Mbna Nightmare!!!!

[Cornucopia]

I think we ought to start a new thread "shout here if you have sent MBNA a S85 letter"! Battleaxe has a teleconference with dear old Bill Thurs. pm. - so awaiting outcome of that.

 

What a great idea! I haven't yet sent them a S85 Default, I have merely mentioned it and provided them an attachment with the wording. However, this will be forthcoming if they don't pull their fingers out.

 

I am very excited about Thursday, it will be very interesting to see what happens next. The words "open", "can" and "worms" spring to mind!

[ladybird17]

There's a sort of "division" of opinion on the S85 (friendly division I hasten to add!) some are saying that because S85 has been breached the bank (or whoever) are AUTOMATICALLY in default so you don't need need to issue them with default notice. Some are going down the issuing track. Same results -different routes!

[Cornucopia]

sorry Cornucopia - didn't answer you properly! Think it's been established on here - mean on another thread - that application is NOT credit agreement. A credit agreement, under the CCA, has to include certain terms of reference and these do not appear on applications.

 

 

Thank you Ladybird! Just as I thought........Seniorservice, have you see this post??!! Don't let them mess you about anymore, finish them off! Could you give me a link to your thread please? Thank you!

[ladybird17]

Cornucopia - are you asking me or Senior Service for link to thread?

[Cornucopia]

Cornucopia - are you asking me or Senior Service for link to thread?

 

Sorry Ladybird, I meant Seniorservice. It would be a good idea for him/her to start a thread regarding this and their own situation. I mean to have to wait since November for a CCA request, that is outrageous! They are SO in breach and well past the 30 days, it is, in my opinion, a criminal offence and I would throw the book at them!!!

[ladybird17]

yup, the more threads the better!

[Cornucopia]

There's a sort of "division" of opinion on the S85 (friendly division I hasten to add!) some are saying that because S85 has been breached the bank (or whoever) are AUTOMATICALLY in default so you don't need need to issue them with default notice. Some are going down the issuing track. Same results -different routes!

 

Gosh, it's like instant messaging on here!!!

 

Has anybody actually had a result from issuing an S85 default? I only ask because I only found out about this when I first got in touch with Stansfield and JonCris. As I am currently going down the road of breach of CCA, I am keeping my S85 default back for now.

 

Would be interested to hear any stories!

[ladybird17]

Can't answer categorically on that one - most of the people on Consumer Credit Act thread who have done S85's have only done them recently, so nothing on those yet. Although someone did come on this morning and ask why more people doing S85 claims - I posted back to ask if he had done so and what was result, but haven't heard anything back yet.

[seniorservice]

Thanks again Cornucopia - have had a look round and this has been dealt with before here http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-consumer-issues/8483-debt-collection-agency-charges.html and expert opinion from seminole seems to indicate that this is all rubbish. I wonder why MBNA would try and use this as some sort of excuse - the requirements of S78 are clear enough - do you know if there is some sort of standard letter that anyone else has had results with denying the debt as a result of non-compliance.

[Cornucopia]

Can't answer categorically on that one - most of the people on Consumer Credit Act thread who have done S85's have only done them recently, so nothing on those yet. Although someone did come on this morning and ask why more people doing S85 claims - I posted back to ask if he had done so and what was result, but haven't heard anything back yet.

 

Sorry for delay Ladybird, school run!

 

It will be interesting to see, they should start showing results soon, I hope. Again, I think we will have more of an idea by Thursday with Battleaxe. You do wonder if it is somehow too good to be true that everybody's debt could be wiped out because of the ineptitude of the banks. How wonderful that would be. I just get so annoyed, you borrow some money and then pay it back many many times over because of rip off interest rates and they are still coming after you for more. I think I mentioned in one of my earlier posts how much my husband has paid back to MBNA just in the time we have been a couple, let alone the four years before that that he had the card. I think he has probably, in total, paid back the sum nearly four times but is still at square one. It really is shocking.

