**car giant/blackhorse ppi claim**

[OldSoul]

Hi guys

 

I'm helping my partner with her PPI claim against car giant. Before she went any further I advised her to write up her story and told her I'd post it up here for some help. Apologies for the long post. This is her story;

 

 

 

Timeline of events:

2nd January 2009

 

-Test drove car and showed interest. Staff member No.1 assisted with this

 

- I liked car so was transferred to another staff member (staff member no.2) who ran through finance options/payments with me. Staff member no.2 began credit check process.

 

-After few minutes I he told me that they could not complete the process as after carrying out check there was an inclusive answer. Therefore I was advised that they would need to carry out a more extensive check and this could take up to 24 hours.

 

-Staff member no.2 took me through a "sales order" document and sold me additional product which were "Mechanical breakdown insurance" and "asset protection policy" which I agreed to buy and signed for.

 

- He then told me that he would be on holiday the next day, but I was advised I’d get a call with an answer, and if it was approved I would be seen by his colleague; Staff member no.3 he noted the extension no. on the sales order document

 

-At this stage all I signed was the Sales order on 2nd January 2009 (see attached), as I did not get immediate approval after the system credit check.

 

-Paid deposit of £200 and left with only a copy of the "sales order".

 

 

3rd January 2009

– I received phone call from a member of staff at Car Giant 3rd January 2009 am to say credit had been approved for car and that I could come and collect car and finish paperwork at 2pm.

 

-I Met with staff member no.3 to complete the process. He verbally ran me through my payment schedule whilst I took notes; i.e. 1st Payment 166.8, 46 payments of £162.86, last ‘balloon payment of £312.86.

 

-He then said that he could offer "protection on your payments"

 

-I was a bit thrown off as I thought I had purchased all adequate products to protect myself and I was again being made to feel that I needed this other product.

 

-I felt rushed into making a decision of taking this policy out and made to feel like no wasn't an option. Scare mongered as particularly recall the staff proclaiming that if I became ill or accident/death the debt would fall onto my family. I was told that this was best thing to do, and felt if I did not do this I would be making an extremely irresponsible decision whilst taking out a finance agreement and that my application was not complete.

 

-I wasn't told that there was any sort of cooling off period and was not advised of any other comparative options for insurance, and was not asked about my employment status. I basically felt I had a couple of minutes to decide if I wanted it.

 

-I did not have much time to think about the policy as first time it was presented to me was 3rd January 2009, Car Giant note in their final response letter (June 2013) that the ‘PPI was presented at 18.30 hrs on 2nd January 2009’ and that I did not agree to take the policy until 15.00 hrs the following day. However, PPI was only mentioned to me on 3rd January 2013 right at the end.

 

-I was bombarded with a lot of figures within a short frame of time with staff member no.3 and was completely overwhelmed with this information and unable to make an informed decision.

 

- I made a £800 payment as part of £1,000 total deposit made in line with Finance schedule agreement.

 

-Documents given to me on the day

- Invoice 3rd January 2009

- Customer Pack which included :Pre contract information, agreement form, terms and conditions form and direct debit form (None of these were dated OR signed by me or any other party)

 

-Got the keys for car and went on my way.

 

-Following this, I received a welcome letter form black horse with an unsigned hire purchase agreement that is dated 4th Jan.

 

17th January 2009 I received a letter from Cardif Pinnacle which I assumed was referring to the PPI policy " Confirmation of your Direct Debit Instruction" (PPI)

 

I did not receive a copy of the policy schedule.

 

4th April 2013

Now, five years on having finished my agreement ( on 4th January 2013) and having viewed advise on FOS re: misspelling of PPI I believe that I fall into this category for the following reasons;

 The salesperson selling the insurance was pushy and strongly advised me to take the insurance without fully explaining the policy.

 The policy exclusions were not explained to me either before or at the time I took out the insurance.

 Additionally, I was not asked whether I already had any existing insurance or employer benefits that would cover my repayments. I was therefore unable to make an informed decision as to whether this insurance was appropriate to me.

 I was not given sufficient information following the set-up of the policy. I can confirm that I received a quote for the car finance agreement, however did not receive a total cost for PPI/ or breakdown of Policy details.

⁃ 4/4/13 - I included the above details in a letter to Cardif Pinnacle on 4th April 2013. I also enclosed a ‘Payment protection insurance; consumer questionnaire’.

⁃ 9/4/13 - Cardif Pinnacle responded by letter on 9th April 2013 explaining that whilst they underwrite my cover that did not arrange the sale, and therefore my complaint has been forwarded to Car Giant.

