Deposit not protected

[balham_tenant]

Hello all,

I signed a 12 month lease in May 2007 for a 1 bed flat. I paid a deposit of 1320 pounds to the Letting Agent who prepared the lease.

I moved out in June 2008.

I have not received any deposit back, and the landlord is making claims to the whole deposit, though I have not received anything in writing.

After investigating, the deposit was not protected, and after asking the landlord about it, he is now claiming he never got the deposit from the agent.

I have a letter from the letting agent confirming that he prepared the lease and that the deposit is with the landlord. I have confirmed with each of the three deposit protection schemes that my deposit was not protected.

 

Before taking it to court, my concerns are:

a) I dont have copy of the signed lease. It was supposed to be mailed to me but I didnt get it. I do have the recent letter from the agent confirming in writing that he prepared the lease.

b) I moved out of the property in June and it is now September.

c) I did not give proper notice. I foolishly gave my 1 months notice to the Agent over the phone, who told me he would contact the landlord. He never did, but I didnt give anything in writing and didnt contact the landlord, so I dont think i can argue this too well. The landlord is claiming I gave just 1 weeks notice to him over the phone.

d) The landlord is claiming damage to the bathtub, which did develop a crack in it.

e) The landlord claiming recently that I didnt clean it properly, even though i spent a week cleaning it thoroughly.

 

There were no condition reports when I moved in, nor when I moved out. The landlord didnt mention the flat was not clean when I had my final inspection. He is just bringing it up now, after I have threatened to take it to court.

 

Will the fact that I have already moved out, dont have a copy of the signed lease (just a letter from agent confirming he prepared the lease), did not give proper notice in writing, and there are now accusations I broke the bath and did not clean properly, adversely affect my court case that he did not protect the deposit?

 

I do have the receipt from the agent proving I paid the deposit, and the Agent confirms this again in a the recent letter.

 

I have already sent a letter to the Landlord asking for the full deposit to be refunded otherwise I will seek a court action in 14 days. Before I do this, I would like some advice on my particular case.

 

Thanks in advance.

[p_cas]

If there was no inventory then it would be very difficult for the landlord to make any deductions from your deposit as he would have no way of proving the condition.

 

If youve written to them giving 14 days then that's fair enough. After that time make a Claim for at least the return of your deposit. I think though, in the meantime, once the landlord realises his mistake he will probably pay up.

 

 

Hello all,

I signed a 12 month lease in May 2007 for a 1 bed flat. I paid a deposit of 1320 pounds to the Letting Agent who prepared the lease.

I moved out in June 2008.

I have not received any deposit back, and the landlord is making claims to the whole deposit, though I have not received anything in writing.

After investigating, the deposit was not protected, and after asking the landlord about it, he is now claiming he never got the deposit from the agent.

I have a letter from the letting agent confirming that he prepared the lease and that the deposit is with the landlord. I have confirmed with each of the three deposit protection schemes that my deposit was not protected.

 

Before taking it to court, my concerns are:

a) I dont have copy of the signed lease. It was supposed to be mailed to me but I didnt get it. I do have the recent letter from the agent confirming in writing that he prepared the lease.

b) I moved out of the property in June and it is now September.

c) I did not give proper notice. I foolishly gave my 1 months notice to the Agent over the phone, who told me he would contact the landlord. He never did, but I didnt give anything in writing and didnt contact the landlord, so I dont think i can argue this too well. The landlord is claiming I gave just 1 weeks notice to him over the phone.

d) The landlord is claiming damage to the bathtub, which did develop a crack in it.

e) The landlord claiming recently that I didnt clean it properly, even though i spent a week cleaning it thoroughly.

 

There were no condition reports when I moved in, nor when I moved out. The landlord didnt mention the flat was not clean when I had my final inspection. He is just bringing it up now, after I have threatened to take it to court.

