How to deal with "goodwill payments"

[photoman]

STARTED A NEW THREAD REGARDS OUR LAST DISCUSSION REGARDS HOW TO DEAL WITH WORKING OUT HOW TO ALLOCATE SUCH PAYMENTS.

 

WOULD A MODERATOR BE SO GOOD AS TO MOVE ANY RELEVANT POSTS FROM THIS THREAD AND GIVE PONDFISH THEIR THREAD BACK !!!!!

 

PONDFISH, IF YOU WISH TO CONTINUE TO FOLLOW THIS DEBATE YOU CAN GO TO THIS LINK AND SUBSCRIBE ONCE IT IS UP AND RUNNING.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/59205-how-deal-goodwill-payments.html#post496416

[bill-k]

Well done, P'M - duly subscribed !

[TANZARELLI]

Duly subscribed too PM.

 

Tanz.

[Pondfish]

Pondfish subscribed thanks Photoman.

[Mindzai]

If it's against an outstanding claim I would suggest it is rejected. You will only have the hassle of adjusting the amounts, and you lose out on interest too.

[Michael Browne]

If it's against an outstanding claim I would suggest it is rejected. You will only have the hassle of adjusting the amounts, and you lose out on interest too.

Agreed, trouble is Lloyds are unilaterally crediting claimants a/c so they don't really have that option.

[Mindzai]

Not unless they have signed for it. If they havent signed anything, and haven't spent the money, they could still send a rejection letter.

[bill-k]

Unless I've got this by the wrong handle, I believe the intention here was to deal with payments which have been made prior to any claim being made to the bank, and the subsequent treatment of such payments in any claims made afterwards. Thanks for looking in Mindzai - Photoman had suggested you might help here, as you have with your spreadsheet. I've not seen exactly what's happening, but Michael here seems to be suggesting that Lloyds are making these payments before any claim has been made - have I got that right, Michael ? Sorry for not checking it out on the Lloyds thread, yet.

 

If that is so, then I don't think we can just make out our claim as if no payment had been received, and then just deduct the payment from the total claim. I agree that this would be OK if the payment was made in response to a claim, but there is - to my mind - an element of genuine goodwill which we must (albeit reluctantly !) acknowledge in our calculation. Particularly so when compound interest is used. We have been discussing this on Pondfish's thread in an "authorised hijacking" - and are hoping that the posts might be transferred here.

 

I have been helping Vamp recently with some spreadies, and one such spready for dealing with this scenario has been submitted to BF, but there is uncertainty about exactly how such payments should be apportioned against a claim. Until such time that the relevant posts are transferred, here is where the "quasi-"thread starts on this issue:-

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/51381-here-we-go.html#post481793

[bill-k]

STARTED A NEW THREAD REGARDS OUR LAST DISCUSSION REGARDS HOW TO DEAL WITH WORKING OUT HOW TO ALLOCATE SUCH PAYMENTS.

 

WOULD A MODERATOR BE SO GOOD AS TO MOVE ANY RELEVANT POSTS FROM THIS THREAD AND GIVE PONDFISH THEIR THREAD BACK !!!!!

 

PONDFISH, IF YOU WISH TO CONTINUE TO FOLLOW THIS DEBATE YOU CAN GO TO THIS LINK AND SUBSCRIBE ONCE IT IS UP AND RUNNING.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/59205-how-deal-goodwill-payments.html#post496416

 

MOd ATTN: Relevant posts to be moved if possible are #16 to #75 !!!

 

Sorry Pondfish - it's more like wholesale thread-theft than hijacking. Thanks for this.

[Michael Browne]

I've not seen exactly what's happening, but Michael here seems to be suggesting that Lloyds are making these payments before any claim has been made - have I got that right, Michael ?

Yes, in response to the LBA, as a GOGW straight into claimants a/c without any agreement, in most cases before a claim has been filed, although in some cases it's received after MCOL

[Mindzai]

Yes before a claim is filed there's not much you can do unfortunately.

[bill-k]

In that case I have been mistaken. I thought this thread was for dealing with payments that have been made before any claim has even been sent to the bank, as I thought that was what had been happening. IMO any part-payment made after the prelim has been received is simply that, and until the rest of the claim is settled, the claim continues with interest being accrued on the whole amount.

