Evri - Lost 2 ebay parcels approx. £600 - court claim issued

[jmxo]

Firstly, fantastic forum you guys have. I initially created a reddit post venting out my frustrations, the post gained a lot of traction but eventually I got led here.

I have been doing quite some reading and my story is very similar many here, and figured its best to create my own topic. I'm quite nervous though since this process feels daunting. Apologies if I am writing too much in this initial post.

For reference: 1st pair sold on 2nd Feb eBay sale value of £302.75, 2nd pair sold on 7th Feb eBay sale value of £283.35.

Summary: Sold pairs of trainers on eBay and sent with Evri via their Packlink option. I typically use Royal Mail but eBay's interface specifically recommends using Packlink/Evri to "avoid issues with postal strikes". I purchased additional "signed-for" for 90p but did not purchase enhanced-compensation (almost identical to many stories here)

 

1st Parcel

2nd Feb

- sold on 2nd Feb eBay sale value of £302.75. Purchased Evri postage label via Packlink. Extra 90p "signed-for" purchased but not enhanced compensation (full insurance)

- dropped off at local ParcelShop, received receipt and tracking.

14th Feb

- lack of any tracking updates since my drop off. I try to contact eBay and Evri but I am redirected to Packlink customer support. They advice me to process a loss claim through them.

- at 12pm, I file loss claim, and Packlink confirm to have opened a formal investigation for a lost parcel with EVRi. The loss claim also shows eBay proof of sale showing the full value of the parcel.

- at 6pm, via email Parcel is declared lost by Packlink/Evri following an investigation. Packlink intends to refund the postage fee + £25 which is the standard Evri payment for a lost parcel, however this is done so unilaterally without my agreement.

15th Feb

- I reply to the previous email that the compensation of £25 is unacceptable and does not cover the cost of the parcel. I receive no response.

16th Feb

-  Packlink issues compensation of £25 + postage refund and sends email confirmation.
- I attempt to reach out to Evri through email but receive no response.

17th Feb

- Buyer opens item not received dispute and the case was resolved in their favour. Full refund was given since I could not provide proof of delivery.

- I attempt to reach out to Evri through their phone service but cannot make any headways or get through to a human.

 

2nd Parcel

7th Feb

- sold on 7th Feb eBay sale value of £283.35. Purchased Evri postage label via Packlink. Extra 90p "signed-for" purchased but not enhanced compensation (full insurance)

8th Feb

- dropped off at local ParcelShop, received receipt and tracking.

14th Feb

- lack of any tracking updates since my drop off. I try to contact eBay and Evri but I am redirected to Packlink customer support. They advice me to process a loss claim through them.

- I file loss claim, and Packlink confirm to have opened a formal investigation for a lost parcel with EVRi. The loss claim also shows eBay proof of sale showing the full value of the parcel.

18th Feb

- Buyer opens item not received dispute.

19th Feb

- Parcel is deemed unaccounted for by Evri customer service via email. Not offered compensation. No updates directly from Packlink.

- Buyer is refunded

The story is he same.

I am correct that the best course of action would be to just focus on claiming for 1 parcel at a time? I figure if I am successful with Parcel 1 I can just repeat my process and experience with the 2nd one anyway for an easy win.

It's a bit nerve-wracking but from reading through various threads here, the next process I send a letter of claim to Evri, clearly stating that I would issue a county court claim against them in 14 days and without any further notice unless they reimburse me in full before that date.

Protocol seems to be: formal complaint >  they ignore or redirect to Packlink > Letter of claim giving 14 days > they ignore > MCOL > they acknowledge and file defence > wait for DQ and agree to mediation > during mediation use Rights of Third Parties Act 1999 and do not settle for lowball offers > things may drag out but they will settle before court

Between all the hassle and back and forths, I'm not quite sure what qualifies as a formal complaint. To be sure, I sent a fresh complaint to the EvriSupport email on the 18th.

I have already begun writing drafts of the various steps like Letter of Claim, Response to their response, MCOL w/ Particulars of Claim (Why you believe you're owed the money, Timeline of what happened). Don't want to get ahead of myself but still want to be prepared for each step of the process, as I know I have to stick to the schedule once I sent the LoC.

[BankFodder]

You have written a very long post and I haven't gone through the whole thing in detail .

