Stress at work - Advice needed

[ErIndoorz]

Hi, I could really do with some advice please.

 

We had a new manager start at the place I've worked for the last 11 years. She was employed as 1 thing and was asked to 'act up' as manager as the previous manager left abruptly.

Anyway, after 3 months I had to raise a grievance as she clearly had no management skills, was relying on me for EVERYTHING, completely mucking up anything that had been put in place and causing me loads of stress.

This grievance was 'partly upheld' by her line managers and an intensive induction was arranged for her.

This was supposed to be for 4 weeks and was reduced down to 3 weeks (not sure why)

 

I have been trying to help this woman do her job and my own was suffering because of it and it all got too much. I saw my GP who says I am stressed due to work and advised me to reduce my hours.

He signed a sick cert stating 'due to stress at work she should temporarily reduce her hours' - to which they agreed.

I have since had to raise a 2nd grievance and have just had a response back today from that hearing stating that it was 'partly upheld' again.

The manager has now stepped down to the original position she was employed for and the letter responding to my grievance states they agreed that her skills are currently more suited to the original position she was employed as.

 

My question is:

Can I claim for the loss of earnings I have had to endure because of this situation???

[Emmzzi]

you would need to prove the stress was pretty much 100% work related.

 

In your grievance, did you say you wanted to be reimbursed? Have you asked your manager about it at all?

[ErIndoorz]

I didn't say I wanted reimbursement as I didn't know I could.

 

It is only now after a big staff meeting yesterday and the response to my grievance I got through the post today where they say they have realised her capabilities that I wondered if I could ask.

I have proof by ways of my emails and letters expressing my concerns. I have also got emails stating I am unable to complete my own work due to having to keep checking hers.

 

That in itself would be 100% proof would it not?

[becky2585]

You would have to go down the personal injury route, if you can show you've been diagnosed with a recognised psychiatric condition. It doesn't seem like a strong claim, from what you've said, though.

 

What could your employer have done differently to make things better?

[Skinnered]

Congratulations on sticking to your guns and managing to get your employers to see that not only you but the company was suffering as a result of their original decision.

 

They have already conceded that this person was a liability in the position they promoted her into.

 

It should not be too difficult to deduce that if your own health and performance before she arrived was OK, that it deteriorated while she was there, and that it improved again after she left, there is a link, and if the company was responsible for that person being where she was then they are responsible for bringing on your condition, especially as you have been telling them from the start.

 

At the risk of sounding Bolshie I'd go ahead an put a claim in for loss of earnings during your absence. Not only that but I would insist on more money for doing her job while she should have been doing it.

[Atlas01]

One of the key points of a stress claim id the employer failing to act on your concerns, they did, look at it this way, the problem has now gone thanks to your endevours, for the majority of people who come here that never happens

 

I'd put it behind me and show a good effort to the employer, that way they are more inclined to promote you instead of getting hacked off at more grievances

[altobelli]

I would agree with Atlas on this occasion.

 

To make a successful claim for stress you need to demonstrate the following:

 

i) A Duty of Care exists to you from the employer - this would certainly be the case here.

 

ii) That you suffered a stress related injury due to your employer's actions - this would have to be a recognised psychological injury, e.g. depression, PTSD. You would probably need a specialist medical report to back this up. Without suffering this type of injury, it is unlikely damages would be awarded, and if they were, they would likely be very small.

 

iii) That your employer could reasonably foresee that you would be caused stress and took no action. In this case, I think your employer acted properly. They partially upheld your first grievance and training was provided for the manager. They took the doctor's advice and reduced your hours temporarily. They partially upheld your second grievance and moved the manager back to her formal role.

 

So I would advise letting thing rest. We see a lot of posts on this forum where grievances against management are not investigated properly, or where the person raising the grievance is retaliated against. In your case, I think the employer has performed very well.

[Skinnered]

What ErIndoorz is asking is whether or not it would do any good to ask for reimbursement for losses resulting from what she has had to endure through no fault of her own, losses she can probably ill afford and probably take some time to recoup.

 

There is no reason that I can see why she should not. What’s the worst that could happen? They could say NO.

 

They could hardly be so stupid as to dismiss her just for making a request.