 

Also, IMO, the partial or GOGW payment is unsolicited, so does not have any influence on the calculations, save that it has the effect of reducing the amount remaining due to settle the claim. Whether it's been credited directly, sent by cheque or biked over as a suitcase full of used notes makes no difference. It is NOT what was asked for.

 

If a GOGW has been paid without a claim even having been sent to the bank, then THAT is a different scenario, I believe, and requires a more complex calculation. THAT is what I thought this thread was being set up to deal with. So sorry if I got that wrong.

[Mindzai]

...Goodwill payments recieved against outstanding claims...

 

I was under the impression we were specifically discussing GOGW made after a claim was underway in the court, however it doesn't hurt to cover all scenarios.

 

I agree bill that a GOGW should be deducted from the whole sum with no complex calculations necessary (ie, no need to divide the amount by the number of charges, reduce each charge by that amount etc). The only thing that would need to happen imo is the daily rate of interest should be re-calculated.

 

This is only if the claim has not yet reached court though, if it has, I think outright rejection is the best course of action.

[photoman]

My intention when I started this thread, was to deal with a discussion on how to work out how to properly calculate what was outstanding if we recieve partial payments. eg £750 as seems to often happen.

 

eg;

 

1/ Do we simply take it off the whole sum and then continue to calculate interest on the balance.

 

2/ Do we allocate it towards having paid off the earliest interest?

 

3/ Do we allocate it against the latest interest?

 

4/How does the compounding of future interest deal with these?

 

etc

 

I started this, as the discussion seemed to be happening on several threads. Bill-k, Vamp, Mindzai etc, are all currently in discussion as whether this requires a further or modified spreadsheet.

 

Please see the thread here from around post number 29 for a background of the discussion, to get a picture of what we think needs discussing.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/51381-here-we-go-2.html

 

 

COULD A MOD OR SITE HELPER MOVE SOME OF THE RELEVANT POSTS FROM THE ABOVE THREAD TO HERE, (PONDFISH HAS AGREED TO THIS, AS THEIR THREAD WAS GOING OFF TRACK)

[bill-k]

Photoman - I think transferring that discussion to here is good, and J2B is on the case, awaiting Pondfish's OK.,I believe. Mindzai has read your opening post properly - which I did not do !!

 

It is I who is mistaken. But I'm not sure that there is very much to discuss regarding outstanding claims. As I said, I think the claim and the interest calculations continue unaltered until the claim is settled, with the GOGW pmt. being deducted from the final settlement amount, if it has been retained. And, as Mindzai says, interest still accruing daily.

 

Also, as per Mindzai, clear and outright rejection if payment is made after court proceedings have begun, to keep matters clear.

 

I think the only time any other way of dealing with such payments needs considering, is when such payment is made before any claim has been sent to the bank.

 

Sorry, just realised your post was a multiple-choice !!

 

My answer is therefore #1.

[sarah73076]

I've received the goodwill offer of £750 AFTER I sent the claim through. The claim was done through MCOL on 08/01/07 just after midnight, and now I've got a letter dated 11/01/07 with the goodwill offer. Is it fair to assume their offer is in response to my claim, even though the letter doesn't mention the claim at all (it's a very standard form letter)? Then I received the acknowledgment of claim dated 15/01/07 from the court. I know I need to send a rejection of settlement letter, but the template doesn't seem applicable in this case. Is there another template around or do you think this would be okay (also would be copied to lloyds solicitors and the court):

 

BANK NAME

Address

Address

Postcode

Re: Account number XXXXXXXX

 

Response to settlement offer.

 

Dear [named sender or Sirs]

 

Thank you for your letter dated 11/01/07.

We respectfully decline your offer of £750 as full and final settlement.

 

Due to your unsatisfactory response to our first two letters, dated xx/xx/xx and xx/xx/xx, we started a claim against you on 08/01/07. The claim was for the amount taken from our accounts (£1047.50), statutory interest (£156.66 as at 08/01/07), and court fees (£120), totalling £1324.66. Statutory interest continues to accrue at a rate of £0.23 per day.

 

Your solicitors acknowledged our claim on 15/01/07. You have 28 days from the date of service of the claim (13/01/07) to reply to the claim.

 

cc Lloyds Solicitors

County Court Northampton

[bill-k]

Sarah, I presume you had sent the bank a claim prior to your MCOL claim being made ? In which case, I think it can safely be taken that their £750 is in response to that claim made directly to them initially. As such, just reject it and carry on with the MCOL claim. That is my suggestion.