 

My understanding that you sold two separate pairs of trainers through two separate sales on eBay .

Both of them have disappeared. Sounds like theft .

Have you actually made a complaint to EVRi? What have they said ?

Were you insured for either of these ? Was the value correctly declared ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[jmxo]

Hi, thanks for replying BankFodder, I've read a lot of posts where you've guided others through the process.

 

Yes 2 seperate parcels, both lost early on in Evris delivery process. Unfortunately by the time I realised Evri hadn't updated tracking in a while, I had already sent the 2nd parcel.

 

Yes unfortunately I can probably assume someone during the process has stolen it. Quite coincidental for high value sneakers to go missing in identical ways, but alas. (Parcels are well packaged, I have sucessfully used Royal Mail to ship packages like these, Evri is the only difference)

 

Yes, a variety of complaints were made to all parties (ebay, packlink,evri). Just like many other peoples situations they all redirect blame/responsibility to packlink. As mentioned I was unsure what qualifies as a formal complaint, to which I sent a fresh complaint to the EvriSupport email on the 18th.

 

What have they said: Included in my summary on 14th feb, parcel 1 was declared lost by packlink via email. and today 19th feb, EVRi (for some reason not packlink) declared parcel 2 as lost via email.

 

No, I purchased additional "signed-for" but did not purchase enhanced-compensation (like many others here). Packlink only offer £25 compensation for lost parcels, which they unilaterally gave me without agreement for parcel 1 (I made sure to send an email that this wasn't good enough, which was ignored), haven't heard anything about parcel 2's compensation yet.

 

Correctly declared: Sales were done through eBay, and I purchased the Packlink/Evri postage through eBays interface. From reading other threads here, this makes the values correctly declared as they know the value of the sale/parcel with this intergrated process.

[BankFodder]

I suggest that you run this as two separate claims, but in parallel with a gap of about 2 weeks between them .

 

Prepare a letter of claim for the first one and post it here in PDF format .

We will use that also as the model for the second claim .

Open an account with the MoneyClaim website and start preparing your particulars of claim as well and let us see that before you click it off

 

Start off with the first letter of claim

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[jmxo]

Hi BankFodder,

I'm attaching my draft letter of claim.

Also a quick update on Parcel 2 - today via email Parcel 2 is declared lost by Packlink/Evri following an investigation. Packlink intends to refund the postage fee + £25 which is the standard Evri payment for a lost parcel, however this is done so unilaterally without my agreement.

Just like with Parcel 1 I sent a reply declining stating that it doesn't sufficiently cover the costs and proceeded to recap the costs. I assume they won't read it anyway but it's a paper trail if needed showing I don't consider this good enough.

letter of claim-2.pdf

[BankFodder]

Ok, that's fine .

Make sure that you stick to your timeline.

 

 

Don't bluff .

 

Register with the MoneyClaim website and start preparing your claim. Post your particulars of claim here for us to see before you click it off

 

 

[jmxo]

Hi BankFodder,

 

I'm attaching a redacted version of my particulars of claim draft for you to look over

At the end of the form, evidence (optional) it says is not required at this stage, and as far as I'm aware you advise against adding anyway so I left it blank

Thanks for the help again,

money claim online.pdf

[BankFodder]

That looks good .

 

Get ready to click it off on day 15 .

 

Keep us informed

 

 

[jmxo]

Minor update,

 

As expected, over a week has passed and i've not heard back from them. Next week I'll be firing off the MCOL.

[jmxo]

Update,

 

MCoL submitted at 9.00 on the dot.

 

"EVRi Parcelnet Ltd trading as Evri has until 4pm on 3 April 2023 to respond to your claim. They can request an extra 14 days if they need it.

You can request a County Court Judgment against them if they don’t respond by the deadline."

 

So i'll just sit tight until then. From what I've read, I will wait for a potential last minute acknowledgment of service and filing of defence. If so, I share a redacted copy of the defence with you here and prepare for DQ and mediation.

 

Not going to get too carried away though so I'll just take it one step at a time.

[jmxo]

Update,

Received an email, Evri got given an extra 14 days to respond. Now their deadline is moved to 17th April.

