Elmo & Lucy v Lloyds again!!

[Elmo South]

I'm not sure how long an individual post can be so this might be in several bits. It is worth reading & I'm not just saying that because I wrote it.

This is the story of a battle with Lloyds TSB via a compalint to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

This all started with my other half getting in to a bit of a mess with borrowing. In order to sort out the immediate problem of repayment, she contacted the CCCS and with their excellent help agreed a repayment plan, paying reduced amounts to everyone. Everyone stopped interest & charges apart from Lloyds TSB in respect of her personal loan.

 

When I was going through her papers, I noticed that every loan with, originally the TSB then Lloyds TSB, had had Payment Protection Insurance added to it.

Furthermore, her borrowing had been regularly refinanced by the bank.

When I started to add up the amounts of PPI premiums & interest I soon relised this had probably caused the majority of her financial problems (Is this starting to sound familiar??????????).

We complained to the Bank that they had lent her excessive amounts of money & that she had been sold excessively expensive PPI which she didn't really understand.

The bank to a long time to look at the complaint & we went through about 18 months exchange of letters before they issued their final decision and basically said - No we haven't done anything wrong at all we're really good people & all our staff do exactly what they should. So that's all right then !!!!!

Having received the Final Decision and being far from happy, we then took the complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

Next post to follow as soon as Ihave a few minutes!

 

Elmo & Lucy

:grin: :grin: :grin:

[noomill060]

still waiting with baited breath...

[RedVixen]

Hi

 

I have just had my full and final where they ignored everything I said so am starting to put together the FOS complaint but I really am not sure if I will be that paitient

 

Where is yourswith the FOS

[alanalana]

Hello Elmo South,

 

I'm not sure how long an individual post can be so this might be in several bits. It is worth reading & I'm not just saying that because I wrote it.

This is the story of a battle with Lloyds TSB via a compalint to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

This all started with my other half getting in to a bit of a mess with borrowing. In order to sort out the immediate problem of repayment, she contacted the CCCS and with their excellent help agreed a repayment plan, paying reduced amounts to everyone. Everyone stopped interest & charges apart from Lloyds TSB in respect of her personal loan.

 

When I was going through her papers, I noticed that every loan with, originally the TSB then Lloyds TSB, had had Payment Protection Insurance added to it.

Furthermore, her borrowing had been regularly refinanced by the bank. ( After a friendly call from your customer advisor offering to help no doubt. Been there got the teeshirt)

When I started to add up the amounts of PPI premiums & interest I soon relised this had probably caused the majority of her financial problems (Is this starting to sound familiar??????????). ( Yes a bit, I will post a link to my thread about 7 Loans 4 with Direct Line Financial Services and 3 with RBS. It is long thread but a lot of info to be used if you need any)

We complained to the Bank that they had lent her excessive amounts of money & that she had been sold excessively expensive PPI which she didn't really understand.

The bank to a long time to look at the complaint & we went through about 18 months exchange of letters before they issued their final decision and basically said - No we haven't done anything wrong at all we're really good people & all our staff do exactly what they should. So that's all right then !!!!! ( got this teeshirt as well)

Having received the Final Decision and being far from happy, we then took the complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

Next post to follow as soon as Ihave a few minutes!

 

 

The FOS take a while but they do work. I submitted complaints when:

 

They failed to comply with SAR. (Currently with adjudicator)

When they made a goodwill gesture (duly refused) (since settled after 30% increase in offer through adjudication)

When they failed to respond to second mis-selling claim within 8 weeks. ( with adjudicator awaiting result )

 

I also complained to ICO, FSA. OFT and the BBA.

 

Please see this nightmare which is gradually getting sorted in my favour.

 

alanalana PPI claim against RBS (looking for some help) please

 

If you can use any of the letters to further complain to ICO, FSA etc Please feel free to use bits as required. I believe the Competition Commissioners Office may well receive your mail too.

 

Good Luck;-)

 

aa

[Elmo South]

Finally got time to write the next installment!!!

 

The compaliant went to the FOS and was spilt in 2 parts by them. 1 in respect of my compliant that they lent excessively & in the most expensive way and 2 for the mis selling of PPI.

 

The first complaint I do not think was dealt with well be the FOS - i proved that by refinancing the borrowing with smaller amounts & riolling over the loans it was an exxpensive way to lend money & was solely to make the bank additional profit. The Ombudsman did not find in my favour as he said the bank did not have a duty to lend in the cheapest way UNLESS Lucy had specifically asked them to. A clear lesson for everyone - ALWAYS ask your bank what the CHEAPEST alternative is .

