Can a solicitor act without a client/solicitor contract in place

[SuperVillain]

I am not saying that I have any authority to act on behalf of my granddad, however, that is irrelevant at this stage, because whilst I may not have the authority, for now, I have the right to protect him because of who he is to me, period.

 

But with the greatest of respect, no solicitor who wants to keep his practising certificate will provide you with any information about the claim or the contract without authority to do so from your granddad.

 

At the end of the day he's their Client, not you.

 

So your granddad needs to take that small step at least if he wants your help with this.

[Ganymede]

I am not saying that I have any authority to act on behalf of my granddad, however, that is irrelevant at this stage, because whilst I may not have the authority, for now, I have the right to protect him because of who he is to me, period.

 

And if I feel the solicitor is acting shifty, because some do, and to the most vulnerable he will have me to deal with, period.

 

As for putting pressure on my granddad, why would I do that, the only person who is remotely putting any pressure on him would appear to be his solicitor who to date and for the most obvious of reasons cannot even show a legitimate contract when that obligation and duty was put to him.....

 

I reckon the solicitor is pulling a fast one, like they do, and making legal representation as to profit without having the authority or should I say data in place which would allow him to be able to do that.

 

Solicitor's and like any over businesses are bound by the law of contract, why solicitors are so convinced that they are immune from following those same standards, is probably the reason they have chosen that proffesion in the first place and are convinced that they can act above the law, trust me, they CANNOT, period...

 

 

Your granddad instructed the solicitor (your words) and I would put my house (if I owned one) that there is a CFA in place.

 

Why hasn't your granddad give written authority to the solicitor yet then this could all be resolved.

[honeybee13]

I'm not sure what you want from this thread, spitfire, other than a rant about the legal profession.

 

As I see it, your grandfather either needs to give you written authority to act on his behalf with the solicitor or take action himself. Unless and until you have authority or have seen paperwork, I don't know what we can do to help.

 

HB

[SuperVillain]

As for putting pressure on my granddad, why would I do that

 

Look also, I don't know you or your granddad, and there is a 99% chance that you're not putting pressure on your granddad.

 

The problem the solicitors may face is, what if you're in that 1% - they don't know you. What if your granddad promised you a portion of the settlement - a very simple reason that you may put pressure on him to accept a higher settlement (I'm not saying you are by the way - this is just hypothetical).

 

To provide any advice on this we need to know more. Have the Council admitted liability, is this the first offer they've made, what are all the injuries being claimed for, what was your granddad's opening offer?

 

The settlement could well be reasonable, but again it may not. The solicitors could be being overly cautious, or they have seen something in the papers which causes them concern.

[steampowered]

And if I feel the solicitor is acting shifty, because some do, and to the most vulnerable he will have me to deal with, period.

I have complete sympathy with you and fully understand why you are concerned.

 

However, I doubt that the solicitor will deal with you unless he/she has written authority from your granddad to do so.

 

Solicitors are bound by strict obligations to keep information about their client's case confidential. Even to family members. If the solicitor shares information about your grandad's case with you without his permission, he/she risks being struck off!

 

I reckon the solicitor is pulling a fast one, like they do, and making legal representation as to profit without having the authority or should I say data in place which would allow him to be able to do that.

 

Solicitor's and like any over businesses are bound by the law of contract, why solicitors are so convinced that they are immune from following those same standards, is probably the reason they have chosen that proffesion in the first place and are convinced that they can act above the law, trust me, they CANNOT, period...

There is no law requiring businesses to have a written contract. Many contracts are entered into verbally or on the basis of conduct. You don't typically get a written contract when you buy a car or use a plumber.

 

Solicitors are a bit different in that there is a regulatory obligation to provide written terms (such as information about the right to complain to the Legal Ombudsman). Particularly if the arrangement is a CFA. So you are right to think there should be a contract (or at least written terms & conditions) - but the solicitor will still need your grandad's written authority to give you a copy!!!!

 

If the solicitor failed to provide any written terms, the sanction is to complain to the Legal Ombudsman so that the solicitor gets a slap on the wrist. The solicitor would still be entitled to be paid for their work.

