Scrapper vs MBNA Potential Commencement of legal proceedings***WON***

[Scrapper]

Hi

 

I've had loads of help so far with my battle with MBNA so thanks to all that have helped.

 

So far I have sent them 2 CCA Requests and now the account is in dispute. All they sent me was a copy of their current T&C. I have had nothing that even resembles a credit agreement and nothing with my signature on it. I have also sent them a SAR and I have had nothing back from them. They are even still adding late and missed payment charges and adding the interest as well. They have suspended the account, but so far haven't but any missed payments on my credit file.

 

In the post today I received Potential Commencement of legal proceedings threating me with all sorts and asking me to call them immediatley or within 7 days. Funny how they don't stick the timelines I set them.

 

County Court Judgement

Salary deductions (They can try I got made redundant)

Balliffs

DCA

Charge being put on my house

 

What I need to know are what are my next steps as they don't seem to be acknowledging anything I request from them which makes this all very frustrating as they seem to be a law unto themselves.

 

Many thanks in advance

 

Scrapper Coco

[Thailand]

Scrapper, I hope this thread gets moved to a more helpful place.

 

Potential

 

They want to say 'will' but they can't. They are a breed of bluffers (mildly speaking). It's quite pathetic. Total bum-sick.

 

They out of time on the SAR yet?, for what it's worth.

 

They are still adding charges?...Bless!! phantom numbers..... stick around, they AINT getting paid!

[Scrapper]

Hi Thailand

 

Thanks

 

They aren't out of time yet, but as with my CCA requests they just ignored me so I can see the same happening again.

 

Who moves the thread? if you don't mind me asking

 

Many Thanks

 

Scrapper Coco

 

 

Scrapper, I hope this thread gets moved to a more helpful place.

 

 

 

They want to say 'will' but they can't. They are a breed of bluffers (mildly speaking). It's quite pathetic. Total bum-sick.

 

They out of time on the SAR yet?, for what it's worth.

 

They are still adding charges?...Bless!! phantom numbers..... stick around, they AINT getting paid!

[maroondevo52]

Hi, Scrapper.

 

I can move it for you, not sure where to move it though

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

[Scrapper]

Hi Scott

 

Thanks for your offer of help. Anywhere that I could get the most help would be very appreciated.

 

Many thanks

 

Scrapper Coco

 

Hi, Scrapper.

 

I can move it for you, not sure where to move it though

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

[Scrapper]

And today they have called 4 times and an automated system left a message on my answer machine. Thanks MBNA for the I'm gonna get you for harrasment evidence.

 

Account in dispute. Nothing supplied to me from 2 CCA requests and still waiting on my SAR (Not holding my breath) now the phone calls start all over again. Thought my last letter had put an end to all that cr*p from them.

 

Over and out

 

Scrapper Coco

[Scrapper]

Hi

 

I'm going to send this letter to MBNA before I start contacting FOS and TS

 

All comments, Suggestions welcome please

 

ACCOUNT IN DISPUTE

 

Re: my request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

Thank you for your letter dated 13th February 2009, received 21st February 2009, the contents of which are noted.

 

I am somewhat perplexed as to why you are considering POTENTIAL COMMENCEMENT OF LEGAL PROCEEDINGS as you have failed to comply with any of my requests for information which in turn has put this account into serious dispute.

 

I would like to draw your attention to the following so as not to be in any doubt about your company’s lack of compliance with my LEGAL request.

 

On 21st January 2009, and the 29th January 2009, I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8.

 

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document.

 

As you may not be aware , failure to comply with this request within 12 working days renders the alleged debt UNENFORCEABLE in law.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is NOT permitted to take ANY action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

 

The lack of a compliant credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

 

 

 

· May not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

 

· May not add further interest or any charges to the account.

 

· May not pass the account to a third party.

 

· May not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

 

· May not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

 

Be warned, the CCA 1974 is clear that a default can only be issued for breach of a valid, regulated agreement. If there is no agreement, as in this case, then you cannot issue a default as I have not breached any valid, regulated agreement.

 

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

After taking advice, I am of the opinion that your continued pursuit is in violation of the Administration of Justice Act 1970 section 40 as well as breaching a number of the OFT Collection Guidelines.

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit.

 

You have 7 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint.

 

I look forward to your final decision on this complaint within 21 days. This should include your proposed actions in relation to the lack of a credit agreement.

 

I await your rapid response.