⁃ 10/4/13 - Car Giant acknowledge receipt and the investigation of complaint by letter on 10th April 2013. They detailed that they would carry out full investigation and work within an 8 week timescale. Also requested that I complete a ‘Letter of Authority’ giving my permission for Car Giant to contact the insurer and finance company for full details of agreement.

⁃ 17/4/13 – I sent via post the completed letter of authority form with handwritten covering letter.

⁃ 4/6/13 – received telephone call from Car Giant rep. I politely explained that I did not wish to discuss over the phone and would prefer all correspondence to be made via email.

⁃ 4/6/13 – Same day the representative sent me an email requesting me to suggest a suitable time for her to call me as they would really like to discuss matters on phone.

⁃ 4/6/13 – I sent a response email reiterating that I would like all communication to be made via email.

⁃ 6/6/13 – received email back detailing that there are a few issues that they needed to review. She also attached a copy of a signed Policy Schedule and Direct Debit Mandate, asking me to verify my signature. Also that theCompliance manager would be in touch.

⁃ 7/6/13 – I responded to email as follows; > Thank you for your email.
With regards to the attached document ‘Policy Schedule and Direct Debit Mandate’; although I can't recall signing this document, this signature seems to be mine.I can confirm that my Finance agreement on the purchase of my car came to an end on 4th January 2013.

⁃ 8/6/13 – Received voice telephone message from the compliance manager – mentioned that he would like to discuss matters further and perhaps sort out refunding some money to me and would like a call back that day or following Monday when back in office.

⁃ 10/6/13 – emailed to ask for 3rd time for communications to be made via email or post only.

⁃ Around 11/6/13 (date not included on Car Giants correspondence) – received ‘Final letter from Car Giant.’ Detailing their stance on complaint and that unable to upheld as they felt they had followed all procedures, and felt my complaint was generic due to recent publicity PPI had gained in media. Although enclosed £250 ‘Good will gesture’valid until 19th July 2013.

Dates proposed by Car Giant;

If unable to agree resolution, Car Giant suggested contacted FOS to review complaint. If chose to do this I have 6 months from receiving final response ( nb: no date on letter, but was roughly 11th June 2013.

 

 

So I had a quick look and thought someone here could possibly help. I have 2 main concerns

 

1.How do we word a response? My partner is definitely refusing this offer but we need to address their points, can anyone see any inconsistencies with their response and are there any other point we could use? The main thing is my partner was only told about the ppi last minute and felt she only had a few minutes to decide and that it would affect her taking the car away that day.

 

2.In addition she wasn't shown and did not leave that day with a schedule of the payments for the PPI. The 1st letter from pinnacle was nearly a month after the date of taking out the agreement.

 

3.On asking my partner a few questions she realised she never ever signed any HP agreement presented to her. So this I think may open a can of worms. If this is indeed true (which we will find out from SAR and CCA request) what position will she be in?

 

 

*I've consolidated the files into a single pdf

 

http://cl.ly/39303X2o1s1J

Edited June 14, 2013 by OldSoul
docs consolidated into PDF

[dx100uk]

so its a blackhorse loan then

 

can you please PDF the docs

 

its a lot easier to zoom etc

 

set your default scan page size to A4 less than 300DPI [150 will do]

scan the required letters/agreements/sheets - as a picture[jpg] file

don't forget you can use a mobile phone or a digital camera too!!

'

BUT......

ENSURE: remove all pers info inc. barcodes etc using paint program

but leave all monetary figures and dates.

*********************************************************

{DO NOT USE A BIRO OR PEN OR USE SEE THRU TAPE OR LABELS]

try www.pdfescape.com TO BLANK STUFF,

*************************************************************

or

DO IT IN MSPAINT.EXE or any photo editing program

goto one of the many free online pdf converter websites ...

http://freejpgtopdf.com/

..

if you have multiple scans/pics

put them in a word doc FIRST and convert that to PDF

or use www.pdfmerge.com

 

convert existing PC files to PDF [office has an installable print to PDF option]

..

 

it would be better to upload a multipage pdf if

you have many images too rather than many single pdfs

.

or if you have PDF as an installed printer drive use that

or use word and save as pdf

try and logically name your file so people know what it is.

though dont use full bank names or CAG in the title

i'e Default notice dd-mm-yyyy TSB

.

open a new msg box here

hit go advanced below the msg box

hit manage attachments below that box

hit the add files button on the top right

hit select files, navigate to your file on your pc

hit upload files

.

dx

[dx100uk]

so car giant have sort of fobbed you off with speculation their processes were correct

 

and sent £250.

 

i bet you are owned a whole lot more

 

you do realise the "Mechanical breakdown insurance" and "asset protection policy"

 

can also be lumped into a PPI reclaim.?

