Fab Haier Washing Machine

[maya222t]

Good on you, Hey remember in the future always put your complaints via a letter and dated (stone hard evidence). You'll be better off with a Bosch they are quiet, wash and spin very well. Also remember to remove the 4 bolts silver and white plastic bolts in the back of the machine.

 

Take Care

[shagnasty]

I used to work at a Comet repair centre and can tell you these Haier machines are crap!, our engineers were having a nightmare trying to keep up with the repairs and much of the problem was getting spares for them too.

[KEEZIE]

Is there anything i can do as i have had the machine a year and 3 months and it has stopped spinning? They want me to pay £30 call out charge and £45 for labour.

 

I have had them out once before Aug 2008 due to the machine moving to much - actually ruined the kitchen floor.

[maya222t]

That Horrid Haier, I got a Boshh now which they replaced an its going great!

 

yes under the sales of goos act 1979 after 6 months the onus of the burden of proof that the machine has a fault is on you....but this can extend to 6 years (which means you have 6 years to complain if there is an inherent fault,so always keep your receipts and bank statements if you paid by card). for example if you brought a pair of flip flops and they broke after 2 months, well you could say it was reasonable time of life for them, but if they snapped after a week in reasonable wear, well no that would not be classed as satisfactory quality, you have the right of a replacement.

 

The proof of burden is on you to verify that there is an inherent fault after 6months. don't worry....so it is not reasonable for a washing machine to break down after 1 year and 3 months.

 

Write to the shop is Comet or email (i emailed) i told them to reply to me within 7 days or i will file for a claim within the small claims court, hence they tried to wriggle out but i got my way.

 

okay as much as possible try to get a resolution such as replacement or repair, but stand your guns for a replacement as they are AWFUL machines. may be harder to get a refund due to the time but not impossible. the reason i say try, because if you do take it to court the judge will look to see if you have been reasonable yourself .

 

don't pay these charges......the onest is on them to sort the fault, remember to tell them it is unreasonable for a washing machine to pack up after this time, the fault was inherent and they have not sold you satisfactory goods! you could buy another washing machine with that money!

 

if i think of anything else i will send through, rushed got to go

 

the floor, civil law if you have evidence can claim for damages...try get stuff on that later..remember they have breached thier contract with you!!!!!!

 

Sales of Goods Act – What you need to Know!

 

As a business, there are laws you need to comply with. Some of the most important, when dealing with the public is the Sale of Goods Act 1979. Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982. Sale and Supply of Goods Act 1994. The Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2002.

The question is, how much do you know, how much do you think you know and how much of it is true?

We’ve put a short document together which you should be able to keep by the till – just in case you need it!

Key Facts:

• Wherever goods are bought they must “conform to contract”. This means they must be as described, fit for purpose and of satisfactory quality (i.e. not inherently faulty at the time of sale).

• Goods are of satisfactory quality if they reach the standard that a reasonable person would regard as satisfactory, taking into account the price and any description.

• Aspects of quality include fitness for purpose, freedom from minor defects, appearance and finish, durability and safety.

• It is the seller, not the manufacturer, who is responsible if goods do not conform to contract.

• If goods do not conform to contract at the time of sale, purchasers can request their money back “within a reasonable time”. (This is not defined and will depend on circumstances)

• For up to six years after purchase (five years from discovery in Scotland) purchasers can demand damages (which a court would equate to the cost of a repair or replacement).

• A purchaser who is a consumer, i.e. is not buying in the course of a business, can alternatively request a repair or replacement.

• If repair and replacement are not possible or too costly, then the consumer can seek a partial refund, if they have had some benefit from the good, or a full refund if the fault/s have meant they have enjoyed no benefit

• In general, the onus is on all purchasers to prove the goods did not conform to contract (e.g. was inherently faulty) and should have reasonably lasted until this point in time (i.e. perishable goods do not last for six years).

• If a consumer chooses to request a repair or replacement, then for the first six months after purchase it will be for the retailer to prove the goods did conform to contract (e.g. were not inherently faulty)

• After six months and until the end of the six years, it is for the consumer to prove the lack of conformity.

Below is the Frequently Asked Questions (FAQs) from BERR.

 

Q1. What is an inherent fault?

A fault present at the time of purchase. Examples are:

• an error in design so that a product is manufactured incorrectly

• an error in manufacturing where a faulty component was inserted.

