Lowells/Overdales PAPLOC Now Claimform - old British Gas Debt

[out_of_the_red]

It has the old address only

[Andyorch]

On 20/10/2022 at 18:16, out_of_the_red said:

 

 

Particulars of Claim for reference.

 

1.The claim is for the sum of £682.51 due by the defendant under a British Gas account with an account reference of 12 digits.

 

2.The defendant failed to maintain contractual payments required under the terms of the account agreement.

 

3.The debt was legally assigned to the claimant on 26-11-21, notice of which has been given to the defendant.

 

4.The claim includes statutory interest under S.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at a rate of 8% per annum from the date of assignment to the date of issue of these proceedings in the sum of £46.82.

 

The claimant claims the sum of £729.33

 

What is the total value of the claim? £869.33

 

Proposed Defence

 

1.the Defendant contends that the Claimants particulars of claim are vague and generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.

 

2.Point 1 is noted. Although I was never aware of who my supplier was whilst residing at the property or that I had a financial arrangement with British Gas. I never received a bill during my tenancy of 9 months. The claimant has given no details as to the full breakdown of their claim and what dates it relates to, so I am unable to plead specifically.

 

3. Point 2 is denied as I was never billed during my tenancy and was assured by the Letting Agency that they would complete and inform the utility companies. I'm unaware what dates the claimant refers to within its particulars. I have therefore made a request pursuant to CPR 31.14 signed for by them on 08/10/2022.

 

4. Point 4 is denied. I am unaware of an assignment and have have never been served with a Notice of Assignment pursuant to sec 136 of Law of Property Act 1925

5. Where a claim is based upon a written agreement a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement,  the original(s) should be available at the hearing along with a complete breakdown of how the charges accrued by date and amount under civil procedure rules Practice Direction 16 (7.3).
 
6. Therefore  with the court's permission the Claimant is put to strict proof to:-

a) show and disclose how and where the Defendant has entered into an agreement.
b) show and disclose how the Claimant has reached the amount claimed.
c) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute
or equity to issue a claim.
 
7. As per Civil Procedure Rule 16.5 (4) it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed.

 

8. It is therefore denied that the defendant is indebted to the claimant as alleged or at all.

 

 

Okay I would submit the above as an initial defence simply to stop them applying for judgment and to allow breathing space.

I personally would use this time to try to reach an agreement with Lowell by way of a Tomlin Order but only to pay the debt amount not the court fees...I would start at £70 per month providing they agree and stay the claim.

 

It craws me to give this advice but you have used the energy and its just a shame that its not being paid to BG even though they are at fault for not billing but also for yourself for not informing them of start and finish.

 

I wish you well 

 

Andy

[out_of_the_red]

I have no issue in paying what I have used, it's more that I received nothing. Thank you for all your help

[Andyorch]

Yes I accept that and that's why the defence covers faults on both sides hopefully it will persuade Lowells to enter into an agreeable settlement. 

[out_of_the_red]

Thank so much for your help!

 

[out_of_the_red]

Happy New Year all!

 

I received a letter from Overdales dated 2nd December advising they want to go to mediation. Due to postal strikes this came around the 20th December. Today I received the court paperwork and now need to know what my next steps are. I have to reply by the 20th January.

 

I have noticed on the 2nd December letter from Overdales that they have stated the supply dates for the gas and electric was from 16th March 2018 and ceased on 4 April 2018. This is obviously a typo but does it help me in any way?

BG Claim.pdf

Edited January 6, 2023 by out_of_the_red

[dx100uk]

what court paperwork have you received today DQ N180 form?

 

dx

 

[dx100uk]

ok not from the court but lowells n180 

what is the status of the claim on mcol

 

if you filed your defence back in october? it would be well stayed by now?

