MBNA cant currently comply with CCA, what now?

[leopard lady]

They can take it or leave it, you're no worse off offering are you. I would offer 10% first. They'd get peanuts from a dca. but from what I've read you have to be careful before you part with any cash as apparently they lie about f&f's aswell.

 

spoke too soon, does this look like one of theirs 0800 731 8099

[minmoo]

lol, it certainly does look like them. Just checked, google says yes

 

Do you feel the love haha:wink:

[Dotty50]

How did we ever cope without google and CAG!?

[minmoo]

Joking aside, it would be terrible. This site has given me a real purpose and belief. Thank ya muchly cag lol

[leopard lady]

Think its time for iblacklist or similar!!!

[minmoo]

Well i said i would take one more call from them to discuss when my apr last went up to the lovely 34.9% as i am sure i never had a letter confirming it. Anyway, all i ended up with was a bloke telling me of the dire consequences i faced if this continued and that it would default after about6 or 7 payments at which point i would never get credit again. I made reiterate that and he swears NEVER again. Not like i want it anyway.

 

But interestingly his opening words after security were telling me who i had the card with originally and how long ago! I never asked this and i havent made them aware so i am wondering if they are on the verge of concocting an agreement for me. I did ask him when i could expect it because i am not sure they were allowed to cancel my card the way they did and i would like to check my t&c but he dodged it superbly and rambled on. (Much like me lol:lol:)

 

Anyway he told me i was a great customer and have never missed any payments so it makes this situation hard to understand. I told it was easy to understand because you seem hell bent on putting all your great customers on high rates and raping us whilst ignoring cries for help when requested. He didnt actually disagree but said it was out of his hands at which point i told him there no point carrying on. He agreed but did say he would put a hold on my calls while i wrote another letter outlining my situation with an I & E. Then tried to give me another hard sell on a loan from a company they know well called approvals which is still unsecured. Definitely seems like they would like to get me off their books.

 

Ho hum, not sure whether to write another letter or not, i know it looks good if it ever gets in front of the judge but until they come up with a cca then why should i? They already ignored my begging noises once. Perhaps they are more likely to help now they arent getting any money lol.

[leopard lady]

We should start a "34.9" club lol:bounce:

[minmoo]

I dont really think its very exclusive though haha. Just me, you and a couple of million others

 

Not sure why i wrote that post, cant see why anyone would want to read that load of waffle. Mostly to help me remember what happens and when i guess.

[leopard lady]

No, its informative to people in the same position. It helps if you know what to expect when you speak to them. I just feel like its banging your head against a brick wall. The last one we spoke to would have given Eva Braun a run for her money. When you don't know whats happening to others you think its only you. Its like expecting a reply to your letters. I really thought I was sending them to the wrong address and they weren't getting them, but now I know they're just ignoring them. Also, like you say, its a recorded log for you of whats happened, as some days I'm sure like me it all becomes a big blur.

[Dotty50]

I also find it quicker to find information from your thread rather than going through your paper file.

[leopard lady]

yes, I try and put things on on the day so I can see when I recieved what at a glance

[minmoo]

Lol, so much for telling me they would cancel all calls for seven days while i wrote a letter with my offer of what i can afford and i&e! That lasted 2 days and they are off again. So full time ignore for them on the phone now!

I will simply await their reply of acceptance or refusal. Its take it or leave it time for them now. No more phone bullying.

[victoria_siempre]

Hi minmoo

 

Quite. They tell fibs on the 'phone and just don't reply to offers that don't meet their 'minimum requirements'.

 

I have one account frozen and token accepted (but not in writing) and another not frozen and token not accepted (again not in writing). It's like dealing with a madman on methadrine but you get used to it after a while.

 

x

 

v

[leopard lady]

You'll be lucky if you get a reply. As Victoria says they lie through their teeth on the phone. I was promised last month that as soon as `i paid the £150 my arrangement would start and they'd freeze the interest and charges. I went and got the money from my mum, phoned and paid it, and lo and behold, another £600 interest and charges this month. despicable. I put iblacklist on my phone as you know, worked for a few days now getting hassle from a blocked number. I don't know how they get away with it!!!