[spitfire1964]

Thanks for all the advice, appreciated.

 

OK I have advised my granddad to e-mail a second request for the proof that the solicitor is in a legal position to be able to represent him, and once this has been established, the solicitor will be in a position of being able to negotiate a settlement.

 

My granddad approached me and it makes no odds to me other than protecting him what he gets or does not get in compensation.

 

Maybe my granddad feels he should be offered more and maybe the solicitor has indicated that he would get more, but like I said the amount offered is a lot less than what both he and the solicitor agreed as a rounabout figure, my guess is that because the amount is for less granddad is suspicious as to the solicitors motives, I don't know, but if he has any doubts and wants to remove them doubts all he is doing is asking the solicitor to provide the evidence that he can represent him which and in all honesty is not an unreasonable request, I don't know.

[Ganymede]

Your granddad must remember if he signed any paperwork? Did he not keep his copies?

 

An email probably won't suffice as it could be coming from anyone and a signed letter will probably be required.

[spitfire1964]

Your granddad must remember if he signed any paperwork? Did he not keep his copies?

 

An email probably won't suffice as it could be coming from anyone and a signed letter will probably be required.

 

He does not recall signing any paperwork, a rep from the firm explained what would happen if they took the case on at his home.

 

The rep told my granddad that he would pass all the details of the accident over to a solicitor at the firm and consider the merits of the claim.

About five days later my granddad got a call from the solicitors who were prepared to take his claim on, and that even if his lost the costs would be covered., that is all we know.

[BazzaS]

I am not saying that I have any authority to act on behalf of my granddad, however, that is irrelevant at this stage, because whilst I may not have the authority, for now, I have the right to protect him because of who he is to me, period.

 

How are you going to "protect" him if you don't have authority to act, and the solicitor HAS to decline to breach confidence until you have that authority?.

Doesn't sound "irrelevant" to me, it sounds key.

[BazzaS]

About five days later my granddad got a call from the solicitors who were prepared to take his claim on, and that even if his lost the costs would be covered., that is all we know.

 

Gosh, that sounds just like a CFA with ATE insurance .........

 

Unless you think the solicitors are offering to work for free and underwriting your grandfather's potential costs out of the goodness of their hearts?. Is there any reason to suspect this is pro bono?

[steampowered]

If your grandad is not happy with the settlement offer, can't he just instruct the solicitors to reject the offer? Or instruct his solicitors to make a counter-offer?

 

Negotiating settlement terms is a perfectly normal part of litigation!

 

Of course, the Defendant might refuse to make a better offer. The Defendant may prefer to take their chances in court. If it gets to court, your grandad will probably need to attend and give evidence.

[steampowered]

OK I have advised my granddad to e-mail a second request for the proof that the solicitor is in a legal position to be able to represent him, and once this has been established, the solicitor will be in a position of being able to negotiate a settlement.

 

You must remember that the Defendant is not going to wait while the Claimant and his legal team deal with the T&Cs. You may need to deal with the settlement offer before the T&Cs are received.

 

The Defendant is perfectly entitled to withdraw his settlement offer at any time. The Defendant does not have to wait for your grandad's solicitor to produce a set of T&Cs. If your grandad wants to make a counter-offer he should get on with it.

 

You must also remember that your grandad will still need to comply with any court orders and with the court's timetable. Having issues with your solicitor is not an acceptable excuse for failing to comply with the court process.

 

None of this is the Defendant's problem or the court's problem. It doesn't matter to the Defendant or to the court that you and your grandad are unhappy with your solicitor's paperwork. If legal proceedings have been issued, as far as the court and Defendant are concerned, the solicitor is on the court record as representing your grandad.

[BazzaS]

If your grandad is not happy with the settlement offer, can't he just instruct the solicitors to reject the offer? Or instruct his solicitors to make a counter-offer?

 

Instructing them to reject it, or instructing them to make a counter offer just confirms that the solicitors were instructed ..........

the OP seems to be suggesting they want to claim the solicitors weren't instructed, though.