[jmxo]

Finally received a response, attaching a redacted pdf their defence

 

From what I remember reading previous posts and defences in this stage, I think this is pretty much their usual spiel? Also same Judy as other posts

 

Anything noteworthy or concerning in here? I'm supposed to reply by 15th of May

 

Thanks again,

claim-response2.pdf

Edited April 12, 2023 by jmxo
making the sentence more clear

[dx100uk]

says it all really....

 

2.9. 8. The last tracking point for the Parcel was on 8th February 2023. There are no further tracking points after this date and therefore the Defendant accepts that the Parcel is lost.

 

in THEIR system and trying to wriggle out by blaming a self employed collection agent operating for the defendant. 

 

the rest of it is yea old embarrassed defence wriggle that went out of court rooms in the 1990's neither admits nor denies...

[BankFodder]

You have a reply deadline. Does this mean that you have received a directions questionnaire?

[jmxo]

Doesn't seem I have, although their defence pdf contains their DQ where they've already agreed to mediation. The steps on the website are:

 

1. How they responded

View the defendant’s response COMPLETE

2. Choose what to do next

Decide whether to proceed COMPLETE

Free telephone mediation INCOMPLETE

3. Your hearing requirements

Give us details in case there’s a hearing INCOMPLETE

4. Submit

Check and submit your response INCOMPLETE

[BankFodder]

@Andyorch

[Andyorch]

You must complete the following....

 

Free telephone mediation INCOMPLETE

3. Your hearing requirements

Give us details in case there’s a hearing INCOMPLETE

4. Submit

Check and submit your response INCOMPLETE

[jmxo]

Hi guys

 

I'm attaching a redacted version of my response to defence/proceeding with claim draft for you to look over

This process has taken long, so I've tried to refresh my understanding by reading others posts, and based my responses on those. If I typed something wrong somewhere then I appreciate the help

 

Regardless, from what I've read its unlikely for this to even get to a hearing, and they should concede after many back and forths to pay in full from the mediation.

Thanks for the help again,

 

Side note, I did notice in their defence they said "The Claimant is put to strict proof as to the value of the claim". If I recall correctly in previous posts this is answered due to the postage purchase being made through the ebay/Packlink online portal, meaning Evri were aware via eBay on the value of the item. Is that correct?

 

proceeding with claim.pdf

 

sorry it won't let me edit it twice, instead of "the postage purchase being made through the ebay/Packlink online portal"

 

I meant "the eBay sale being made and directly linking through to the intergrated ebay/Packlink online portal"

Edited April 14, 2023 by jmxo
adding side note

[jmxo]

Hi,

 

I just want to check if the above is ok to submit? In both the email I got and in the claim file, the deadline they gave me is 15th May

 

However for some reason the MCOL dashboard is showing 17th april, today, which was the previous deadline for Evri to submit their defence. So their system isn't updated

 

Just to avoid any potential issue I think I should submit it today. I'm attaching images of the deadlines

Untitled document.pdf

[BankFodder]

Yes, I think you are right. Go ahead straight away

[jmxo]

Thank you for the swift reply, I've submitted my questionaire.

 

It now says my mediation appointment will be arranged within 28 days. Will keep you updated

 

Also, I've been refreshing my reading here and your post #25 on this post seems like it should be a great skeleton for my stance in the mediation. thanks

 

[BankFodder]

You don't need a skeleton arguement for the mediation. However rehearse the arguments. 

 

Let us know when the mediation date is given to you

[jmxo]

Hi BankFodder,

 

Received an email that mediation is scheduled for the 5th of May, so 3 weeks from now.

 

Side note - just reading through their email and they say you have to abide by the mediation terms, notably  "I am willing to negotiate on the amount of the claim and I will consider a compromise" and the mediator can end the mediation if either party breaches terms.

 

However I am aware through reading many stories here how they were able to hold out for every penny, Evri will start saying things like "final offer" but come back slightly higher. I have also read you state many times we are under no obligation to accept any partial settlement and the case is only concluded once the parties verbally accept an offer. The compromise is that we are not going to drag this out to court and Evri knows they will lose that and waste court's time. I've also read once that someone responded that their compromise was that they didn't need to claim interest, I guess somewhat sarcasically. Would you actually advise that as a response or is it a bit cheeky?

