MS90

[fighter]

I am hoping that there may be someone who can help and advise of the best way forward.

 

Last Thursday my husband received a Further Steps Notice stating he owed 816.00 for a fine to be paid within 10 days. We had no idea what it was for so I called the number on the letter to be told that it was for a speeding offence but no driver details were given, so failure to give details MS90 was decided in court along with the fine and 6 points on his licence as he is the registered keeper of the vehicle.

 

We moved 3 years ago and I stupidly updated the driving licences but must have forgotten the V5 log book and the old address is where the NIP has apparently been going. The old house is a rented property so have no idea who now lives there but we have not received anything and not sure if they have returned the letters as 'no longer at the address' or just binning them. I know of course this is my error so can't blame the occupants for that. However that being said the Further Steps Notice has found it's way to the correct address so I presume this was from his driving licence.

 

Although the vehicle is registered in my husbands name -  I was the driver at the time of the speeding offence. I was caught doing 46mph in a 30 mph road which was near the slip road to the A38. My question is what to do next. I have been told he can do a Statutory Declaration which will then reset the offence and he will need to answer to the two offences. How would this work if he was not the driver?

 

My husband is not a confident man in dealing with courts etc and would rather not go to court and has suggested he leaves the MS90 on his licence and we somehow pay the fine. I am ok with him going to court and being honest to say he was not driving and I deal with the consequences. My husband is arguing that we could end up worse off and I receive a ban or higher fine. Would the MS90 impact his insurance severely or would the SP30 be just as bad.

 

I have not really slept since last week as worried sick. Can anyone please advise what the best way forward is please?

 

 

[unclebulgaria67]

Failure to update the V5 registration document with the new address ?

 

Trying to resolve the 'who was the speeding driver' issue may make matters worse ?  Depends on how this impacts on your husband and you.  Work out the possible outcomes before you ask the Courts to review this.

 

Change your address on your vehicle log book (V5C): Change your name and address at the same time - GOV.UK

WWW.GOV.UK

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Update your vehicle log book (V5C) and send it to DVLA to change your address.

 

Not sure Magistrates would be very sympathetic unless there were difficult personal circumstances that existed at the time when the V5 was not updated. 

[fighter]

No hand on my heart I can say there were no difficult circumstances when we moved apart from the normal trying to remember to change everything so have no excuse apart from an oversight. Which is going to be an expensive one at that. I have now frantically changed the address on the log book so is now correct with DVLA. Believe me no-one is kicking me more than I am at the moment - I can't believe I missed it.

 

The worry as you say is having to defend both offences and making matters worse. If we had received the NIP at the time what would the penalty have likely been for the speed I was doing or would it likely to have gone to court anyway?

[dx100uk]

You need to do a statutory declaration.

 

Dx

[unclebulgaria67]

Fine for an SP30 when doing 46mph in a 30pmh zone would be 100-125% of your weekly wage, subject to a minimum of £100, plus the points that would apply.  Did you have any existing or other pending offences ?

 

dx is suggesting a statutory declaration from you advising that you were the driver.  dx is more knowledgeable on motoring.  I am guessing this is a 'holding your hands up' admitting to the driving offence and forgetting to update the V5 documents, so could not respond to the NIP.

[BazzaS]

When was the alleged offence?

they have 6 months from the offence to start proceedings against you.

 

if outside of the 6 months they can’t now prosecute you for the speeding, so would have little incentive to quash the MS90 (s.127 failure to provide)

 

If within the 6 months you can try to;

a) get the court to accept a Stat Dec on the MS90

b) get the prosecutor to accept withdrawing the MS90 on proviso YOU plead guilty to the SP30 (speeding).

 

46 in a 30?

magistrates sentencing guidelines suggest a Band B fine, and either disqualify 7-28 days OR 3-6 points. You’d get a 1/3 reduction in fine for early guilty plea, but can add on any costs ordered and victim surcharge.

insurers don’t like MS90’s (probably disliking it even more than a SP30 if there was no disqualification with the SP30 ……)

 

Hopefully @ManInTheMiddle will look in (I’d defer to them).

[fighter]

The offence date was the 15th July 2021 and received the Further Steps notice last Thursday.

 

Yes 46 in a 30...I did think it was a 40 road and was at the start of a slip road - no excuse was speeding I know regardless. I have never had any other offences speeding or otherwise. I had read that it was a band B too but wasn't sure and this is why my husband is saying leave it as the MS90 rather than trying to appeal it. As you say they only have 6 months to prosecute for the speeding offence so will the chances of the MS90 being removed be unlikely as they will want a conviction of some sort?

[BazzaS]

Yes. They can’t now prosecute the speeding.

 

you’d be asking them to void the MS90 and not prosecute anyone. They might be inclined to do so if THEY had made an error, but are unlikely to decide you both should get off “Scot free” (and by not updating your address - a legal requirement) as it would suggest they would accept people “getting away with it” by this route

(Not that I’m suggesting you did so deliberately, just how it could be perceived if they “let you both off”)

[Man in the middle]

 

Quote

You need to do a statutory declaration.

 

Actually her husband needs to do an SD! 

 

Quote

 If we had received the NIP at the time what would the penalty have likely been for the speed I was doing or would it likely to have gone to court anyway?

 

No. You would have been offered a fixed penalty (£100 and three points) for that speed.

 

The normal prosecution process in these circumstances is to lay charges for both offences.

 

However, it is the RK who would be charged with both. If the RK was also the driver there is a time honoured way to do a “deal” with the prosecution, where the RK offers to plead guilty to speeding on the condition that the “Fail to Furnish” charge (which led to your husband’s MS90 endorsement) is dropped.

 

However, that is not a possibility in your case as your husband was not driving. The prosecution is very unlikely to do this deal on the basis that you plead guilty to speeding. There are procedural risks with that, not least of which is that a prosecution against you for speeding is now  “out of time”. In fact I have never heard of it being done even if the speeding charge was in time..That largely renders the speeding charge a dead duck.

 

Unfortunately your husband is in a very difficult situation. There is a case which reached the High Court (Whiteside vs DPP). Mr Whiteside did not receive his s172 notice to provide the driver’s details because he was out of the country and had made no arrangements to have his mail dealt with.

 

Without burdening you with the details, the High Court found that Mr Whiteside did not have a defence. The police properly “serve” a request by posting it to his last known address. The reason your husband he did not receive his was, of course, down to him.

 

If he performs a SD the conviction will be set aside but the prosecution will simply begin it again.

 

He could, at that stage, attempt to do the deal I outlined above, though, since a prosecution against you would have to be raised beyond the six month limit I rate the chances of success with that as near to zero.

 

He has no viable defence to the s172 offence and my view is that guilty plea would be his only realistic option. The offence attracts a fine of 1.5 week’s net income.

 

Where the court has no details of income they use a default figure of £440pw. The sum of £816 you mention is made up of £660 fine, £66 “Victim Surcharge” and £90 prosecution costs.

 

With a guilty plea your husband will be fined a week’s net income, so If his income is less than £660pw an SD will see him better off.

 

Sorry I have no better news, but this situation where the RK was not driving will inevitably lead to a s172 conviction.

Edited April 6, 2022 by dx100uk
Spacing

[fighter]

Thank you for your help everyone. I think then the best thing to do is just accept what has been dealt and pay the fine rather than an SD. As you say they will start the process again but we have no defence for not updating the V5 and then the subsequent S172 resulting from not knowing about it. He will have to attend court just to have really the same outcome albeit a slightly smaller fine but once he has lost a days work etc it would be futile. 

 

Lesson learnt that is for sure!