To suppose that she would be thought better of by saying nothing by managers stupid enough to put an ignoramus in charge is fantastical.They could probably not care less. Their decision to act on previous grievances was more than likely their only option since doing nothing could have compromised their own positions.

 

Going into a paroxysm of medical jargon is unnecessary at this stage; she is making a request, not building a case for a tribunal.

 

 

 

[steampowered]

To claim you would need to show your employer had been negligent. It sounds like would be difficult because your employer did take steps to deal with the problem.

Edited March 17, 2013 by steampowered

[altobelli]

What ErIndoorz is asking is whether or not it would do any good to ask for reimbursement for losses resulting from what she has had to endure through no fault of her own, losses she can probably ill afford and probably take some time to recoup.

 

There is no reason that I can see why she should not. What’s the worst that could happen? They could say NO.

 

 

They could hardly be so stupid as to dismiss her just for making a request.

To suppose that she would be thought better of by saying nothing by managers stupid enough to put an ignoramus in charge is fantastical.They could probably not care less. Their decision to act on previous grievances was more than likely their only option since doing nothing could have compromised their own positions.

 

Going into a paroxysm of medical jargon is unnecessary at this stage; she is making a request, not building a case for a tribunal.

 

 

 

 

Sure, but quite aside from the legal side, I think this employer has acted reasonably and fairly. It is not the employee's fault that they have suffered from stress, but I don't think it is the employers either. From their point of view, they appointed a manager who may or may not have succeeded in the role. It didn't work out, but the employer listened to the grievances raised by the OP and also the doctor's advice. In my view they attempted to reduce stress as much as possible. I don't think in the particular circumstances here the OP should request re-imbursement, it might damage relations with the employer who has in my opinion acted fairly.

[assisted blonde]

Got to say asking for reinbursment would in my opinion be a daft thing to do, the op has lost the money, didnt know they could even consider getting it backl, and the problem has now been dealt with in a proper manner. To start on a course of action that will involve a lot of time effort and stress can only be detrimental to the ops health and her relationship with her employer. If the op feels that strongly about it a quite word saying that it has been hard managing on a reduced income etc etc and see if the employer offers any would be ok but I really wouldnt push it as the situation has now been resolved.

[Callaghanclown]

While I agree the employer would be stupid for dismissing the employee for asking for reimbursement, many of us on here have been dismissed for asking far less onerous questions.

 

Personally I'd either ask the question informally to judge their reaction or leave it all together and concentrate on getting your self fully well.

 

Not fair but probably sensible.

[ErIndoorz]

Thank you for all your responses.

I have requested my loss of earnings, they can only say No can't they and considering I have been there for 11 years and stressed that I have NEVER had to reduce my hours due to stress before, I think it's the least they can do.

 

They've been paying an employee full pay, part of a 'welfare fund' whilst she has been off sick for over a year! Asking for a couple of weeks pay is nothing in the grand scheme of things.

 

I sent the letter by email on Monday and I've asked to have a reply by tomorrow so will let you know the outcome, if any!

Thanks again

[ErIndoorz]

Well I haven't had a reply to my question but line manager I addressed the letter to is coming to our place of work on Monday so I'm hoping she will tell me then.

It'll probably be 'sod off' but I think it was worth asking anyway.

 

The other thing I now have to deal with is that this person they had as manager who has now stepped down is still trying to 'act' as manager as (especially today) we had no one in charge. The person she is supposed to be learning from was off today.

She told me today that she has been told by the line manager not to sit in the managers office nor to use the computer yet that is exactly what she was doing today. Now what do I do? Do I let her line manager know when she comes on Monday?

I'm in yet another awful situation!!

[Emmzzi]

I'd let that sleeping dog lie; you don't want to appear vindictive.

[altobelli]

Yes, I agree with the last post, unless it happens to come up in a conversation or unless it directly affects you then I would leave it.

[assisted blonde]

Leave it alone if thats what she did it willcome out eventually, really dosnt need you to tell any tales, just get onwith your own job for now.

[ErIndoorz]

Got told today that the answer is 'no' - they wont pay me for full time hours.

Their reason being is that my rate of pay is higher than anyone else doing the same job throughout the organisation (as it was when we were taken over) therefore they say that my rate reflects on what they expect of me.

No I don't know whether to seek legal advice or not...