[Cornucopia]

Thanks again Cornucopia - have had a look round and this has been dealt with before here http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-consumer-issues/8483-debt-collection-agency-charges.html and expert opinion from seminole seems to indicate that this is all rubbish. I wonder why MBNA would try and use this as some sort of excuse - the requirements of S78 are clear enough - do you know if there is some sort of standard letter that anyone else has had results with denying the debt as a result of non-compliance.

 

Interesting thread, but how frustrating, no actual detail on how it ended up! I thought it was odd that they had agreed not to pursue the debt and then she came back and said they'd sent an unsigned agreement and then started threatening legal action! More to that than meets the eye I think! However, Seminole's advice is extremely useful and worthy of later referral!

 

Have you had a look in the templates library regarding this? Otherwise, I hope Stansfield will come on later and have a look, she will know the answer to that. If I can find out, I'll get back to you! I really think it is time you took action, it is shocking!

[Cornucopia]

What is my thread doing all the way down there? How RUDE!

[Cornucopia]

 

As Arrow & Eversheds are now in breach of the CCA, should I write to them now (the official letter) or should I wait until the 30 days are up and they have committed a criminal offence? Or should I wait to see what response I get from MBNA/Bill Wareing?

 

Hi guys, I think this post went unnoticed, could anybody give me an idea of what I should do about this?

 

I am slightly concerned as Gavin Theobald told me that Arrow Global were willing to accept our offer of £120.00 per month. However, as Arrow and Eversheds are in breach of my CCA request, I understand that until that is resolved, no payments should be forthcoming. I have obviously said this to Bill in my letter to him. I feel I should write an official letter solely regarding the CCA to Arrow and Eversheds. Any advice anybody?

 

Thanks!

[stan5131]

Corn. I would leave Eversheds out of the equasion for now.... as they are merely acting on behalf of Arrow. Wait the full 30 days until they have committed a criminal offence. We will put a letter together then.

 

As regards, Seniorservice, have you made a complaint to Trading Standards and OFT? This should be your next route.

[stan5131]

Without Prejudice

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam

Further to you/my letter dated xxx

 

By not providing me with copies of certified true copies of the disputed credit agreements and statements for each account, your company has now failed to meet it's obligations under the legislation contained within section 77 (1) and section 78 (1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

77 Duty to give information to debtor under fixed-sum agreement

 

(4) If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1) -

a) he is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement and -

b) if the default continues for one month he commits an offence.

 

78 Duty to give information to debtor under running-account credit agreement

a) state of account, and

b) the amount, if any, currently payable under the agreement by the debtor to the creditor

 

(6) If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1) -

a) he is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement and -

b) if the default continues for one month he commits an offence.

 

I understand by failing to provide me with the documentation, I requested your company has committed a criminal act. I am now of the opinion that you are unfit to hold a Consumer Credit Licence as determined by the fitness test outlined in the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (section 25).

 

25 Licence to be a fit person

(2) a) contravened any provision made by or under this Act, or by or under other enactment regulating the provision of credit to individuals or other transactions with individuals.

d) engaged in business practices appearing to the Director to be deceitful or oppressive, or otherwise unfair or improper (whether lawful or not)

 

As you are aware, a credit agreement that is not properly documented and signed by the customer is totally unenforceable under the Credit Consumer Act 1974 and therefore is a complete defence to any court claim that is issued.

 

Please note, I do not acknowledge any debt to XXX

 

I must insist upon the removal of any defaults entered against my name. You have 7 days to comply and confirm in writing or I will apply to my local Sheriff Court for an order to enforce compliance, together with damages at the discretion of the court. I will then be forced to make the relevant authorities, including but not limited to Trading Standards, The Office of Fair Trading, The Information Commissioners Office, The Financial Ombudsman and The Financial Services Authority aware that you have committed a criminal act.

 

I look forward to your quick response to my correspondence.

 

Yours sincerely

[Cornucopia]

 

Hi Stan, you're a star, thank you for that! I take it I should forward that to Arrow straight away?

 

Should I copy Bill in on it?

 

Do I want to put "Without Prej", I only ask because this means they cannot submit it in Court, but surely I want them to do that, or don't I???!!