 

Just amend the template letter to suit your circumstances.

[rustyboxx]

Hmmm, this is an interesting debate.

 

I received a letter from Lloyds before I submitted my MCOL claim advising me of the £750 Goodwill Payment. I immediately telephoned them and declined their offer and asked them not to pay it into my account. They chose to ignore this and still paid it in. I submitted my claim and then discovered that the money had been paid into my account on the same day I submitted my MCOL claim. I sent a letter off to Lloyds explaining that I had already declined the offer and that I would only accept on the understanding that it was a part payment only, and that my claim would continue to recover the outstanding monies.

 

I consider that I did all I could to halt the payment and clarify the situation with Lloyds. To date they have not replied to my letter nor have they taken the payment back. Having given them every opportunity to resolve the matter I consider I have acted reasonably and that the £750 should only be deducted from the total court claim and not before.

 

I guess we'll see what happens in a few weeks.

[bill-k]

I completely agree with everything you have done, there, Rusty.

[rustyboxx]

Thanks Bill, that does give me confidence

 

Right, I'm off to do the AQ that I received yesterday, might have a few questions about that but will post in my own thread if I do.

[Mindzai]

Hmmm, this is an interesting debate.

 

I received a letter from Lloyds before I submitted my MCOL claim advising me of the £750 Goodwill Payment. I immediately telephoned them and declined their offer and asked them not to pay it into my account. They chose to ignore this and still paid it in. I submitted my claim and then discovered that the money had been paid into my account on the same day I submitted my MCOL claim. I sent a letter off to Lloyds explaining that I had already declined the offer and that I would only accept on the understanding that it was a part payment only, and that my claim would continue to recover the outstanding monies.

 

I consider that I did all I could to halt the payment and clarify the situation with Lloyds. To date they have not replied to my letter nor have they taken the payment back. Having given them every opportunity to resolve the matter I consider I have acted reasonably and that the £750 should only be deducted from the total court claim and not before.

 

I guess we'll see what happens in a few weeks.

 

I dont see why you even need to deduct it. You should just instruct them to take it out of your account. You told them before it went in that you didn't want it, if they've paid it in unconditionally anyway that's their problem. Just don't spend it.

[TANZARELLI]

My intention when I started this thread, was to deal with a discussion on how to work out how to properly calculate what was outstanding if we recieve partial payments. eg £750 as seems to often happen.

 

eg;

 

1/ Do we simply take it off the whole sum and then continue to calculate interest on the balance.

 

2/ Do we allocate it towards having paid off the earliest interest?

 

3/ Do we allocate it against the latest interest?

 

4/How does the compounding of future interest deal with these?

 

etc

 

I started this, as the discussion seemed to be happening on several threads. Bill-k, Vamp, Mindzai etc, are all currently in discussion as whether this requires a further or modified spreadsheet.

 

Please see the thread here from around post number 29 for a background of the discussion, to get a picture of what we think needs discussing.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/51381-here-we-go-2.html

 

 

COULD A MOD OR SITE HELPER MOVE SOME OF THE RELEVANT POSTS FROM THE ABOVE THREAD TO HERE, (PONDFISH HAS AGREED TO THIS, AS THEIR THREAD WAS GOING OFF TRACK)

 

If you read back it was actually myself and pondfish who started the discussion my friend.

[photoman]

Indeed it was Tanz. I'm not trying to take any credit, I just started up this actual thread and requested the posts to be moved, as I, like many others had got involved in the debate, and poor pondfish' thread had got hijacked.

[TANZARELLI]

Indeed it was Tanz. I'm not trying to take any credit, I just started up this actual thread and requested the posts to be moved, as I, like many others had got involved in the debate, and poor pondfish' thread had got hijacked.

 

Good move. I logged on the other day and saw 16 PM's, they were all admin messages saying post moved. lol

 

I hope pondfish doesn't get lonely now. lol

 

Tanz

[bill-k]

I see Jonni has moved the posts, now, but leaves Photoman's opening post "high & dry" unfortunately. The above couple of posts show how important it is for Mods (and us !!) to get permission. Jonni had to ask me twice about which posts, in case I was messing him about !! He still needed Pondfish's final OK, though. Glad we're all now OK with this, and can continue.