Discussion on enforceability of agreements

[chocolatehead]

What are you trying to do?

 

Good question, about a month ago I took a huge pay cut. It is only temporary.

 

Currently I'm panicking about DCA's turning up and taking my stuff (unlikley I know).

 

As my pay cut is only temporary, I'd like to stall, delay, Pro-Rata pay each of my creditors for about 12 months till I can resume normal levels. If I could do this whilst getting the creditors to hold the interest that would be even better!

This is all something fairly new to me so I'm still trying to find my feet.

Any help is much appreciated!

[ray1066]

thanks appreciate the advice, will be back im sure

[ray1066]

Hello again

 

I have just been checking my agreement. It is a photocopy that has been sent to me, but isnt signed. Although I did sign the original (was three years ago) so I need to ask for a copy to make sure they have it. I have also been checking the following:

 

The rate of interest is shown

Number of instalments is shown

Total amount repayable is shown

Amount of credit borrowed is shown

The agreement does state correctly how I will make repayments

 

There are not any specific dates specified on the agreement, it just states that it will start three months after the loan was agreed.

 

From this I feel I may have a case for being unenforceable?

 

I also need to check they have a signed copy?

 

What do you think if you dont mind giving me some more advice?

 

thanks

 

Ray

[davefirewalker]

You need to see the original or a copy of the original....

 

I could send you a copy agreement....but you wouldnt pay ME any money would you ?

 

These companies have a habit of making stuff up if they cant find or haven't got the originals.

 

BE CAREFULL.......make sure what they send you is what you agreed to!

 

other than that to comment properly we need to see it ....can you post a copy up ?

 

Dave

[lollipop73]

Hello everyone, I have been redirected by a kind member to this thread to ask about this multiple agreement, I didn`t ask for the PPI and did ring to demand it be cancelled and after a few months they eventually did-it MBNA

 

 

 

 

image removed

 

 

 

My OH thinks it looks like it is ok but he has some questions about the fairness of the agreements terms.

Edited January 8, 2009 by lollipop73

[steven4064]

Hi lollipop

 

Your OH is right, this is a perfectly valid agreement - it is properly executed

 

However, the terms under 3a) are unlawful panalty charges and, if you have been charged any, you should claim them back. See my Goldfish thread.

[lollipop73]

Will do, thanks Steven

[SharpmanTF1]

URGENT

Lolipop, you may want to take those scans you put up today and re-edit them, all personal details are visible. I can make out all account details as well as your name and address.

[Muffintop]

If they do it for you it will cost you (a lot). Doing it yourself is fairly easy (with help from your friends) and is free.

 

We have seen several of these companies that offer to squash debts/get money back, etc and end up leaving the 'customer' in a right pickle.

Steven if you were to enlist one of these companies apart from having to pay huge commission what are the other pitfalls to customer that may leave them in a mess?

[lollipop73]

Will do thanks-

[steven4064]

Muffintop

 

I'm not saying they all leave the consumer in a mess but their motive is to make money for themselves not to help you. If things get a bit difficult or complicated they are likely to take the money and run. Why pay someone lots of money to do something you can easily do yourself and into the bargin get it done by someone who cares - you.

[Muffintop]

Steven I understand where you are coming from, its a matter of confidence isnt it, I did my first bank claim with help from cag and I was so scared the next one and the next was easier, this cca thing is so much more complex and quite hard to get your head around, when you have a few of them going as I do and some that are more than 5k so wont be small claims and could incur costs I have considered going to an agency but then how do you know who may rip you off and who wont and I take your point above on board.

[steven4064]

The thing is that most of the banks will do anything rather than go to court.

 

Start a thread with one of your cases and see how it goes is my advice. Like the charges, once you have done one...

[Muffintop]

Tnx, already got 3 active threads on go so in another few months will know where Im at.

[davefirewalker]

Hi an interesting idea has arisen, and I would appreciate some input.....

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/176726-improperly-executed-agreements-correct.html

 

let us know what you think

 

rgds

 

Dave

[TangoMan69]

Hi all, I have an almost identical Egg Loan credit agreement to the one posted above as being imprpoprely executed due to the lack of a seperate agreement for PPI (I wish I hadn't signed up for PPI!). I've got a bit of a headache looking around these forums and wondering if someone can tell me what I can do? Theres about 5 grand left to pay over the next 2 years but the PPI alone quoted on the agreement in £3600 so even if I can get that refunded or paid back onto the loan it'd be a great help! Does anyone have any advice on what to do and how to go about it? Thanks very much, looks like you're all doing a cracking job on here!

[steven4064]

Hi TangoMan

 

Welcome to CAG.

 

Start your own thread and post a copy of the agreement (personal details removed).

 

To start a thread click the button on the forum

 

To post the agreement - scan it, upload to photobucket and then copy the link to it using the icon.

[ukaviator]

Something else that needs looking into, and maybe put into our POC's.