Despite this adverse decision, Lloyds offered an ex gratia payment bribnging the interest down to equivalent of the cheapest lending option. £620 received.

 

The second part of the complaint went much better. i gave the FOS a full explanation of why I thought the PPI policies had been missold.

In brief this was because a new one had been sold each time the loan was refinanced - there were 9 over a period of 13 years of which 3 had been in the latest 3 years - but when Lucy fell ill & was off work she wasn't aware that she could claim iunder thepolicies. I argued that if the full details had been explained each time she would probably know them better than the bank staff.

The examiner at the FOS accepted this & the bank continually failed to reply to FOS & did not give full information when they did. The examiner finally wrote to the bank fining in our favour. The bank objected to this & asked for an Ombudsman to review the case as the claimed the examiner had exceeded her authority & used the wrong regulations as part of the matter related to a period when they were the Banking Ombudsman not the FOS.

The ombudsman agreed that the wrong regulations had been used; but then using the Banking Regs stated to the bank that they had failed to lend prudently as it was obvious to anyone that Lucy had financial problems as she had to keep re-financing her borrowing on such a regular basis & was actually increasing her debts not reducing them.

The bank didn't like this but had been hoist with their own petard.

The Ombudsman also agreed with me that the PPI had been mis sold. The bank objected on the grounds that Lucy had made a claim on the policy "which proved she needed it". I argued that she did not "need" the policy- as she was on full pay whilst off sick she was no worse of finacially. Her clqaim on thepolicy was on the grounds that she had a "right" to claim not a need. The Ombudsman agreed with me:D.

The Ombudsman's decision was that the PPI premiums & interest should be repaid from the 3rd policy sold onwards. The reason for this was that the first 2 policies could have been correctly sold, but from policy 3 ( the second refinancing), the bank was not lending prudently so fell fould of the BAnking Regs. This covered a period of 10 years.

i objected to the amounts being a stqaright repayment & asked taht the loans be rescheduled using the actual repayment (including PPI premium) but with a reduced balance as the PPI capital amount was removed. The effect of this is to pay off the capital quicker & you actually cut down the interest paid so effectively gain interets at the rate you were paying.

I spent a long time writing Exel spreadsheets for this (I'm not brilliant with Exel) and working out missing information such as interest rates.

My final calculation was sent to the Ombudsman with full explanations. On the morning I sent it , he rang me to tell me the bank had suddenly "found" the missing information I was after. I told him i had caluclated the interest rate from other figure & expaline haw this was done. He was amazed how i had done this & was only 0.1% out on the rate. He wrote to the bank advising that unless they provided an alternative he would accept my calculation.......

[Elmo South]

.............. The bank were, to say the least, not impressed. They described it as " an arbitrary calculation prepared by a third party"; did not provide a calculation of their own & used a typical "lawyer's approach" (apologies to any nice lawyers on our side!!!) to try & rubbish what I'd done rather than providing their own information & calculation. This is a very common approach when the other side haven't actually got anything of substance to argue with.

The ombudsman took a completely different view - I had previosuly told him what my job was -(I'm not going to reveal that here, but suffice to say, I examine a lot of financial records to see if they are correct & people are telling the truth) - He told the bank that my calculation was simple, well presented, easy to follow & accurate. If they had any objection they had to provide their own calculations with supporting evidence, otherwise he would accpet my figures. And the bank did............................NOTHING!!!!.

I spoke to the ombudsman about the harrassment distress all the banks failings & actions had caused. he agreed to award an amount ( not insubstantial) in respect of this.

 

As my calculations shawed that the loan would have been repaid 2 years early once the PPI had been removed from the capital, I charged interest on any overpaymenst at the same rate that loaninterets had been charged by the bank ( What's sauce for the goose..............!!)

 

The overall result?

Overpayments repaid.

Interest paid.

Compensation paid.

Total £18,000!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lucy is now totally debt free as the overpayments easily paid off all her other debts.

 

As the money was refuned to her Lloyds current account, which had been left open for this purpose, she immediately went in to withdraw it.

 

When ithe staff sawe the balance, they were very eager to help her "invest" it..... until they were told where it had come form & reminded of their previous attitudes!!

 

Lucy has left the current account open & in credit. She pays in and takes out a few quid each month. As a result of this Lloyds have recently written offering her an overdraft facility!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

So, for anyone reading this - it is worth complaining. It WILL take a long time; it WILL be stressfull (even i got stressed & it wasn't my money); IT IS WORTH DOING.

 

Luv,

 

Elmo & Lucy