Help! Received Court Claim Form**WON**

[MR2Phil]

Morning,

 

I received a letter today from CL Finance informing me that they had been assigned the debt...the letter was dated 23rd November, which I thought a bit weird, considering I received the notice from the court way before this letter! Its a pretty standard thing by the looks of it, demanding the full amount in 14 days etc.

 

I was thinking...probably around half of this is made up of penalty charges (perhaps less, just a guess). Could I do a counter claim at some stage?

[pt2537]

Hi Phil,

 

can i just confirm something,

 

CL finance are the ones taking you to court yes? can you confirm the date of the summons and also the date on the postage mark from the letter you are quoting

 

if they are not legally assigned the debt im fairly certain they dont have a right of legal action in their own name,assignment is a tricky area but to have the right to sue in your own name the assignment must be carried out prior

[MR2Phil]

Hi Paul,

 

I think (don't have them to hand right now) that the date of issue of the court papers was 26th November. The letter I mentioned above (assignment of debt) does not have a postmark, I've already looked for that. It's just one of those "Business Post" things. It mentions that GE Capital (the store card company) have assigned them the debt and that I should send full payment directly to them to avoid judgement against me.

 

I still don't recall ever having a proper default notice. Would this have come from GE Capital? And what about the fact that the amount they've quoted must contain LOADS of penalty charges?

[pt2537]

Hi phil,

 

well, under the civil procedure rules pre-action protocols there are rules that must be followed, they should have acted reasonably to resolve the issue before commencing proceedings

 

ok, to help me get a grip of whats happened, can you list a brief breakdown as to what has happened in the lead up to court,

 

has there been any letters from anyone threatening court action or informing you that in X days they will commence proceedings ?

 

with regards to the charges, they can be reclaimed for sure

 

and a default notice would have come from GE capital AFIK as CL have only just appeared on the scene

[MR2Phil]

Ok, breakdown...

 

Card was taken out with GE Capital back in 2003 (I think). Never had any trouble with them, always paid off amounts etc. Only really got into trouble around this summer when circumstances meant I moved into a flat on my own and costs rocketed and I got into a situation where I wasn't able to meet payments etc. I tried offering a certain amount but they wouldn't budge. For example, they wanted £120ish but I could really only afford £80, then the next month it was £190 and so on...so I could never meet my arrears. I had numerous letter from GE Capital threatening action etc but I kept trying to make payments where I could so (I thought) they could see I was serious about getting myself out of the mire with them. This was until one day I tried to pay £80, they said the debt had been passed to Viking(???) and that they would be in touch. They wouldn't take my money. Viking NEVER, EVER got in touch, except to write to me to say that the debt had been passed BACK to GE Capital, who then, in turn, informed me that proceedings would start without further notice. A week or so later, the court papers arrive from CL Finance which brings me to this point. As I said, the Notice of Assignment arrived today. They have had the request for information regarding this account, which I sent off last week by Special Delivery.

 

The truly annoying thing about ALL this is that I WANT to pay it off! I am in no way trying to get out of paying it, I just want them to be reasonable! I don't want the CCJ, that's all! Ok, the fact that I can't pay it right now means I have to go down the defending route but if we could come to an agreement then all would be happy. I don't understand why they didn't explore this avenue before slapping this on me

[pt2537]

UNBELIEVABLE PHIL !!!!!!!!

 

they should have acted reasonably in trying to settle this dispute

 

at the end of the day im sure that the judge would view in your favor that you have been trying to resolve this reasonably

 

the thing is that while i accept that you want to pay these fools they have to act within the civil procedure rules and also have to produce the documents requested and the documents must be in the prescribed form etc

 

we can look at the defence and include their unreasonable behavior and the fact that CL have taken legal action without trying to resolve the issue which is viewed as a big no no

[MR2Phil]

Ok, good. Thanks for reassuring me. I don't have any proof that I have tried to be reasonable in my payments though as it was always spoken over the phone, rather than put into writing...I think I am going to phone CL and at least see what they have to say for themselves with regards to coming to an agreement. I would feel a lot better about it but I still want them to knock off the amount created by penalty charges!