 

"Evidential Weight and Legal Admissibility of Electronic Information"

 

The British Standard (BS 10008) is designed to deal with issues relating to the authenticity and integrity of electronic information which may be used as legal evidence. the BS 10008 standard is not entirely new, and is in fact based on an existing code of practice for "legal admissibility and evidential weight of information stored electronically" (or BIP 0008). This original code of practice was extended in 2005 to include the electronic communication of information and the linking of electronic identity to documents, which all together make up the new draft standard.

 

According to the BSi website, compliance with the new BS 10008 standard will help organisations to maximise the trustworthiness and reliability of their information, and to minimise the risk associated with long term storage of electronic information on their systems. This covers the accessibility and availability of verifiable information over a period of time, and includes the use of document management, storage, transmission, and retrieval systems as well as electronic identification / signatures and copyright management. The document and information may be in form of text, executable formulae, and / or multi-media (i.e. voice / video / images). The main body of the standard provides guidelines and directions on various aspects of electronic information management including:

• Information management and security policies (covering the electronic storage and transfer of information), roles / responsibilities, reporting and documentation among other things.
  
• System implementation and operations (covering information capture, transfer, storage, index and output, as well as features like identity, security, disaster recovery, outsourcing, version control and exercising)
  
• System monitoring and review (including auditing and management reviews)
  
• System maintenance, monitoring and improvement One is left, after reading this, with the overall impression that here is a well thought-out and fairly comprehensive example of a developing standard which will benefit from input by all interested, and affected, stakeholders.
  

BS 10008 is applicable to any corporate body, large or small, whatever the nature of its business, and especially topical for business managers, records managers, compliance officers and legal advisors in financial institutions, insurance companies and local government departments.

 

BS 10008 is referenced in the “Freedom of Information Act 2000: Code of Practice on Records Management published by The National Archives as required by Section 46 of the FOIA.

 

BS 10008 combines some of the content of the BSI guides, BIP 0008-1, BIP 0008-2 and BIP 0008-3. BIPs 0008-1,2,3 are still current and can be used in parallel to BS 10008. BS 10008

 

I haven’t come across anyone even mentioning a BSI standard, let alone insisting upon its use. It might apply to the records management arena, where there is a business purpose to showing you have kept records in an acceptable format for a period of time. We could use this in areas where there are no CCA's. The new standard was updated in mid December 2008.

[TangoMan69]

Thanks Steven, I have done here...

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt-issues/176845-egg-loan-improperly-executed.html

[bozobro0]

I have just found a hire purchase agreement that i had for a car loan from Advantage finance.I paid the loan off early but have just noticed that at the bottom of the forms which are my copies,i have signed in the box,but where it says Signed on behalf of Advantage finance the agent did not sign.

Is this important or does it not really matter.Thanks

[davefirewalker]

I have just found a hire purchase agreement that i had for a car loan from Advantage finance.I paid the loan off early but have just noticed that at the bottom of the forms which are my copies,i have signed in the box,but where it says Signed on behalf of Advantage finance the agent did not sign.

Is this important or does it not really matter.Thanks

 

Probably not.......

 

Although it would have been improperly executed, all they would have to do would be to sign it now.

 

But it does raise the question would the agreement have legal effect before it was properly executed ??

 

see here........>http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/176726-improperly-executed-agreements-correct.html

 

 

rgds

 

Dave

[bozobro0]

Thanks,will have a look now.

[davefirewalker]

Can any experts on this thread pop over to

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt-issues/176992-ccjs-only-option-us.html

 

these guys need some serious help.......its heartbreaking

 

rgds

dave

[lollipop73]

Hi lollipop

 

Your OH is right, this is a perfectly valid agreement - it is properly executed

 

However, the terms under 3a) are unlawful panalty charges and, if you have been charged any, you should claim them back. See my Goldfish thread.

 

Thanks again Steven,

 

I am sorry if I seem a pain the rear but just to clarify a confused and unsure mind

 

 

..................the unlawful charges in 3.a-is that including the "any other losses and costs we suffer as a result of you breaking this agreement" ?

 

I can`t seem to find your goldfish thread at present.

 

And also, I do remember not ticking the PPI box , and should I not also have received the terms it refers to after the PPI box anyway whether it`s an online application or not?

 

I complained about PPI and was assured at the time it would be cancelled from inception, and charges refunded to me but looking at the transaction history they sent it never was refunded back and was treated like a standard 30 day notice canx not a from inception cancellation.

 

Is there anywhere I can see the interest rates and changes on the forum so I can re-work out the correct sum outstanding after looking at the unlawful charges?

 

Again apologies in advance if I am just being dense.

[steven4064]

You are going to have a hard time porving you didn't tick the PPI box when it is clearly ticked on the copy. Your best bet is to reclaim it as a msitake as you (presumably) asked fr a refund according to teh T&Cs but never got it.

 

Onthe unlawful charges, you could probably estimate the balance but the best bet is just to recalim them. Goldfish thread here