[charliebubs]

Hi Scrapper,

 

Have you had a good read of the threads on here?

 

I'm quite new to this too, but from what I can ascertain for an account to be "in dispute" there has to be a dispute as to the amount of the balance, rather than the lack of CCA.

 

There is some conflicting advice on here, but generally the thoughts seem to be not to stop making payments until they have had the time to comply with the CCA and SAR requests.

 

If they don't respond to these, the next step is a CPR letter.

 

You need to make ABSOLUTELY sure that they don't have a signed CCA that they can whip out if it goes as far as court, as then you will be b*ggered for the payments and interest and charges that you have missed.

 

I'll see if I can find the thread where this is discussed and link it to you.

 

good luck

[charliebubs]

It's a long topic, I'm afraid, but have a read of this.........

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/173201-why-you-shouldnt-use-3.html

Edited February 22, 2009 by charliebubs
doh! wrong link first time!

[lexis200]

Hi Scrapper

 

MBNA seem to follow a fairly set pattern. They will send huge amounts of pointless threats, coupled with nonsensical calls that have you going round in circles.

 

If you are not paying them (as Charliebubs said, probably not a good idea to halt payments unless you can be 99.9% sure they hold nothing), or you are paying them less than they want (we are paying what we can, which they don't agree with), they will carry on for 7 months, and then default you.

 

After this they will sell the account on/have it managed by a DCA - in our case Debt Clear Recoveries.

 

OH has had many threats levied in letters - court, bailiffs, doorstep callers (when I pulled them up on doorstep callers the VP said neither they nor the DCA's they use employ them!), attachment of earnings (strangely quiet here when I told them only a court could insist on this). None of them has as yet materialised. Well none of the biggies, obviously we have had the default and DCA bit, but that's not exactly end of the world stuff.

 

I found stopping calls took a few letters, but once my formal complaint had been passed onto Gail Powell (VP - probably one of many, like the Heads of Customer Assistance) they did stop. Since her letter towards the end of last year we have only had 3 or so calls, and these were shortly after her assurance they would stop, so could conceivably have just been mistakes.

 

A couple of things to note on your letter (nothing major, it's ok as it stands) - They will not accept that the account is in dispute, so that may be an argument that takes up space rather than actually gets you anywhere. Also, in your last couple of lines you give them 7 and then 21 days to respond. Why not split the difference and make it 14 in both:D

 

Under s78, you are asking for a true copy. They can omit signatures, so although you have asked for the signed copy, they do not have to provide it. That bit is where the SAR comes in, as they do have to comply if you specifically ask them to. They probably won't, but they do have to:rolleyes:

 

They have however not complied at all by sending just the current terms. What is clear is that they must send a true copy - that is a copy that is identical in form and content to the original that you signed, which obviously must therefore be historically accurate. Current terms do not suffice. In addition they need to send any other documents referred to in the agreement. It is very likely that the agreement (if there is one) will mention seperate terms, so again, you also need the historical terms.

 

They should also have sent you a statement of account, which it looks like they've neglected to do.

 

Unfortunately, they will insist that what they have sent you so far complies with the CCA, however much you insist it doesn't. I still favour arguing the toss with them, as it all serves to make them look like incompentant unreasonable bankers:)

 

With the SAR, they didn't send anything within the 40 days. I complained, saying they'd be reported to the ICO, and they sent it SD on the day they received my letter. Naughty naughty. Plus, it had been printed a while before, so they really were just sitting on it.

 

I feel I'm waffling now so I'm going:)

 

HTH a bit.

 

Lexis:)

[Scrapper]

Hi lexis200

 

Thanks for your responce and sorry for the late reply, but have been somewhat busy winding up MBNA.

 

I made the amendments to the letter I sent them as you suggested and it all went very quiet on the MBNA front until yesterday that is. I was bombarded with calls all day and again today. Told them I'd see them in court and the person on the other end went very quiet and hung up.

 

I have given them every opportunity to supply me with the details I require and each time I'm met with either we can do what we want or pay up or well be round. Like to see that one as they have to get past my security gates first and without my permission or a court order I'll let the hounds out. That should see them break the world high jump record lol.

 

Anyway so I've had enough cause if they had nothing to hide they would have produced it by now so I was speaking with my wife and she reckons that we have had that card for nearly 20yrs not 15yrs as I thought so I have changed tatics with them and sent them a CPR 31.16 letter just to show them I mean business and I won't let them monkeys hike my rate from around 12% to 36.9% overnight and expect me to put up with it. I'll end up paying more in interest and never actually clearing the debt. C*#ts :eek:.

