HERMES say they damaged my parcel so threw it away??!!

[blix]

I bought something from ebay at a very good price; one not easily repeated.

The seller shipped it to me via Hermes.

The tracking showed it as being with my local courier & out for delivery last thursday.

It never arrived.

I checked the tracking and everything was the same except the date had changed to friday. Still nothing (I was in all day)

This happened for saturday & then monday; the date for delivery kept changing but still no actual delivery.

Sometime on monday (yesterday) the tracking stopped working with a message that the tracking had been cancelled.

I contacted Hermes via their online 'chat' and was told that they had damaged my delivery & had thrown it away but had given the sender a refund.

I'm sure I'm not the only one who thinks this is outrageous.

It's bad enough, as a company offering the shipping of goods, that they are so negligent as to allegedly ruin shipments but to then allegedly discard the item too is so far outside their duty it's beyond belief.

I say 'allegedly' above because for all I know someone has taken a shine to my item and simply reported it as 'damaged & discarded'.

Where do I stand being the recipient. I didn't pay for the shipping or choose Hermes but I want what was sent to me so I can decide whether it's of any use or not.

Any help or advice gratefully received

[BankFodder]

Yes, it is outrageous – but I have to say I can see the funny side as well!

 

Anyway, even though you are a third party to the contract you are covered under the http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1999/31/contents

 

I think that you are entitled to claim the reasonable replacement value of the item that you bought. I think that you can do this by claiming directly from Hermes and the if necessary you can bring a small claim against them.

 

Hermes of course will say that you have no rights under the contract because you are not the sender – but they are wrong because of the third-party rights rules.

 

Did you keep a log of the chat that you had with them? I hope so because this will be extremely useful for you.

 

Also, I suggest that you read our customer services guide, implement the advice there and phone them and talk to them about it and what happened. You need to gather as much evidence as possible and the best thing to do is to get them to make admissions either on chat or on telephone – or both and the store it all up.

 

I would find several sources of information as to the reasonable replacement value of the item which was allegedly damaged and then write Hermes a detailed letter explaining exactly what has happened, why you are holding them liable and the value that you want frit and given the examples that you have gathered together.

 

Require them to pay you within 14 days and if they don't then tell them that you will bring a County Court action against them for the value + interest.

 

Don't make the threat if you're not serious about it. Don't bluff. If you do decide to do this then make sure that you have read around on this forum about how to bring a small claims action in the County Court and that you are prepared.

 

In the 14 days at you are waiting, you should open up a free account with MoneyClaim and prepare your claim. It won't be very difficult. You don't need any special form of words. I rate your chances of success as better than 90%.

 

In your claim, you will have to include the fact that you are suing as third party under the Act

 

In fact I would also add a claim at the same time for conversion under the Torts (Interference with Goods) Act http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1977/32

[neil6534]

hi, the sender would have automatically been covered with an insurance value for upto £50 unless they stated it was worth more and would therefor have the option to pay a little bit extra to hermes to cover the additional value.....so first thing first you need to talk to the seller and ask them for a refund, if they refuse then open a case up on ebay and you should get your refund.....then the seller will need to claim the insurance value back from hermes......simples

[BazzaS]

hi, the sender would have automatically been covered with an insurance value for upto £50 unless they stated it was worth more and would therefor have the option to pay a little bit extra to hermes to cover the additional value.....so first thing first you need to talk to the seller and ask them for a refund, if they refuse then open a case up on ebay and you should get your refund.....then the seller will need to claim the insurance value back from hermes......simples

 

Simple, depending on what the OP wants.

What you are suggesting works well if the OP wants a refund.

 

Not good if the OP wants an item identical to the auction item if they can't find it at that price again, which they may well want (so as to be put in the same position, or as near to it as possible : "as if the contract had been correctly completed" - the default position for contractual damages in UK law.

[neil6534]

that is very true and a point i failed to pick up on

[blix]

Thanks very much for the responses. I'm very grateful.

My main issue is that the item was obviously never theirs. They were paid to safely, professionally & competently deliver the item from A to B; a service they claim they are in business to do. (although my personal experience with Hermes is that that fail to do any of this more often than not)

 

The fact that they took it upon themselves to discard my item because they broke it was never theirs to make.

 

I have been through SCC before for something else so understand to some degree how it works.

I'm more than prepared to do it and your advice in particualr, BankFodder, is what I was looking for.

 

Thanks again for all of your input. I'll keep you posted.

[BankFodder]

When did the sale take place?

[blix]

Hi again. It was ebay on 25th oct 2015

[BankFodder]

This should do you – although it may be longer then the character minimum of MoneyClaim

 

 

 

 

1. This claim is for breach of contract or alternatively for conversion
   
2. The claimant bought an XXXitemxxx through an auction on eBay.
   
3. The defendant contracted with the eBay seller to deliver the item to the claimant
   
4. In breach of the contract the defendant damage the item and then disposed of it without reference or notification to the claimant or to the seller.
   
5. The claimant seeks the replacement value of the item which the defendant has damaged and disposed of
   
6. In the matter of contract, the claimant asserts his right under the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999
   
7. In the matter of conversion, the claimant became the owner of the item at the conclusion of the auction on XXX date pursuant to section 18 of the Sale of Goods Act 1979
   
8. The claimant claims £xxx plus interest per section 69 County Courts Act 1984
   

 

In paragraph 6 you assert your right to bring an action in order to pre-empt Hermes argument that you are not a party to the contract.

 

In paragraph 7 you make the point about the passing of title in order to pre-empt Hermes argument that you did not own the item.

 

Doing this now will save you having to arse around later on and will save you a bit of time and complication

[blix]

Thanks very much for that. I really appreciate you taking the time : )

[obiter dictum]

Before i end up getting sanctioned again, and my own piece of mind

 

Would the Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancelation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013 not take precedent over the Contracts (Rights and Third Parties) Act 1999 as this comes under Distant Selling Regulations?

 

The Consumer Protection (Distance Selling) Regulations 2000

 

Now the Consumer Rights Act 2015

Edited November 3, 2015 by obiter dictum

[blix]

I think the Distance selling would only really cover me with regard to the seller, not the courier. Might be wrong though ... it has been known : )

[ericsbrother]

the seller should refund and claim back what they can from their carrier. Your contract is with the seller and they chose the shipping method so you have no real interest unless you specified who the carrier was and paid for that service directly (you didnt).

Your only possible claim is for loss of opportunity or loss of bargain but if you are refunded the full amount and it was an auction the value has been decided already, regardless of the bargain it may have been at the time. It is bit like claiming on your insurance and then telling the insurance so it is worth more than you paid for it or insured it for. You know what they will say to that.

[Surfer01]

If the seller charges you for delivery and the delivery fails, is it your responsibility to chase the courier or should it be the seller?

[silverfox1961]

You chase the seller UNLESS you arranged a courier. You are not the couriers customer, the seller is.

 

Any claim is with the seller and it is up to them to refund then chase the courier for the refund

[CrappoMan]

...It is bit like claiming on your insurance and then telling the insurance so it is worth more than you paid for it or insured it for...

 

Whilst I agree with most of what you said, your insurance analogy is a bit off: If I buy a bargain for £50, but its real worth is £100, I am entitled to insure it for £100. Because that is the cost of replacing it. The seller should have insured the item for its real value, not its auction cost.

[obiter dictum]

You chase the seller UNLESS you arranged a courier. You are not the couriers customer, the seller is.

 

Any claim is with the seller and it is up to them to refund then chase the courier for the refund

 

Hallelaua

 

Common sense at last