 

I did write a very rude letter to Eversheds and posted it yesterday.

 

Also, I read somewhere yesterday that the Court can overturn the CCA breach and enforce the debt anyway. Have I misunderstood this?

 

Hope all OK with you! xxx:)

[seniorservice]

Thanks from me to Stan too. What was your opinion on using the Copies of Documents regulations to evade a CCA request? My complaint to the OFT didn't really get anywhere but Trading Standards are much more positive and are dealing with it at the moment.

[stan5131]

Sorry for late replies folks. I have been busy all day working out bank charges and interest for someone else. Just finished that and the spreadsheet.... £9,300 in total but has taken me all day nearly.

 

Anyway, Corn, a CCA breach can be overturned by a court if the documents are found. However, once the 42 days have passed and they have committed a criminal offence, it is unlikely they will want to face a judge in court and explain why they have committed a criminal offence!

 

You can send the CCA default letter now or wait until whole 42 days have passed. Personally, I would prefer the latter. It will have more impact once they have actually committed an offence. Its up to you really. And yes, copy Bill in on it when you do send it.

 

Seniorservice. They are treading water. Follow through with your complaint. No Agreement, no debt.

[Cornucopia]

Sorry for late replies folks. I have been busy all day working out bank charges and interest for someone else. Just finished that and the spreadsheet.... £9,300 in total but has taken me all day nearly.

 

Anyway, Corn, a CCA breach can be overturned by a court if the documents are found. However, once the 42 days have passed and they have committed a criminal offence, it is unlikely they will want to face a judge in court and explain why they have committed a criminal offence!

 

You can send the CCA default letter now or wait until whole 42 days have passed. Personally, I would prefer the latter. It will have more impact once they have actually committed an offence. Its up to you really. And yes, copy Bill in on it when you do send it.

 

Seniorservice. They are treading water. Follow through with your complaint. No Agreement, no debt.

 

Good God Stan! £9,300! You poor girl, you must be knackered!

 

Right, will leave it for now and wait til the 42 days are up. I am worried about not starting the payments though, especially since Eversheds evil letter last Monday saying that they are starting action without further notice. Hilarious really, given that I have a letter from MBNA stating that it was basically all sorted out with Arrow! Maybe I should just let Eversheds start the action and see what happens, they will still have to explain themselves (or their Client) in Court. As you know, I have made it clear to Bill that the arrangement can continue once the CCA has been fulfilled. Maybe it is time to just sit and wait and see what happens next!

 

Stomach in knots!!!

 

xx

[stan5131]

Is there a phone number on Evershed's letter? If so, why not ring the author and ask if they are purposely ignoring communication or just incompetent!

[Cornucopia]

Is there a phone number on Evershed's letter? If so, why not ring the author and ask if they are purposely ignoring communication or just incompetent!

 

Do you know what Stan, I think I will. Mind you, they probably won't talk to me as this is Mr Corn's account and not mine. Perhaps I will get him to ring them and give them permission to speak to me.

 

I don't know if there is anything in the post this morning as it hadn't arrived when I left. We'll see.

[stan5131]

Have a letter ready and signed from your husband. Say you have his authorisation and can fax it straight over so they can discuss the account with you. Even funnier, say you are him and are insulted they are trying to insinuate you are a woman!!!! lol (just kidding) x

[Cornucopia]

Have a letter ready and signed from your husband. Say you have his authorisation and can fax it straight over so they can discuss the account with you. Even funnier, say you are him and are insulted they are trying to insinuate you are a woman!!!! lol (just kidding) x

 

Ha ha!!!! Alternatively, I could have a bottle of wine first, keep them on the phone for about 2 hours, rambling non-stop about anything and everything and hopefully they will spontaneously combust!! :grin:

[stan5131]

pmsl..... I can vouch for that one! lol

[Cornucopia]

pmsl..... I can vouch for that one! lol

 

Oh stop it!!! I am STILL embarassed about that one!!!! The words talk, hind, leg and donkey spring to mind!!!! LOL!!

 

Sorry!