 

Mate of mine said his egg card went from 15.9% to 26.9% overnight as well. How can this be legal????????????????????:-x:-x:-x

 

I know a few blokes that would lend at half that rate and be happy. It's legalized robbery if you ask me.

 

See it all went quiet on the government threating to take their credit licences away if they didn't drop their interest rates in the current climate. Government all talk no bo**ocks. Bail out the banks with our money and leave us to rot.

 

I'm 99.9999999999999% sure that if they can't supply a CCA to someone who has only had an account 6 or so yrs they definately won't find mine, but not counting my chickens just yet. So I'll see how they respond to that request and if they ignore me again I will send the second letter requesting it and failure to supply will result in me applying to the court for a disclosure order agaisnt them. Lets see them ignore a Judge and get away with it.

 

I don't care what it costs as it's got to be cheaper than the debt on the card that's for sure.

 

Anyway enough for now

 

Scrapper Coco

Edited March 4, 2009 by Scrapper

[Scrapper]

And another thing. I have just noticed that they haven't even sent the statement of account I requested either. Naughty Naughty

 

Scrapper Coco

[Scrapper]

If and when I do get the statement how do I know whats a fair charge and what isn't

 

Thanks

 

Scrapper Coco:cool:

[maroondevo52]

This should help..........

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/hsbc-bank/15518-charges-description-statements-please.html

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

[Scrapper]

Cheers for that matey

 

Many thanks

 

Scrapper Coco

[Scrapper]

Gets even better now.

 

No Signed CCA, No statement of account and now they have sent back my SAR request because I didn't DATE the cheque I sent them.

 

Talk about stalling for time.

 

 

Scrapper Coco

[lexis200]

Sounds about right:rolleyes:

[Scrapper]

Hi all more help needed

 

So MBNA have failed on all fronts. No CCA or statement of account, No SAR & finally no CPR so next step is to issue a court order against them making them disclose my credit agreement. The only thing they responded to was my complaint. Forget my complaint and send me a copy of an agreement that is 20yrs old or just admit you haven't got it anymore and lets move on. I wish they'd stop wasting my time. I'm not going to back down and their scare tatics won't work on me. I'm a grown up not scared of a playground bully. Take me to court and when I point out your complete disregard for your own industry guidelines and you failing as a regulated company lets see what way the dice rolls. They better hurry as well cause after my next letter they have 14 days before I pop down to my local county court and spring a little surprise on them. All this cr*p about our credit file etc etc. Like I'm bothered after losing my job. Why would I want anymore credit that I can't pay back. I bet about 1/3 of the UK population has bad credit reports entries at the moment and it's only gonna get worse. (Sorry about the rant, but I'm 99.99% sure they read this forum. Might make them think about what they are doing but I doubt that)

 

Today however I got a letter from Optima Legal advising that their client may have no alternative other than to commence legal proceedings to obtain a charging order agains't me. Like to see them try as I saw this coming months ago and transfered everything I own into my wifes name. Also spoke to my mortgage lender and they advised that a judge couldn't pass an order for a debt I own and has nothing to do with my wife. And it couldn't happen cause I'm no longer on the deeds. Funny how it's all unsecured, but when you not playing ball they want a judge to secure it on your house. Don't like it up them.

 

Anyway enough ranting.

 

What are my next steps as MBNA have just totally ignored me from day one.

 

Many thanks in advance

 

Scrapper Coco

Edited March 11, 2009 by Scrapper

[angel_1]

hiya scrapper,,,im subbing to this thread of yours if i may

 

did i read right on another thread which i cant find at the moment,,,sorry

 

that you were conversing with a police friend re the potential of looking at mbna for any possiblities of what they are sending out as credit agreements,,,?

 

only that i thought id read that if you found someone that did hold a copy of what they originally signed and sent off, it would prove more useful for any potential investigation by the fraud squad if what that person then ended up getting via a cca or sars request,,,,

 

i did come across someone who actually has a copy of what they signed at the time for an alliance and leicester card ie under mbna,,,, now once i find it i will revert them to this thread and vice versa if thats okay,,,

 

laters angel x

[Scrapper]

Hi Angel_1

 

Sorry for the delayed responce, but I've been busy being a house husband since I lost my job. Don't know how my wife or any other woman copes with it all, but spending quailty time with my girls is a result as I now know what I've been missing as I used to work my arse off in london for years.