[the_shadow]

You'll be lucky if you get a reply. As Victoria says they lie through their teeth on the phone. I was promised last month that as soon as `i paid the £150 my arrangement would start and they'd freeze the interest and charges. I went and got the money from my mum, phoned and paid it, and lo and behold, another £600 interest and charges this month. despicable. I put iblacklist on my phone as you know, worked for a few days now getting hassle from a blocked number. I don't know how they get away with it!!!

 

Ok, number 1... the GOLDEN rule... did you record the call? if not next time they ring just tell them you are recording the call... makes them a WHOLE LOT less likely to lie to you....

 

Next... document everything you have posted above and complain to MBNA with a FORMAL complaint....when they dont respond in a couple of months or when they havent responded properly in two months complain to the FOS who wont charge you but will take a nice £500 off of MBNA to investigate.

 

I'm not saying this will always improve the situation for yourself but it feels good to be costing them money for a change

 

S.

[minmoo]

Having been reading on a seperate thread about using CPUTR2008, i have seen a letter initially sent by fellow cagger stunned monkey. Can anyone see any harm in sending this to see what sort of response comes forth? I feel it may be worthwhile considering there is no cca as opposed to a reconstituted one. Its more a thought at the moment until anyone could offer some advice. Maybe the general rule is to do nothing. Here it is in full anyway, all comments appreciated (credit to stunned monkey):

 

MBNA

xxxx

xxxx

xxxxx

xxxxx

xxxxx

 

26/01/2011

 

Dear MBNA,

 

 

Re: Account xxxxxxxxxxx

 

Thank you for your letter of xx/xx/xx the contents of which have been noted.

 

You have failed to respond to my legal request to supply me a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement (CCA) for the above account within the required 12 day time limit and as such the account entered default on xx/xx/xxxx.

 

I have since on the xx/xx/xxxx put the account in dispute and I do not acknowledge it as my responsibility.

 

Within your letter, I note with particular interest your claim that you are “entitled to carry out any actions which do not amount to enforcing the agreement including demanding payment, charging interest, transferring the debt to a third party, registering the debt with a credit reference agency and issuing a default notice”

 

Please cite the legislation that entitles you to taking these actions. It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’. I note your reference the McGuffick v RBS case, citing that it maintains your right to register any default with the credit reference agencies even though the agreement is unenforceable.

 

You are wrong.

 

There is a difference between:

 

1) An unenforceable CCA (as in McGuffick’s case)

2) No CCA at all.

 

Due to the lack of a signed CCA, you may consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect.

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any regulatory authorities as I see fit.You have 21 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint.

 

I hereby formally request that from your receipt of this letter, you contact me in writing only. I draw your attention to CPUTR 2008 and the OFT's guidelines on debt collection which state under the title Deceptive and/or unfair methods - Examples of unfair practices are as follows - 2.8

 

(i) - 'Failing to investigate and/or provide details as appropriate, when a debt is queried or disputed, possibly resulting in debtors being wrongly pursued'

 

(k) - 'Not ceasing collection activity whilst investigating a reasonable queried or disputed debt'

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I look forward to hearing from you

 

Yours Faithfully

 

 

 

If i am just wasting stamp money please let me know as i would rather not lol

[victoria_siempre]

Hi minmoo

 

There are differing opinions about this since recent court rulings that by pass CCA arguments. My approach, for what it's worth, is not to make CCA the primary point of contention but to focus on: making an affordable offer (£1 in my case); objecting to harassment, and making formal complaints that can be referred to fos.

 

Spurious CCAs can be kept as a background argument; I pick through their reconstituted T&Cs which throw up anomalies which I store for future arguments. Once they've passed this round multiple DCAs and eventually maybe sold it, I should imagine that they're confused as well and would find it difficult to justify an alleged figure based on the 'original' T&Cs.

 

If they haven't sent a CCA at all, that's a different matter: a/c in dispute and forget about it; but nowadays they can and do send any all crap.

 

These are just my tactics and I'm a simple soul.