[steampowered]

Instructing them to reject it, or instructing them to make a counter offer just confirms that the solicitors were instructed ..........

the OP seems to be suggesting they want to claim the solicitors weren't instructed, though.

 

As the solicitors have already been in contact with the Defendant (and potentially on the court record as acting? I wasn't clear whether legal proceedings have actually been issued) its a bit late to claim that they weren't instructed unfortunately.

[BazzaS]

As the solicitors have already been in contact with the Defendant (and potentially on the court record as acting? I wasn't clear whether legal proceedings have actually been issued) its a bit late to claim that they weren't instructed unfortunately.

 

I'm not disagreeing with it being "a bit late to claim they weren't instructed", and the OP actually stated

 

He instructed a solicitor to claim for damages caused due to injuries which included broken arm and was told by the solicitor that he would be covered under a no-fee, no win basis.

 

What I don't understand is the basis on which the OP thinks he is entitled to (absent a letter of authority)

 

the proof that the solicitor is in a legal position to be able to represent him

 

and why (even if the OP does get his grandfather's authority to deal with the solicitor on his behalf) the OP believes there isn't a CFA in place .....

 

You'll note that that grandfather isn't saying "I never signed anything" or "I never agreed anything", but rather "I don't remember", which is just what someone having to deal with an interfering family member is likely to say!

The grandfather also mentions a phone call where what sounds like a CFE with ATE insurance was discussed......

 

OP, if your grandfather really wants you to be involved : why hasn't he already given you a letter of authority?.

Did he really say to you, unprompted, "I want your help to sort this out", or do you feel you might be (even unconsciously) pressuring him to let you "help"?.

[spitfire1964]

Just got back from the solicitors firm and granddad asked to see the contract/agreement but the firm have denied this and to provide a copy of this data.

 

Quite obviously the firm and the solicitor are making false legal representation and negotiating without the required documents to be able to do this.

 

Contacted CAB, they have advised that this is a fraudulent act, cannot say that I am surprised.

[Ganymede]

Just got back from the solicitors firm and granddad asked to see the contract/agreement but the firm have denied this and to provide a copy of this data.

 

Quite obviously the firm and the solicitor are making false legal representation and negotiating without the required documents to be able to do this.

 

Contacted CAB, they have advised that this is a fraudulent act, cannot say that I am surprised.

 

Sounds like a lot of jumping to conclusions, CAB know just as little as we do.

 

Did you attend the solicitors with your grandfather or on your own?

 

If you were with your grandfather, what reason was given for not providing a copy of the paperwork?

[AndyOrch]

" Just got back from the solicitors firm and granddad asked to see the contract/agreement but the firm have denied this and to provide a copy of this data."

 

So why did they deny it and not just give you a copy there and then ?

[spitfire1964]

" Just got back from the solicitors firm and granddad asked to see the contract/agreement but the firm have denied this and to provide a copy of this data."

 

So why did they deny it and not just give you a copy there and then ?

 

The receptionist told my granddad that they did not have to provide him with copies nor show originals from which we assumed could have been copied there and then.

 

Understandably my granddad is a bit confused now and I just hope this is the only problem they have caused him because it would appear that they are hiding something here, it all points that way, anyway.

 

Going to ring his insurance company up for some legal advice after being advised to do this by CAB, going through the policy details now to see if he can get some legal advice, free.

[AndyOrch]

So you only saw the receptionist not the Solicitor ?

[Ganymede]

The receptionist told my granddad that they did not have to provide him with copies nor show originals from which we assumed could have been copied there and then.

 

Understandably my granddad is a bit confused now and I just hope this is the only problem they have caused him because it would appear that they are hiding something here, it all points that way, anyway.

 

Going to ring his insurance company up for some legal advice after being advised to do this by CAB, going through the policy details now to see if he can get some legal advice, free.

 

 

Why did you ask the receptionist and not your grandfather's solicitor/fee earner?!!

 

No disrespect to the receptionist, but they're hardly qualified or authorised to be telling you that.