[pt2537]

Hi Phil

 

lett us know what they say, especially if they agree to discontinue proceedings as you have a legitimate defence as things stand so bear this in mind. DO NOT under any circumstance accept that they have discontinued proceedings until you receive a notice of discontinuance . these companies dont play by the rules so just remember that

[MR2Phil]

Well...I just wasted 5 minutes of my life and 5 free minutes on my phone bill talking to Howard Cohen who act on behalf of CL. Rather cute sounding girl told me that the only way I could avoid the CCJ was to cough up in full inside three months. This is a glimmer of light as it could give me time but I explained to her that, as a poor teacher on a poor teacher's wage, I couldn't afford over £300 a month for three months. I also explained that if it went to court the judge would only make me pay what I could afford anyway. She paused at this but then carried on saying there was nothing further she could do to help.

 

Still sounded cute though...

 

So I guess I sit tight and wait to see what documents that have on me.

[MR2Phil]

I am just about to submit my AoS and tell them I intend to defend. Can someone please tell me if I need to enter a reason as to why I'm defending? What are my grounds etc?

 

Many thanks

[pt2537]

Nope, thats for the defence its self

 

all you need to do is file an acknowledgment of service stating you are defending all of the claim

[MR2Phil]

Ok, ignore the above...worked out that I can just do the AoS and ask for 28 days instead.

 

I sent off asking for the docs they have on me 28th, they received on 29th (Special Delivery). What happens if they haven't got back to me with anything by the time the 14 days is up? I'm counting 14 working days from 29th which equals 19th December. Is this right or should it be calendar days?

 

EDIT: Whoops! Didn't mean ignore the above as in you, Paul!! lol

[pt2537]

Ok, ignore the above...worked out that I can just do the AoS and ask for 28 days instead.

 

I sent off asking for the docs they have on me 28th, they received on 29th (Special Delivery). What happens if they haven't got back to me with anything by the time the 14 days is up? I'm counting 14 working days from 29th which equals 19th December. Is this right or should it be calendar days?

 

EDIT: Whoops! Didn't mean ignore the above as in you, Paul!! lol

 

No worries Phil,

 

right you have requested the docs and they should be supplied in 14 days under the CPR not working days

 

if they havent got back to you we file a holding defence to say no docs = cant answer the claim

 

thats the gist of it

[MR2Phil]

Ok, cool. Perhaps they were just waiting for me to file an acknowledgement in the hope that I wouldn't and they could save themselves some work. What happens if they comply outside of the 14 days (as I've heard of whilst browsing others' threads in preparation).

 

I've also got a claim against Halifax CC going in a separate thread. Their 14 days is up the day after CL Finance so it makes a nice change to actually hope the post box has something in it when I get home from work rather than slowly opening it hoping for nothingness!!

[pt2537]

Ok, cool. Perhaps they were just waiting for me to file an acknowledgement in the hope that I wouldn't and they could save themselves some work. What happens if they comply outside of the 14 days (as I've heard of whilst browsing others' threads in preparation).

 

I've also got a claim against Halifax CC going in a separate thread. Their 14 days is up the day after CL Finance so it makes a nice change to actually hope the post box has something in it when I get home from work rather than slowly opening it hoping for nothingness!!

 

if they comply we will have to look at what they send

 

however if they don't, we tell the court, they have not disclosed the requested documents therefore you are unable to file a full defence and also we ask for the court to consider throwing out the claim

 

but lets worry about this when or if it happens, as we stand we cant do diddly as we dont know what we are defending

[MR2Phil]

Just to update...Friday 14th is the end of their 14 day period (12+2) and still received nothing, not even something saying thank you for your request and we're preparing the documents or anything. Last time I took this action against a DCA they disappeared and I never heard from them again...although that time I was unwilling to pay, I could not see how they had calculated their figure. This time I AM willing to pay but want them to allow me to come to an agreement. If they were half way sensible that agreement could have been in place by now.

 

Still checking the mailbox when I get home from work through closed fingers!

[MR2Phil]

Hey guys,

 

So their deadline has passed and nothing received. What do I do now? Do I need to inform the court that I've asked for these documents and not received them or do I keep that to myself if and when I need to submit a defence?