 

x

 

v

[minmoo]

Thats just it Vic, they havent sent one, just a letter saying they cant at the moment and cant enforce through court whilst quoting various cases. I suppose i was thinking about pushing them to a point where they might consider options like f&f etc to get rid. All hopeful thinking but nothing wrong in that

 

Anything but a simple soul lol.

[victoria_siempre]

Hi minmoo

 

That's a nice interim position: keep the letter safe and ignore them.

 

They're more likely to accept a F&F (although this has dangers) if you wait until they offer one; if you offer one, they'll assume you have some dosh and the threat-o-gram machine will re-boot.

 

The best games are played long:

 

18. All warfare is based on deception.

 

19. Hence, when able to attack, we must seem unable;

when using our forces, we must seem inactive; when we

are near, we must make the enemy believe we are far away;

when far away, we must make him believe we are near.

 

20. Hold out baits to entice the enemy. Feign disorder,

and crush him.

 

21. If he is secure at all points, be prepared for him.

If he is in superior strength, evade him.

 

22. If your opponent is of choleric temper, seek to

irritate him. Pretend to be weak, that he may grow arrogant.

 

23. If he is taking his ease, give him no rest.

If his forces are united, separate them.

 

24. Attack him where he is unprepared, appear where

you are not expected.

 

25. These military devices, leading to victory,

must not be divulged beforehand.

 

Although I've just self contradicted point 25.

 

x, as always

 

v

 

SUN TZU ON THE ART OF WAR

THE OLDEST MILITARY TREATISE IN THE WORLD

Edited January 26, 2011 by victoria_siempre
attribution omitted

[minmoo]

Point 24 is essentially what i was aiming for lol. Beautifully put as usual vic. As an aside, i cant offer an f&f yet anyway, i need to drag this out for another 6 months ;-)

[victoria_siempre]

Festina lente minmoo

 

You are not dragging things out; you are merely letting due process take its course.

 

Meanwhile the alleged debt devalues in their eyes notwithstanding that they may appear to increase it; any F&F would exclude additional charges and interest.

 

Six months has no great meaning; the numbers 7, 8, 9 and 13 are also lucky: The number thirteen is lucky in Chinese because it sounds close to "definitely living."

 

x

 

v

Edited January 26, 2011 by victoria_siempre
grammar

[leopard lady]

Hi Minmoo, don't know if the letter qualifies as a legal issue, but just as a suggestion if you ask the site team to move your thread to 'debt - legal' there are some really clued up caggers who can have a look at your letter and see if its ok. I'm helping someone with an MBNA court case over there and they are brilliant. Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be many checking this section of the forum out, apart from the shadow who is also fantastic.

Edited January 26, 2011 by leopard lady

[leopard lady]

i see you've asked on fighting back with CPUTR thread. Good move, they seem genned up on the current position.

 

You me and Dotty seem to crop up on every thread I read!!!!

 

Changed my thread title to MBNA won't communicate in writing, btw.

 

Did you have a look at this thread I started about CCA's? A bit confusing but some good ideas. Tbh, I didn't expect as many people to post on it!!!!

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?291474-Waksman-Carey-and-summary-of-findings-4/page2

[minmoo]

I read through that one at lunchtime today, some good posts indeed. There is so much to learn and it will take time. I noticed your title change and see you and i quite close in terms of where we are. So it will be interesting. Dotty is waaaay down the line. I have to learn to be patient but it is so nice to be around people that have experience and not to feel alone. Waiting to see your agreement though, hopefully it gives you some wiggle room

[leopard lady]

On my other thread (under my ex's name)

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?282955-Hilesden-securities-court-papers-received&p=3272708

I am just in front of Dotty timewise, just doing allocation questionnaire. Probably why I keep bumping into her!!! Its a bloody nightmare!!! Just trying to post up the application form/agreement they've sent me today in response to my cca request. If you could have a look in a bit when I've sussed how to do it (I never remember no matter how many times I do it!!!) and tell me what you think please? Then over to the AQ for the other case.

If I could press a button and make mbna disappear ...............................