educational and more than helpful answers - sorry but you havent helped me one bit as they were off topic and innacurate. no my opionion,..just the facts.

On 20/03/2023 at 16:29, BankFodder said:

@danyboy72, @whitelist - I'm going to move these posts to the bear garden if this continues.

 

Has the letter been sent?  Why not.

There are very limited costs in a small claims action

going now bankfodder - thanks

 

BankFodder  ..ive just uploaded a couple of the dozens of text messages the cat owners mother keeps sending me...

if your not familiar with the small claims court stuff as i am they can be quite worrying..but realise now they are just inaccuracies/lies and she probably worded it like that thinking that shes going to frighten me into paying some money straight away without seeing any proof of expenses. also she says its the start of the small claims court process which i now know is rubbish thanks to FTMDave.

also a theres a photo ive received via text...she said here's a photo of the cats brother pining for his dead sister....its a photo of the brother cat that lives in her field...would this be useful as future evidence as it shows the cats are not contained ? thanks

 

my brother is at the post office now with the letter...i will have the tracking number soon.

 

as an afterthought...what i've she is not in to sign for the delivery of the letter??

should i hand deliver one before the 14 days is up?

 

text messages.pdf

[danyboy72]

yes agreed honeybee13, thank you - i will have a look...im not that familiar with these forums either as you can probably tell ive only just joined and the first time ive needed help of this sort - cheers

[danyboy72]

thanks ftmdave

 

 

thanks - @Kyosanto i dont forgive your cat for killing mice and canaries but at least we arent ripping into each over about it - agreed lets stay reasonable - sorry if im a bit techy but ...i cant help replying to people (not you) giving it the high and mighty

 

and also people keep saying on here 'reasonable control' whats reasonable? as i said its not that clear cut as my definition of reasonable is different to yours and that is different from a judges...so its not definite and not clear cut - it would be better if they acknowledged that when posting rather than sounding condescending!

 

[danyboy72]

thanks labrat,

ive had a photo text from the catowners mother showing her posting the letter through my letterbox....and ive just had another text message saying "its been a week now...youve got a week left to reply" and other stuff

[danyboy72]

i have ignored it bankfodder, thanks - just thought id mention it incase it was a breach of protocol as suggested by labrat.

 

nicky boy - the letter is from the catowner but the mother is doing all the texting/harassing and delivering the letter to my door...ive actually not even seen the cat owner.....and at the time of incident the mother and the catowners partner was there

Edited March 21, 2023 by danyboy72

[danyboy72]

thanks dx100uk...yes your right...you should see some of the texts ive recieved.

[danyboy72]

will do - thanks bankfodder

 

[danyboy72]

thanks dave and dx for your understanding and support - much appreciated.

 

quick update - ive just checked the tracking number and its back at the depot as no-one was in to sign for it on the delivery attempt.

ive re-scheduled it to be delivered tomorrow of the royal mail website.

if they dont accept it should i hand deliver it on saunday as the 14 days is up on monday?

[danyboy72]

thanks - i will do

 

just checked the tracking again and its been updated - its been collected yesterday form the local depot in town - signed for by the boyfriend aka 'the policeman'

[danyboy72]

hello, yes - ive just received a reply letter (most of it lies, missing receipts, invoices with a different address and no documented milage) i am trying to use adobe scanner and will upload them in a bit.

 

i have since photographed the dilapidated fence that bankfodder requested...it is attached

 

here is the letter i received.

points i noticed that are incorrect/havent been answered :

 

1. i did not attempt to run away.

 

2. she says i allowed my dogs to trespass on private property which i didnt as it happened on a verge.

 

3. she is now saying there are another two witnesses - there was no other witnesses apart from her mother and partner that saw it.

 

4. i was not found running away because i ran towards my dogs!

 

5. she has not supplied a receipt for the burial costs. she has not supplied any comparator estimates.

 

6. she hasnt supplied an accurate route or detailed miles travelled in her car or petrol receipts - instead shes said its 145 miles (which i doubt) and that the government say its 45p a mile(which is what the gov says is for income tax not what you can charge other people)....i thought she can only claim what it actually cost her in her car? ,..not a recommended charge for miles for income tax use as it says on the .gov website. she also hasnt supplied the make and model of her car.

 

7. she hasnt supplied pictures of the cat before and after.

 

8. she did not confirm that the address from which she is writing is the cats home.

 

9. she has not explained why the cat was away from her home on that day.

 

10. some of the vets invoices are a different address ...they start with "the lodge" and are not her address of writing or the field that her mother owns.

 

merged and compressed

3 letters merged.pdf appendix 1-21_compressed.pdf

[danyboy72]

dave - they said they paid around £200 to hire a digger to bury the cat ...but hevent got a receipt for it...i reckon they are just ramping up every price they can think of.

[danyboy72]

yeah i know nicky...but using a jcb to bury a cat and then not produce a receipt.....sounds suspect to me

[danyboy72]

your right dave - thinking of the most expensive way to bury any pet is the last thing on your mind.

no Dave muscle man has probably never done a hard days graft in his life lol, they are just milking it for every expense they can think of