National Insurance, never been asked until employment has ceased????

[domesticgoddess]

Hi, I'm wondering if anyone can shed some light on something. My daughter is 17 years old and a full time student studying for A levels. Up until this weekend she has been working for a small restaurant at weekends and on the odd day during the week. She has been paid always cash in her hand averaging £40 to £80 a week. On Friday i had a massive argument with her employer when i found out that they have been putting her behind the bar, shes worked 10 hour shifts with no breaks and they keep her tips. My daughter has never been asked to give her national insurance number and never had a wage slip. Today we received a "signed for" letter in the post saying that she isn't sacked but due to my "outburst" it would be impossible for her to come back. They have asked for her uniform back and have now asked for her national insurance number. I'm really annoyed and want to blow the lid on them for child exploitation but i dont want my daughter to get into any trouble over the national insurance matter. My question is "who is liable and at fault, my daughter or her former employer?" Any advice would be really appreciated as im not sure where to go on this matter! Thank you

[Emmzzi]

at £80 a week I don't think she has to pay NI, but does have to pay tax.

 

I agree with the employer that she should fight her own battles!

 

re: underage drinks serving - licensing board, local council

re: 10 hour shifts - difficult if she did not ask for breaks

 

How about letting your daughter handle it? She has to learn sometime, may as well be now with your support. She can probably find the info she needs on the internet.

[honeybee13]

Hello there.

 

I think you could find a lot of information about tax and NI on the directgov website.

 

My best, HB

[assisted blonde]

Under the licensing Act 2003 a person of any age can serve behind the bar as long as sales are authorised , that is why you will often see checkout assistants in the supermarket holding up alcohol to ask for authorisation. Licensing Act 2003 s153.

Examples of an a person who may authorise a sale are, the DPS or the PLH or any individual over the age of 18 who is authorised by the DPS or PLH.

Edited October 2, 2012 by assisted blonde

[dreadpiratesteve]

£80 per week wouldn't attract NI deductions (at least not with me when I was on that sort of money!)

 

Under 18, she would at least be entitled to a 15 minute unpaid break every four hours, or if in line with the over 18's, 20 minute unpaid break for every 6 hours!

 

In terms of serving alcohol, as Assisten Blonde mentions, she would need to be supervised by a person over 18 nominated by the Designated Premises Supervisor (DPS) or a Personal Licence Holder (PLH) who would only be working in that supervisory capacity (ie not doing anything else).

 

Lastly, what do her employers do with the tips? Also, do they do this with every member of staff?

 

Saying she isn't sacked but asking her not to work there is pretty much the same thing, I'm sure others can verify this! I would definately refuse to give her NI number as this should have been given at the start of the employment! Out of curiosity how long has she been "employed" there, does she have a contract and has she received payslips?

 

In these circumstances, she could do no worse than speak to ACAS!

[assisted blonde]

Just to clarify the DPS or PLH do not have to be soley working in a supervisory category (not nit picking just clarifying as there are a lot of misconceptions over LA2003)

[Bang!]

To be a pain, ask for her contract of employment and holiday pay due.

[dreadpiratesteve]

Fair enough Assisted Blonde, just that was what I was informed when I sat the NCPLH exams plus it has been 4 years since I last pulled a pint!

[firstclassx]

A possible criminal offence has been committed here by the company.

 

They must, by law, be able to prove immediately that the employee has a legal right to work there. Failing to keep a record is an offence IRRC.

 

Did she give them a copy of a passport or other ID? If not, I'd say an offence has occurred.

 

Report them to the Border Agency.

 

Under the 2006 Act you have a duty to prevent illegal working by carrying out document checks to confirm

if a person has the right to work in the UK. You should check and keep copies of original, acceptable

documents before someone starts working for you. If a person has a time limit on their stay then you should

carry out repeat checks at least once every 12 months. If a person has a restriction on the type of work they

can do and, or, the amount of hours they can work, then you must not employ them in breach of these

restrictions.

You should also verify that a person has the right to work when certain documents or scenarios are

presented to you. You can find out more about carrying out document checks in the section ‘Right to work

document checks’.

This duty applies to anyone who starts working for you on or after 29 February 2008.

 

Maybe someone with better understanding of Immigration Law could clarify?

[assisted blonde]

dreadpiratesteve I know what its like TBH the personal licence holders courses really only teach you enough to get through the exams, being a very sad person my specialist subejct was the licensing Act 2003 (should have gone on mastermind ha ha ) issued a load of personal and premises licences when it came in and did licensing enforcement and helped with the statement of licensing policy for the council, can only say glad I dont do it anymore or work for a council !!