The “fault” may not become apparent immediately but it was there at the time of sale and so the product was not of satisfactory standard.

Q2. Do I only have rights for 30 (or some other figure) days after purchase?

No. Depending on circumstances, you might be too late to have all your money back after this time, but the trader will still be liable for any breaches of contract, such as the goods being faulty. In fact, the trader could be liable to compensate you for up to six years.

Q3. Are all goods supposed to last six (or five) years?

No, that is the limit for bringing a court case in England and Wales (five years from the time of discovery in Scotland’s case). An item only needs to last as long as it is reasonable to expect it to, taking into account all the factors. An oil filter would usually not last longer than a year but that would not mean it was unsatisfactory.

Q4. I know I can demand my money back within a “reasonable time” but how long is that?

The law does not specify a precise time as it will vary for most sales contracts as all the factors need to be taken into account to be fair to all sides. The pair of everyday shoes may only have a few days before the period expires but a pair of skis, purchased in a Summer Sale, may be allowed a longer period by a court.

Q5. After the “reasonable time” has passed, what can I do?

You may seek damages, which would be the amount of money necessary to have the goods repaired or replaced. Frequently retailers will themselves offer repair or replacement. But, if you are a consumer (not making the purchase in the course of a business) you have the statutory right to seek a repair or replacement as an alternative to seeking damages.

Q6. Is it true that I have to complain to the manufacturer?

No. You bought the goods from the trader, not the manufacturer, and the trader is liable for any breaches of contract (unless he was acting as the manufacturer’s agent).

Q7. Do I have to produce a receipt to claim my rights?

No. In fact the trader doesn’t have to give you a receipt in the first place so it would be unfair to say that you had to produce one. However, it might not be unreasonable for the shop to want some proof of purchase, so look to see if you have a cheque stub, bank statement, credit card slip etc., and this should be sufficient.

Q8. Can I claim a refund on sale items?

It depends on why you want to return them. The Sale of Goods Act still applies, but you are not entitled to a refund if you were told of the faults before purchase, or if the fault should have been obvious to you. Also, you are not entitled to a refund if you simply change your mind about liking the goods.

Q9. Must I accept a credit note instead of a refund?

It depends on why you want to return the goods.

• If you have changed your mind, then the shop doesn’t have to do anything.

• But if the goods are faulty, incorrectly described or not fit for purpose, then you are entitled to your money back (provided you act quickly), and you certainly don’t have to take a credit note

• If you do accept a credit note in these circumstances, watch out, as there may be restrictions on their use.

• If the shop displays a sign stating they only give credit notes instead of refunds, they might be breaking the law and you could report them to Consumer Direct on 08454 04 05 06. Consumers in Northern Ireland should contact Consumer Line on 0845 600 6262.

Q10. What can I do to claim damages or if the retailer will not honour my rights?

The Small Claims Court procedure provides the means to bring a claim, for up to £5000 (in England and Wales), at modest cost and without the need for a solicitor. Your local Citizens Advice Bureau can advise on how to make a claim.

Q11. The retailer has said that a repair is “disproportionately costly” and insists I accept a replacement as an alternative. Must I accept this?

Yes, and vice versa if you request a replacement and this is “disproportionately costly”. However, remember any remedy has to be carried out “without significant inconvenience” and within a “reasonable time” for the consumer. Remember that you could also seek damages instead.

Q12. Neither repair nor replacement of the goods are possible. What can I do?

You may either pursue the old route of damages or a partial or full refund. Probably either would give you exactly the same amount of money. You would seek a full refund in scenarios such as those where you had enjoyed absolutely no benefit from the goods. If you had benefited from them then you would seek a partial refund as a fair remedy. This is exactly the reasoning that would be employed if you sought damages.

Q13. What does the “reversed burden of proof” mean for the consumer?

It means that for the first six months the consumer need not produce any evidence that a product was inherently faulty at the time of sale. If a consumer is seeking any other remedy the burden of proof remains with him/her.

In such a case, the retailer will either accept there was an inherent fault, and will offer a remedy, or he will dispute that it was inherently flawed. If the latter, when he inspects the product to analyse the cause, he may, for example, point out impact damage or stains that would be consistent with it having been mistreated in such a way as to bring about the fault.