[BazzaS]

The receptionist told my granddad that they did not have to provide him with copies nor show originals from which we assumed could have been copied there and then.

 

Understandably my granddad is a bit confused now and I just hope this is the only problem they have caused him because it would appear that they are hiding something here, it all points that way, anyway.

 

Going to ring his insurance company up for some legal advice after being advised to do this by CAB, going through the policy details now to see if he can get some legal advice, free.

 

I agree that speaking with the receptionist only wasn't the brightest of moves. Why did your grandfather not seek an appointment with the solicitor?.

 

It'd be usual to ask a prospective claimant if they had BTE insurance before entering into a CFA / ATE insurance agreement, as if your grandfather had BTE legal cover through household insurance there is a potential funding conflict.

 

I have an odd sense of deja vu..........

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?462017-Solicitor-negligence-claim/page12

You instructed them and I assume that you also signed some kind of retainer/agreement to allow them to represent you.

 

I instructed them, but again, that irrelevant.

 

(a) the solicitor would need funding to be in a position in any event as to take instruction, there was no funding (b) the solicitor had a professional obligation to inform me, the client, when the funding in order for him to be able to represent a client, had been exhausted.

 

 

Why deja vu?.

Same focus on "the ' missing' funding paperwork" when there is no doubt the solicitor WAS instructed.

 

when taken with

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?479679-Pip-tribunal-hearing-advice&p=5062233#post5062233

Same convoluted 'legal logic'.

Same focus on 'rights' that they can't define, that they over-estimate what their 'right' actually is, and that they can't come up with a realistic method by which the supposed 'right' is going to be enforced.

 

So, what 'right' do you have to be party to your grandfather's confidential relationship with their solicitor, unless and until your grandfather gives you authority?.

 

I can only hope that this doesn't turn out like Callum's thread ..... over 1000 posts over 10 months, finally getting closed due to the OP not providing the documentation requested, but just arguing the toss for the sake of it.

 

Spitfire, how goes your application for judicial review from that other thread of yours ..... care to post that up so we can see you are being serious?.

(Callum's failure to show he wasn't just on a wind-up was his downfall in the end) .....

 

Odd sense of deja vu .........

[spitfire1964]

I agree that speaking with the receptionist only wasn't the brightest of moves. Why did your grandfather not seek an appointment with the solicitor?.

 

It'd be usual to ask a prospective claimant if they had BTE insurance before entering into a CFA / ATE insurance agreement, as if your grandfather had BTE legal cover through household insurance there is a potential funding conflict.

 

I have an odd sense of deja vu..........

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?462017-Solicitor-negligence-claim/page12

 

 

 

 

 

Why deja vu?.

Same focus on "the ' missing' funding paperwork" when there is no doubt the solicitor WAS instructed.

 

when taken with

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?479679-Pip-tribunal-hearing-advice&p=5062233#post5062233

Same convoluted 'legal logic'.

Same focus on 'rights' that they can't define, that they over-estimate what their 'right' actually is, and that they can't come up with a realistic method by which the supposed 'right' is going to be enforced.

 

So, what 'right' do you have to be party to your grandfather's confidential relationship with their solicitor, unless and until your grandfather gives you authority?.

 

I can only hope that this doesn't turn out like Callum's thread ..... over 1000 posts over 10 months, finally getting closed due to the OP not providing the documentation requested, but just arguing the toss for the sake of it.

 

Spitfire, how goes your application for judicial review from that other thread of yours ..... care to post that up so we can see you are being serious?.

(Callum's failure to show he wasn't just on a wind-up was his downfall in the end) .....

 

Odd sense of deja vu .........

 

You one oddball mate, get some help, and I mean that in the nicest way, you spend to much time on here, there is a big world out there.

 

To remove any doubt JR up and running, Tribunal now jumping through hoops to conclude this now.

[spitfire1964]

I get it, we just walk straight past the receptionist go charging through the building knocking down every door until we meet the solicitor, will have to try that next time, seriously.

[honeybee13]

You could try making an appointment.

 

HB