 

each of those reps got the commission on one each of those 'useless' products...

 

prob +£300 each.

 

nice guys!

 

dx

[OldSoul]

Hi dx

 

Thanks, your always a big help as usual. Yea, I think she's paid over £1000 in PPI payments, I just can't seem to work out from these documents if PPI and "Mechanical breakdown insurance" and "asset protection policy" were added to the CA. They were detailed in a separate invoice so I'm not sure if we can reclaim on this as well?

[dx100uk]

yes you can

 

wanna scaN UP THE BITS?

 

DX

[OldSoul]

yes you can

 

wanna scaN UP THE BITS?

 

DX

 

Here it is

[dx100uk]

i've put it up as a PDF using this method:

 

set your default scan page size to A4 less than 300DPI [150 will do]

scan the required letters/agreements/sheets - as a picture[jpg] file

don't forget you can use a mobile phone or a digital camera too!!

'

BUT......

ENSURE: remove all pers info inc. barcodes etc using paint program

but leave all monetary figures and dates.

*********************************************************

{DO NOT USE A BIRO OR PEN OR USE SEE THRU TAPE OR LABELS]

try www.pdfescape.com TO BLANK STUFF,

*************************************************************

or

DO IT IN MSPAINT.EXE or any photo editing program

goto one of the many free online pdf converter websites ...

http://freejpgtopdf.com/

..

if you have multiple scans/pics

put them in a word doc FIRST and convert that to PDF

or use www.pdfmerge.com

 

convert existing PC files to PDF [office has an installable print to PDF option]

..

 

it would be better to upload a multipage pdf if

you have many images too rather than many single pdfs

.

or if you have PDF as an installed printer drive use that

or use word and save as pdf

try and logically name your file so people know what it is.

though dont use full bank names or CAG in the title

i'e Default notice dd-mm-yyyy TSB

.

open a new msg box here

hit go advanced below the msg box

hit manage attachments below that box

hit the add files button on the top right

hit select files, navigate to your file on your pc

hit upload files

.

dx

[dx100uk]

here a spreadsheet

fill in 16.80 on every date you made the full payment till the end

[OldSoul]

Thanks Dx

 

We've filled out the excel sheet.

 

She made a first payment of £45.36 on the 1st Feb 09 and then £22.68 from 1st March 09 and every 1st of each month there after through to Dec 1st 2012.

 

Is this suggesting that 8% of the £22.68 was made up of interest? Noot too sure how this calculation works?

 

[ATTACH]44525[/ATTACH]

[dx100uk]

monthly for the car should have been £162.86

 

for each month that was paid

enter 16.80 in the spread.

 

have you got the statements?

 

dx

[OldSoul]

Oh sorry, I'm such a newbie

 

Is this the statement?

 

should we be referencing from this when filling out the excel sheet?

 

 

She has the previous years, just need to dig them ou

 

t[ATTACH=CONFIG]44530[/ATTACH]

[dx100uk]

yep every month you made the 162, put 16.80 in the spready

 

dx

[weird_prit]

Hi OldSoul,

 

Hope you're well - hows this progressing thus far?

 

Do you have a copy of the initial letter sent to Car Giant?

 

Cheers,

P

[OldSoul]

Hi P

 

Will upload the original letter she sent.

 

She's been trying to dig out the statements but it seems there are some missing,

 

just trying to get them before filling out DX's excel sheet.

 

Whilst she was looking for everything she found a Deeds and Demands that she seems to have signed

so that has thrown us off a bit as she's adamant she wasn't taken through the document.

 

I think what we're gonna do is SAR black horse & Car Giant

and CCA Car Giant before we formulate a reply to their response?

[dx100uk]

you should only need to sar bh that's all

 

dx

[OldSoul]

who would we need to SAR to see if a signed Credit Agreement exists? BH or CG?

[dx100uk]

why do you need the signed agreement?

 

 

dx

[OldSoul]

If she didn't sign an agreement and was sold PPI based on that agreement, wouldn't that help our case?

[dx100uk]

you should get the agreement in the SAr if you are lucky

put a line in the sar specifically asking for any/all agreements.

 

dx

[OldSoul]

great, thanks.

 

O

[OldSoul]

Hi OldSoul,

 

Hope you're well - hows this progressing thus far?

 

Do you have a copy of the initial letter sent to Car Giant?

 

Cheers,

P

Here it is

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]44559[/ATTACH]

 

So based on what she originally sent and their response I think we're going to try and completely revise the complaint. I just fear that she was taken advantage of and sold all these extra products she didn't want or need and I think this should be the basis of the complaint. My difficulty is getting her to remember the details of what happened, she hasn't got the best memory bless her.