 

dx

 

[out_of_the_red]

I received the N180 from the court today. MCOL shows the below:

 

A claim was issued against you on 06/10/2022

Your acknowledgment of service was submitted on 07/10/2022 at 16:22:22

Your acknowledgment of service was received on 10/10/2022 at 01:05:37

Your defence was submitted on 07/11/2022 at 09:27:59

Your defence was received on 07/11/2022 at 12:05:19

DQ sent to you on 03/01/2023

DQ filed by claimant on 03/01/2023

[Andyorch]

 

[out_of_the_red]

Thank you Andy. Shall I leave to last date to file?

[Andyorch]

No advantage you have theirs file it now.

[out_of_the_red]

Am I missing something or is there no way to file online?

 

Don't worry just realised I can't, best get this out special delivery!!

Edited January 19, 2023 by out_of_the_red

[Andyorch]

You can email it also

[dx100uk]

you can fax, email or post your response to the Court instead. 

If you send your response by e mail 
please send it to ccbcaq@hmcts.gsi.gov.uk 

ensure you quote “Claim number xxx xxx (type of response i'e AOS , Defence, N180)” in the subject field. 

 

do not use email for the fleecers copy!

1st class post with free proof of posting from any po counter is ok.

 

dx
.

[out_of_the_red]

I just stuck a first class stamp on the other two and sent the court one special delivery. Is it worth emailing as well just in case?

[Andyorch]

Nothing lost I always advise email and hard copy they cant deny none reciept of both

[out_of_the_red]

Thank you Andy

[out_of_the_red]

Morning, I have my mediation call on Wednesday afternoon. I have read the guidance sent from the court. Is there anything extra I need to prep for?

[Andyorch]

Not particularly but have a bullet point list of the reasons you are defending the claim and raise the points on which your defence relies.

 

You may find the following of assistance.

 

 

[out_of_the_red]

Is it worth highlighting the inconsistency of their paperwork, one letter states the period covered is one month of non-payment and the lack of bills while I lived there or since asking for them during this dispute.

 

Just read your link, thank you, I guess my main points are lack of bills and still lack of bills to prove what I am actually being charged for. 
 

If it gets to the point of what I am prepared to pay is it advisable to low ball and go from there? Again if they cannot even get the dates on their own correspondence correct surely that is a good point for saying I should only pay for the one month.

 

Lastly if I do pay something, no matter how small is agreed to, it is my understanding this will therefore mean the debt is satisfied and cannot then become a CCJ?

Edited February 20, 2023 by out_of_the_red

[dx100uk]

On 27/10/2022 at 14:35, Andyorch said:

Okay I would submit the above as an initial defence simply to stop them applying for judgment and to allow breathing space.

I personally would use this time to try to reach an agreement with Lowell by way of a Tomlin Order but only to pay the debt amount not the court fees...I would start at £70 per month providing they agree and stay the claim.

 

It craws me to give this advice but you have used the energy and its just a shame that its not being paid to BG even though they are at fault for not billing but also for yourself for not informing them of start and finish.

 

I wish you well 

 

Andy

 

if you agree to a tomlin, if you fail to pay each month you auto get a default judgement.(CCJ)

 

dx

 

[out_of_the_red]

I would definitely pay because I don’t want a CCJ but just wondered if their own lack of correct information has any relevance in what my negotiation should be. As I say their last letter stated the non payment period was only one month

[dx100uk]

On 27/10/2022 at 13:49, Andyorch said:

I guess so......okay so you resided at the property from 16th March 2018 and moved out 30th November 2018 roughly 9 months.

Looking at the final bill they charge a total £657.51 ( Elect £394.07 and Gas £263.44 ) no standing charge details or charge unless that's been hidden in the final charge.

 

They projected from the bill your annual usage would be £537.06 and Gas £ 432.43 = £969.49 therefore a projected usage of £80.79 per month. You resided for 9 months so £73.05 per month is what you would have been billed.

 

£657.51 divided by 9 months is £73.05 per months usage allowing for colder and warmer months on the Gas.

 

andy calculated

it doesnt matter what their letters say.

 

its the particulars of claim that are the important part.

 

dx

 

[out_of_the_red]

Ok I understand, hope I don’t mess this up