 

Will the fact that I have already moved out, dont have a copy of the signed lease (just a letter from agent confirming he prepared the lease), did not give proper notice in writing, and there are now accusations I broke the bath and did not clean properly, adversely affect my court case that he did not protect the deposit?

 

I do have the receipt from the agent proving I paid the deposit, and the Agent confirms this again in a the recent letter.

 

I have already sent a letter to the Landlord asking for the full deposit to be refunded otherwise I will seek a court action in 14 days. Before I do this, I would like some advice on my particular case.

 

Thanks in advance.

[MrShed]

Dont even worry about the inventory, at this point not a concern.

 

The landlord has not protected the deposit, as such if you claim via court you will have the return of the deposit plus 3x deposit as compensation.

 

Send LBA stating this, then proceed to court.

[balham_tenant]

Thanks for the replies.

 

I have not heard from the LL, it does not look like he is going to return the deposit. To take it to court -

 

a) What do I need to submit, apart from the form with the suggested wording in one of the stickies

b) My deposit amount is £1320, therefore claim amount will exceed £5000 - is this a problem, does it need to be less than £5000?

 

The evidence I have to submit at the moment is:

- Signed receipt of payment of deposit and first months rent to Letting Agent

- A copy of the standard AST lease that was emailed to me (I dont have the signed copy as I was never sent it by either LA or LL)

- The LBA that i sent the LL giving 14 days to return the deposit

 

I am planning to put both the LA and LL as defendants.

[MrShed]

I would advise that you claim for the maximum of £5k, rather than the £5280 - the £280 would bring with it substantial risk and cost, as you could not proceed via small claims.

 

As to the other questions, Planner knows better than me

[help me kick his butt]

Poor old Planner, i'm waiting for him to come on line too, have not seen him on here for ages x

He is a man in demand

[balham_tenant]

I am preparing to submit my CPR Part 8 claim form. Due to the size of my deposit, and the fact I want to limit my claim to 5000 pounds, I am planning to use the following wording, which is a variation on the suggested wording.

 

The Claimant claims under section 214(1)(a) of the Housing Act 2004 that the deposit of £1320 required by the

tenancy agreement dated 26/05/07 in respect of the premises at (property address here) made between the Claimant and the Defendant was not paid into an appropriate tenancy deposit scheme (in breach of section 213(1) of the Housing Act 2004), or that the Claimant did not receive the prescribed information concerning which Tenancy Deposit Scheme was holding the deposit within 14 days of the Defendant's receipt of the deposit (in breach of section 213(3) of the Housing Act 2004).

 

And the Claimant asks that the court make an order:

1. That the person who appears to the court to be holding the deposit do repay it to the Claimant, in accordance

with section 214(3) of the Housing Act 2004.

 

2. That the Defendant do pay to the Claimant, within 14 days of the making of the order, a sum of money up to

three times the amount of the deposit, in accordance with section 214(4) of the Housing Act 2004.

 

As this amount exceeds the limit of the small claims track, the Claimant is therefore seeking a payment limited to £5000.

 

Any comments before I proceed? Also, I am planning to submit 2 forms, one for the landlord, the second for the letting agent. This is because the landlord most recently denied ever getting the deposit from the letting agent. Is this the correct way to proceed? By submitting the exact same claim form and wording, but just changing the defendants for each form?

[Planner]

Part 8 wouldnt be dealt with via small calims track anyway so there is no need to limit to £5000. Claim the full amount you are owed.

 

I have been on holiday in China!

[jimmylesaint]

Sorry to hijackhere, but am in similar state as BalhamTenant and about to send a similar letter,but...

However i have one possible snag!!

My contract from last year was for 11months at £2200 per calendar month£24200. Does this mean i am over the £25k per annum limit?? If so then as there were more than one of us renting, paying our share would this then make it under the £25k Limit?(Part deposit was returned to us individually)

Sorry if these are silly questions but just want to make sure before i send letter.

Regards

jimmylesaint

[MrShed]

Unfortunately jimmy you are therefore not eligible for the TDS scheme.