This reversal of the usual burden of proof only applies when the consumer is seeking a repair or replacement. After the first six months the onus of proof is again on the consumer.

Q14. Where can I get further advice?

Contact Consumer Direct at: Consumer Direct (Tel: 08454 04 05 06). Consumers in Northern Ireland should contact Consumer Line on 0845 600 6262.

[maya222t]

Dear Sir/Madam,

Sale of Goods Act 1979 (as amended)

 

On 28/04/2008, I bought a Haier washing machine from you for £249.99 which is not of satisfactory quality.

 

The problems are:

 

• The washing machine starts then displays error 7
  
• I am unable to use the washing machine as the unit is not fit for purpose
  
• The machine has already had a repair with this fault in november which has occured again
  

After taking advice from Consumer Direct I wish to claim a replacement or repair at no cost to myself.

S. 14 of the Act (above) requires that goods be of satisfactory quality and, given the make and price, I do not believe that the washing machine meets that description for the above reasons.

 

The appliance has been used and maintained in accordance with the manufacturer's recommendations, and there is no action or inaction on my part that could cause this problem.

 

For the avoidance of doubt, I do not have an extended warranty, nor do I require one, as this is a claim for breach of statutory rights. Further, the manufacturer is not responsible as my contract is with yourselves. I therefore request that you respond to my complaint within 14 days from receipt of this letter. Should I not hear from you by that time, I shall refer the matter to trading standards and, if necessary, commence legal action, but trust that this will not be necessary.

Yours faithfully

[powerful_rogue]

Purchased a Haier in Jan 2008 and had 7 engineers attended to fix a problem which kept accruing. When the fault happened again I managed to get a replacement.

 

The replacement came in June 2008 and is now showing the same fault as my first machine. It does not spin and comes up as unbalanced. Clothes come out soaking wet!

 

Just phoned comet and they said I would have to pay for an engineer. As soon as I mentioned the sales of goods act he said "Im not going to argue about the sales of goods act, i'll get a manager to speak to you " and then put me on hold.

 

He then came back and said he has emailed his supervisior who will call me back shortly to argue. He then quickly corrected himself saying "argue the case in question"

 

Should be an interesting call! I wasnt rude at all to start with, I jus said "under the sales of goods act my contract is with you and not haier" - this was when he tried to palm me off to haier.

 

As the burden of proof is now on me to prove the fault was present when I purchased it, would my last machine having the same fault and the numerous articles on the internet about this machine and fauilt be enough, or would I need to get an engineer out and then claim the fee back?

 

Just waiting for the call now!

[maya222t]

Although the oneness of the burden of proof is on you. Under the Sales of Goods Act it would not be seen as reasonable for a washing Machine that has not been unduly treated to break down after a year and 4 months.

 

Either write to head office as one person has proposed before or write a suitable email intending future action at the small claims court. Or seek advice from 08454 04 05 06 (Consumer Direct). Goodluck you are within your rights.

[powerful_rogue]

Just spoken to the supervision and the head office and they state the only option is to have their enigneer come out in which we have to pay £30. If the problem is then deemed to be an inherent problem then they will refund it.

 

Tbh im not overly happy about this. Id rather them inspect the machine and if its not inherent then we will pay the £30.

 

Even the supervisior said that the PCB on the new batch of machines had been replaced as the old one was casuing this error. We said that we still had the old one and he said even so, the engineer needs to confirm this and that will cost £30.

 

Normally id pay the £30 and claim it back, but at the moment money is so tight we just cant afford the £30 and then wait 2-3 weeks to get it back.

[maya222t]

You really need to seek advice from consumer direct (your local trading standards office on the above number) Citizen advice Bureau.

 

I personally would not pay it, really is a liberty. If you have treated the machine normally during the time you have had it,

 

Durability

 

Durability is another recent addition to the definition of quality. How long should a dishwasher or a vacuum cleaner or a printer last? This is a very common source of complaint and one which manufacturers were always quick to turn back on the consumer, requiring them to provide proof that the item did not conform to contract specification from the start, or implying an element of misuse or neglect. Thanks to the new European Regulations, UK law now offers greater protection for consumers against products which develop faults within the first 6 months. The assumption is now that if it breaks down within this time period it cannot have conformed to the contract specification when purchased and you have the right to an automatic repair or replacement. Having said this, items which should last several years can still break down after this six month period. If the retailer or manufacturer’s warranty has run out, the shop is often quick to say there is nothing they can do before attempting to sell you an extended warranty. This is misleading. If you buy something which should last 7 years but breaks down after a year and a day, you can still claim it was of poor quality in reference to the durability aspect. In this respect it will help to know how long items such as washing machines or printers should last. You can get this information relevant trade association

[powerful_rogue]

Thanks for your reply.