 

Cheers

[pt2537]

Hey guys,

 

So their deadline has passed and nothing received. What do I do now? Do I need to inform the court that I've asked for these documents and not received them or do I keep that to myself if and when I need to submit a defence?

 

Cheers

 

 

Save that for your defence,

 

when does the defence need to be in phil? it will probably need to be a paper defence as mine are normally too long for Mcol

[MR2Phil]

I don't know, Paul??? The court received and processed my AoS on 7/12/07. How do I know when the defence should be in by? I've heard nothing. Bit nervous now, don't want to go missing dates etc...

[AndyOrch]

Hi Phil

Should be the 28th Dec but with the xmas hols I would check with the court phone number top right tiny print.

 

Andy

[MR2Phil]

Thanks Andy, I was just ahead of you! Its the 29th. I had horrible visions of me having meant to have done something other than just submit AoS by now! Not a nice Christmas present from our pals at CL Finance, but oh well...at least I have two weeks off to get things together...one bonus of being a teacher! Speaking of which, I can stand in front of a bunch of unruly kids no problem, yet was shaking like a leaf just phoning the court!! What's that all about!?

[pt2537]

Thanks Andy, I was just ahead of you! Its the 29th. I had horrible visions of me having meant to have done something other than just submit AoS by now! Not a nice Christmas present from our pals at CL Finance, but oh well...at least I have two weeks off to get things together...one bonus of being a teacher! Speaking of which, I can stand in front of a bunch of unruly kids no problem, yet was shaking like a leaf just phoning the court!! What's that all about!?

 

Hi Phil

 

im not surprised by that, they say public speaking is the hardest thing to do:) but its nothing when compared to doing anything related to courts when you havent been inside them much.

 

however, in my case a while ago now, i worried like mad in the run up and afterwards it was like " what was all the fuss about"

 

dont panic, their failure to supply the requested documents goes in our favor so not to worry

[MR2Phil]

I've just got this feeling of dread in the pit of my stomach that it'll all show up early next week some time...

 

Public speaking, pah, no problem! Ha ha! Its trying to convince a judge that all I want is time to pay my debt that scares me! Got called in to see my headteacher and been told a job is being created in my department that I should be a shoe in for...could be on an extra £3000 a year by the time we go back in January. That'd be nice!

[pt2537]

 

Phil contrary to popular belief judges are human beings to:)

 

you need to show youve been reasonable and they havent which in this case wont be difficult

 

the judge will look at everything and im sure he will view your actions as reasonable

 

dont worry

 

besides, even if the judge says youve gotta pay from memory you get 30 days to clear the debt before the CCJ is registered so its not all doom and gloom

[AndyOrch]

phil

 

It might not even get to court and if it did its not Crown court its a room with a table and chairs and the D/J does not wear a wig you Know so stop worrying.

 

With regards to the noncomplience you could use the following I have on many occasions an found it effective I know you will declare it in your defence but this brings it to the attention of the Case manager long before the D/J views your Defence and helps highlight their frustrating tactics .Copy to Claiments Sols and it will show you mean buisness.

 

 

Wait until the day specified on the letter (12th Dec). Then send this letter to the court and fax it to the soliciters:

 

 

For the Attention of the Case Manager

 

 

[XXX vs YOU Claim Number

[

 

 

]Dear Sir Or madam

 

RE: FAILURE BY CLAIMANT TO PROVIDE InFormation

]I would like to inform the court of some difficulties that I am experiencing with this claim, which may prevent me filing a fully particularised defence and counter claim to this action, and may consequently frustrate proceedings.

On DATE, I sent the claimant a formal request under the consumer credit agreement, with the £1 statutory fee, for each account. I requested a copy of the credit agreement, a statement of account, and copies of the relevant terms and conditions. I have still not received this information.

 

On Date, I also sent a request under the Civil Procedure Rules, for the claimant to send me information in respect of each account in the claim, that I consider is vital in order to produce a defence and counter claim. I still have not received any acknowledgement of this letter, or any attempt to provide this information

 

I enclose a copy of this letter, and ask that the court consider the matter and take any action it deems appropriate.

 

 

 

Yours Sincerely,

 

(Type, don't sign your name)

 

ENC – letter requesting disclosure

 

 

Edit to suit

 

 

Regards

Andy