[altobelli]

I would advise against pursuing this. It is difficult to see a legal case - you would need to prove that your employer acted unreasonably, i.e. that they could have foreseen that the manager wouldn't be able to do the job, that this might cause you stress, and that it did cause you a recognised stress-related illness. I think in all honesty that your employer behaved reasonably, they acted on each of your grievances to try and resolve the situation.

 

It would be best to let this go - you obviously have a good reputation in that the employer acted upon the grievances and you would jeopardise this with legal action, which would in my view have little prospect of success.

[assisted blonde]

No wouldnt take this any further you have the result you wanted in that the manager is no more, so I think its best just to let it all die down now and the company have given you a prompt answer with a reason I think in this instance you appear to be working for a resonable company who try and do things right.

[ErIndoorz]

That is the decision I came to although to the dismay of my husband who wants me to get a union involved.

Thank u all for ur help.

[Emmzzi]

easy for him to say when he isn't living with it....

 

If you are happy it is the right choice for you, stick with it

[ErIndoorz]

Well... it's been a long time and since that manager left we were given another manager from another part of the scheme on a temporary basis.

Because of the grievances I had brought against the previous manager, this one took an instant dislike to me.

 

She kept me in a supervision for 2 hours, blaming me for all that had gone wrong in our company.

She stated that staff morale was low and that was because of me and the errors that have been made with payroll even though I explained the payroll bureau we use is always using wrong hourly rates.

She stripped me of my email address I was issued by Head Office when we were taken over stating that no administrators have their own email address and who did I think I was? when in fact her own administrator from the home she is a permanent manager has his own email address as do others within the scheme.

On return from sick leave after a miscarriage I came back to find my name had been removed from my signature on the work email and replaced with the woman who has been standing in for a couple of hours a week.

She contacted me everyday for the 1st 3 days of annual leave to ask silly questions and when I requested some time back for these interruptions I was told that I should expect to be contacted whilst away in my role and when I queried this and asked what if I was lying on a beach abroad, was told 'Well mobile phones do work abroad you know!'

She reprimanded a colleague of mine when she told me she liked the top I was wearing, told her not to be personal with me and to keep any personal relationships out of work.

She reprimanded me for having personal visitors in for a social call when an ex member of staff came in to discuss his final pay after he was wrongly made redundant (and has since won a claim against the company) yet her own mother came in to visit her and carried out confidential personnel filing duties to 'help out'

This is a Christian nursing home I work for and have done for the last 11 n half years.

 

I have raised a grievance against all these points as again my doctor advised me to reduce my hours due to stress at work. I was to be a surrogate (my employers knew about this) and have now suffered 2 miscarriages in the last 9 months.

The grievance was not upheld apart from 2 points of training and I have appealed 3 weeks ago. I am yet to even have an acknowledgement to this appeal.

 

We were told on Tuesday that the home is closing and we will be made redundant. I have asked for voluntary redundancy which was refused but I was offered a 'pre-termination negotiation' as long as I drop my grievance.

 

Yesterday I received a letter offering me £5300 when the statutory redundancy is £5242

 

Could someone please help me with my questions:

 

I have been working 15 hours a week instead of my contracted 37.5 so would I be entitled to be paid sick for the hours I have dropped on this occasion and the previous occasion?

What steps do I take to negotiate this offer? I think offering me £60 on top of what I am owed by law is an insult! Or should I continue with my grievance and head down the tribunal route. The mismanagement and bullying tactics I have witnessed in the last year would make anyones hair curl. There are others with similar grievances about mismanagement also so it is not only my word.

 

Any help really would be appreciated.

Thanks

Edited November 1, 2013 by ErIndoorz

[Emmzzi]

1. what does your contract say about sick pay?

2. I'd lodge an ET to sharpen their thinking. It'll cost but it may be worth it. Just be sure you have a strong case first. "Poor management" doesn't make a legal case.

[ErIndoorz]

My contract states I'm entitled to sick pay as per the policy - that stated a week sick pay for every year worked (which is 11 years) although a previous manager didn't enforce that, and only granted me 2 weeks so I've queried this with the head office but told they will continue wot was historical... I would however be entitled to SSP

 

I do understand poor management doesn't make a case but surely my grievance for bullying does? This was lodged at least 2 months before I even knew about the redundancy