 

I had an independent report carried out on the machine which identified the fault was down to the PCB and was an inherent fault with the machine.

 

I sent a letter to comet along with the report however they have got back in touch today and said they still want to charge for one of their engineers to come out and check the machine.

 

So much for them sticking to the sales of goods act. I proved the fault is inherent by getting an independent report, and they are still ignoring it.

[JonCris]

Did they suggest you get an independent report & if they did tell them to get lost They now not only owe for the cost of that report but also the cost of a replacement fair wear & tear accepted

 

Comet are notorious for this so don't pussy-foot around send an LBL giving them 14 days to sort it before you begin court action. I'm afraid its that only language they know

[powerful_rogue]

I said to them on the phone id rather get an independent report carried out rather then having their in house engineers come and inspect and they said this was fine.

 

Ive sent them an email explaining the situation, sales of goods act etc and advising them I will take legal action.

 

If nothing comes of that, looks like it will be the small claims court.

[JonCris]

OK initially they demanded payment BEFORE inspecting the machine but nevertheless agreed to your independent inspection They cannot now charge you for theirs. They have to either inspect it FOC & then argue as to cause or rectify the fault or if unrepairable replace the machine fair wear & tear accepted

[Conniff]

PR, try not to do anything on the phone, you are helping them with a get out. Email is a legally accepted means as well as post, and any post should be sent using a recorded method.

 

If you must use the phone, make sure you also do it in writing by one of the above as well citing 'further to our phone call of xxxx'.

[JonCris]

I agree with Conniff The CAG golden rule is never ever talk with these people on the phone .... UNLESS you can record the conversation ............Don't & they'll deny everything that suits them

[JonCris]

PS recording is great cos when you or they phone back & deny anything you can then say "do you want to hear the recording" they either hang up or splutter on about their rights not to be recorded. You then point out that only 1 of the parties needs to know the conversation is being recorded for it to be legal

[powerful_rogue]

Thanks for all your replies.

 

This was the email I sent to them via their contact system.

 

To whom it may concern,

 

I wish to make a complaint regarding the service I have received regarding a faulty product.

 

I currently have a Haier washing machine which I have owned for around 16 months. The machine often displays "Unbalanced" at the end of the cycle and clothes come out soaking wet. This is the same fault I previously had with a Haier washing machine that was replaced after seven engineers came out.

 

After numerous calls to your head office regarding this issue, I obtained an independent report highlighting the PCB as being the reason for these errors and that it is an inherent fault with the machine. Also any search on the internet regarding the washing machine will highlight that many many people have experienced the same problem and that Comet had to change the PCB on the washing machines they were selling due to this fault.

 

I sent the report off to yourselves along with a cover letter, however today I have heard back from your investigation team that the service department still wish to charge to inspect the machine and charge for any repairs.

 

Again I would like to highlight what I wrote in the cover letter about the Sales of Goods Act. After six months, the onus is on myself to prove the fault is inherent. This has been done by getting an independent report. The life of a washing machine is expected to be more then 16 months. As I have fulfilled my obligation.

 

I must say I find it disgusting how a company as large as yourselves can show total disregard for the Sales of Goods Act despite customers following it to the letter.

 

I again ask you to consider your decision to charge for an engineer to visit and charge to replace the inherently faulty PCB.

 

If the decision remains the same, Im afraid I will have no choice other then to commence legal action.

 

Regards

 

I really do think their service is disgusting. The onus of proof to prove the fault is inherent is on me. Im not going to pay for a comet engineer to come out as they may have other intentions, and this is what I explained and they agreed to the independent report.

 

My first machine, first make and model had to have 7 engineers out before it was written off with the same fault. It appears since then they have changed the PCB on all these machines to rectify the problem. The internet is littered with people have the same problem with this machine.

 

At the end of the day, its going to cost the same to issue a small claim against them as their engineer inspection costs £30. Hopefully then they might start listening to consumers who have followed the legislation.