[jimmylesaint]

Hi MrShed thanks for your reply, i kinda thought so but was hoping maybe as there were more than one tennant it might individually put us under the £25k Scheme(guess it don't work like that)

IS there some other scheme it would fall under?

If the landlord did not sign the contract(he did not) would this help us, or be debatable in court?

[MrShed]

Jimmy - you arent protected by any scheme. Any further questions, please start your own thread

[balham_tenant]

Hi all

Just an update on my situation. I filed a claim against landlord and have a hearing date at the end of January. I am claiming for 5000 pounds.

Just received today the defendants response. He is claiming now that their never was a lease and that he never received my deposit. I have letter from LA confirming that I did sign a lease and paid the deposit. Seems a strange and foolish tactic to take, for the LL to try and now deny any lease or deposit - what sort of landlord allows a stranger rent his flat for 13 months without a lease or deposit. I dont see how he is going to try and keep this story going at the hearing.

[help me kick his butt]

Sounds good to me, give him enough rope for the judge to hang him. Best of luck xxx

[balham_tenant]

Hi everyone

I have my hearing tomorrow morning. I will give an update tomorrow evening.

 

The Landlord filed a new defence claiming that I was a 'tolerated tresspasser' (who just happened to pay almost 13000 pounds in rent over the course of the tenancy, plus a 1320 pound deposit!). Because I cant produce a signed lease, I may not get the three times the deposit back, but I am hoping for the deposit back, as if he is claiming there was never any lease, then he has no grounds to hold/keep a deposit.

 

Will find out tomorrow I guess...

[misselle]

Have you approached the Letting agent for a copy of the lease that you signed surley they would have to keep a copy?

[help me kick his butt]

Best of luck for tomorrow, will be watching here with interest, try not to worry too much about the lease, , lets hope any judge with common sence will see through this scheming rat xxx

[balham_tenant]

Have you approached the Letting agent for a copy of the lease that you signed surley they would have to keep a copy?

 

Yes - they dont have a copy. I signed two copies, both of which were apparently forwarded to the Landlord for his signature. After moving in I forgot about it after a while as it was a very hectic time. It's something I will never overlook again after this experience - I have learnt a lot.

 

I do have 2 letters from Letting Agent confirming they prepared a lease.

 

Common sense will hopefully prevail.

[misselle]

Ha i very much doubt the law and common sense go in the same sentence, i wish you good luck i will be following this case outcome as i am also due in court for the same reason at the start of feb, landlord witheld the majority of deposit and didnt protect it so we decided court was the ony option after writting to him many times with no avail.

[balham_tenant]

Well the 'hearing' was a little anticlimactic. The judge (who didn't seem to have read any of the information or evidence I submitted) wants to take it to a full trial with a 2 hour hearing, in about 6 weeks time. I will receive more information in the post. I will probably get a solicitor on board now, as it's getting a bit much to handle by myself.

[misselle]

Surely its an open shut case? the deposit wasnt protect the law was broken so it has to be awared 3X the amount?

[balham_tenant]

It probably would if I had a copy of the tenancy agreement.

 

It appears that if a tenant has their copy of the lease lost/stolen/set on fire/eaten by their dog, their rights go out the window.

[misselle]

Surely the onus is on the landlord to prove that he protected the deposit. If you have letters from the letting agent agreeing that you were a legal paying tenant and that you signed an agreement that should count?

 

I never fail to be amazed by the british legal system the law is hardly ever on our side

[balham_tenant]

you would think so. the judge didn't even speak to the landlord. he just asked me where the lease was, i tried to explain, and he just rolled his eyes like i was wasting his time and said he wants a full trial.

[Steve__M]

Chin up!

 

If I recall correctly, it's not the first time this has happened, and in a previous case the tenant went away from the first hearing all disheartened because the judge was extremely negative towards her. In the full hearing, though, she won hands down.

 

Perhaps someone could remember which thread it was?