 

Anyway to my point - I've read enough here that I'm confident these are scare tactics and I can hold out until I get 100% of the claim, it's just a little nervy seeing all these tactics pushing us towards compromise. And sounds like even the mediator will lean this way too.

 

It almost seems like this process is pushing us into feeling guilty..

[BankFodder]

It sounds as if you have read it thoroughly and that you understand it perfectly!

 

EVRi have absolutely no right in the matter. You have all rights and this means that any compromise comes from you and not from them.

You can point this out to the mediator as well

[jmxo]

Hi BankFodder,

It's about a week until my mediation call, so I've written down my arguments. I've seen most threads here just crack on, but this is probably my nervous, student side wanting to make sure I'm ok.

Hoping you can just check through this and see if I've got everything correct. I believe the arguments pretty much come from things I've read and learned so far.

Also feel free to tell me if I'm talking to much in parts or elaborating unnecessarily for a mediation call.

 

Opening position

On 2/2/2023 I sold an item through ebay, and from ebays selling portal used the defendant's service to send a parcel worth £302.75
The parcel never arrived at the destination and he Defendant accepts that the Parcel is lost.

The postage was purchased via a third party (eBay Packlink portal) but I am pursuing the defendant as I am entitled to do under the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties Act 1999).

The defendants are failing to reimburse me for the trainers on the basis that I did not purchase their additional insurance cover.

The defendant's requirement that the I should protect myself against the negligence or criminality of their employees is unfair within the meaning of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 and therefore unenforceable.

I am claiming for £277.75 + interest per section 69 County Courts Act 1984 + court fees, which is due to Packlink unilaterally giving me £25 of small compensation already.

 

Dispute: If Evri say I did not purchase insurance

The courier industry insurance requirement is a very clear attempt to deprive me of statutory rights unless I pay an additional fee.

The rights conferred by the Consumer Rights Act are "rights" and therefore do not need to be bought or paid for in any way. This is an attempt to restrict or exclude the courier's liability and is contrary to section 57 of the Consumer Rights Act 2015

Repeat: The defendant's requirement that the I should protect myself against the negligence or criminality of their employees is unfair within the meaning of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 and therefore unenforceable.

And you are aware of four judgements, at least two of which are against EVRi themselves and which support your view that the insurance is a duplication of rights and is a breach of the consumer rights act and that you are happy to go to court and get 1/5 judgement if that's what they want
 

 

Dispute: If Evri say my contract is with Packlink, not them

Repeat: I am pursuing the defendant as I am entitled to do under the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties Act 1999)

"I enjoy all the rights of a direct contracting party if you are either a named beneficiary of the contract or you are part of a class of person who might reasonably be expected to be a beneficiary of the contract."

Packlink are registered/domiciled in Spain, bringing it against Packlink in Spain is impossible for me. I suspect this is intentionally done to make this difficult for claims.

If Evri were allowed to escape liability on this basis, it would effectively be an unfair term of their contract with me and therefore unenforceable under the Consumer Rights Act

Evri bear equal contractual responsibility because there is an act of Parliament called the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 which provides that an official third parties enjoy all the rights of a direct contracting partner.

If EVRi wants to dispute this then you will be happy to go to court on the issue and you will oblige them to provide a copy of their contract with Packlink for the court to make its own decision. You are confident that you will take the benefit of the 1999 act. If they want a judgement against them on this then you are happy to oblige

 

Dispute: Proof Evri knew the £ value of the item

The eBay sale being made and directly linking through to the intergrated ebay/Packlink online portal, meaning Evri were aware via eBay on the value of the item

 

Why I am not compromising for a reduced offer (both from Evri and potentially the mediator)

I do not wish to waste the courts time and our time but I'm not here to compromise on my rights. The compromise is that we don't have to drag this out to court so I won't be able to defeat and get a judgement against Evri.

Evri have absolutely no right in the matter. I have all rights and Evri know this. Any compromise should come from me and not from them.

The compromise is settling this now, and I don't believe a multi-million pound company should be stingy with low-balling to save a few quid. Just offer the full £ and we can proceed. I am under no obligation to accept any partial settlement.

The most I'm willing to compromise is taking off the interest.

 

Also, are there any other arguments or disputes they may bring up during the call?

Edited May 3, 2023 by BankFodder
Edits in red