 

Anyway yes I did mention that a good friend of mine is HOT FUZZ and he will help if enough people come forward to prove something strange is going on with our friendly card company.

 

I have posted what I have found out so far at the following

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/mbna/163837-toxic-mbna.html

 

If you have any questions I can put them to him and see what he comes back with.

 

If I don't repond straight away it's because he works all hours and sometimes it's hard to pin him down.

 

Thanks

 

Scrapper Coco

Edited March 25, 2009 by Scrapper

[angel_1]

hiya Scrapper

 

hey no problems, i totally understand about not replying to messages straightaway cos life does get in the way lol

 

hey that is fab spending time with your girls at home,,,glad you understand what us wives do extra to working,,,, well done you

 

mind you have no complaints with my hubby he is fab at helping in the house and its a team effort so no grumbles there from me:-)

 

I dont really think i kept a copy of what i completed but im going to see what paperwork i can find, and then i can let you know

 

but basically one of my mbna has been sent to a dca now and thus have to deal with that for the moment and then see what original paperwork i can find,

 

keep happy and have a fun day laters angel x;-)

[Scrapper]

Hi

 

Well after a long absense I have some good news of sorts depending on how you look at it.

 

I have managed to get MBNA to agree to a F&F settlement as well as getting them to remove all default markers from my credit file. And before you ask YES I got it in writing.

 

I have only had to pay a fraction of what I owed due to the fact that after going down the N244 route and sending them a copy just to prove I wasn't playing their games anymore they admitted that they didn't have a copy of my CCA and to save both parties any further hassle and costs we both agreed on a figure and job done.

 

If you stick at it and call their bluff you will eventually get the result you are hoping for of sorts. I would have loved to have paid them nothing, but at the end of the day the hassle involved trying to get Defaults and markers removed from your credit file just isn't worth all the stress as far as I'm concerned as I have a life and family to be getting on with and a job to find, but that's just my personal opinion so please don't take it personally.

 

In case you are wondering I owed them £17000 and settled on £3000............................................. I paid them half last month and they will receive the final installment once my credit file is updated which should be the end of Septemeber. I got them to agree to all of this in writing as well. Never thought they would and was totally shocked, but I suppose something for them is better than nothing.

 

Anyway I'd like to say a big thanks to all that helped and gave me advice and a donation is on it's way shortly.

 

Still a few more to go yet so watch this space.

 

Many thanks

 

Scrapper Coco

Edited August 31, 2009 by Scrapper

[NPMBNA]

subbing

[angel_1]

hiya scrapper

 

its been a while so im hoping it all went to plan for you in the full and final settlement action and did you get it all sorted as planned?

 

hoping it was all okay for you any updates you can feed back much appreciated thanks angel x

[Scrapper]

Hi Angel

 

It's all sorted. Account fully settled and credit file has been cleaned. They actually went a step further and completely removed the entire entry so if anyone was to look at it I never even had an MBNA card.

 

I would have loved to see it out till the end and not paid them a penny, but as I stated in my previous post I owed them £17,000 so effectively after all the letters backwards and forwards and finally getting them to admit they didn't have the agreement I have made £14,000 out them for nothing which is a result as I bought my wifes car with it. So if we ever sell the car we will still be around £10,000 up. Not bad for a few months work.

 

I do believe though if I had really stuck at it I could have just wiped the whole debt off, but with looking after my girls and looking for a new job I really didn't have the patience for it all.

 

Some will say I'm wrong and should have seen it through, but that's life.

 

I wouldn't be suprised if I get a DCA chasing me in future though as MBNA seem to do whatever they like even if you have got it all in writing judging by what I have read on here. They have most likely marked my file as on hold until a set date then try and start it all up again.

 

I would like to say a big thanks to all that helped again as without the advice on here I would have just kept paying.

 

How are you getting on anyway?

 

Thanks

 

Scrapper Coco

 

On a different note something very strange has been going on with my Barclaycard. I had payment protection on it and had all the statements to prove they had been taking the premium, so when I tried to claim after losing my job they swore blind I cancelled it back in 2004. What the f*@k. So stopped paying them immediatley and started being called and chased to the end of the earth so contacted all the usual suspects ICO, FOS etc etc and the entry on my credit file disappeared completely and I haven't heard from them in months. Not a peep. FINGERS CROSSED cause I owed £17000 on that at well

Edited December 7, 2009 by Scrapper