Directions Hearing Leeds

[zebbydog]

Thereare now 64 caes on the list 11 of which have been settled

[JonCris]

Bloody hell! He's considering Group litigation. That should scare the hell out of the banks.

[androobe]

I've now got 2 cases against First Direct on the list! Don't know if I'll even bother rejecting their last offers as my previous letter made it very clear I would not accept any offer of less than the full amount - see if they actually turn up at court! Looking at the list of 61 cases I have, there are no other First Direct or HSBC cases not settled so as it stands they would be attending just to defend my relatively small claims!

[j.barton1]

Hi, My letter also mentions about group litigation. How does this effect us?

 

Thanks

Jenny

[CrispDust]

Nothing in my letter.

Getting a bit p**sed at Courts messing us around like this. They really should keep ua ALL better informed.

CMC being done tomorrow.

[JonCris]

Jenny

 

A Group Litigation Order can be made in any Claim where there are multiple parties or Claimants to the same cause of action. The Order will provide for the case management of claims which give rise to common or related issues of fact or law. These will be specified in the Order as the GLO Issues. The Law Society may be able to assist in putting the applicant in touch with other parties who may also be interested in applying for a Group Litigation Order in their case. When an Order has been made a Group Register will be set up and maintained in the Management Court, of all the parties to the group of claims being managed. A Group Litigation Order will normally be publicised through the Law Society

[j.barton1]

Hi

Just want to double check my figures....when we claim the interest, do we claim back to the date of the first charge? I want to make sure i have accurate upto date figures...just incase.

 

Jenny

[JonCris]

Yes Jenny.

 

You should claim back the interest they charged you at the outset as it's part of the unlawful penalty.....then you claim compounded contractual interest based on their rates from the time you paid the charge

[caro]

Just in case further clarification is needed, you claim from the date of each individual charge up until the date of settlement or judgment.

[j.barton1]

Hi, I've worked it out from the 1st charge date to today as one complete i.e 2409 days @ 39p per day....is this wrong OMG....

Jenny:confused:

[androobe]

Yes it is wrong I'm afraid (would be nice if it wasn't!)... you can only claim interest from the date of each charge. So if they first charge was 2409 days ago, you can claim 2409 days interest ON THAT CHARGE. If the next charge was say 2000 days ago, you can claim 2000 days on that charge etc etc... if your most recent charge was only 90 days ago, you can only claim 90 days interest on that one. Make sense?

[j.barton1]

Hi, Lets see if this is right.....

If we are claiming interest PER charge? 1st charge 2409day @39ppday =£939.51.....2nd charge eg 2000days @39ppday=X ....3rd charge 1900days @39ppd........am i way of the track here but does this mean we claim the interest on every charge to todays date from the charge date?

If this is right were quids in:eek: if i am wrong please tell me!!!!

 

Jenny

[zebbydog]

I think the daily charge relates to the daily rate of interest to be added from the day your claim was served to the day it is settled.

Here is an example from the simple charges sreadsheet for a £10 charge way back when.

£10.00 31/3/2001 1,393days £3.06p interest

 

 

This gives the figure for 1,393 days on a £10 charge at 8%

[Glenn UK]

I've now got 2 cases against First Direct on the list! Don't know if I'll even bother rejecting their last offers as my previous letter made it very clear I would not accept any offer of less than the full amount - see if they actually turn up at court! Looking at the list of 61 cases I have, there are no other First Direct or HSBC cases not settled so as it stands they would be attending just to defend my relatively small claims!

 

I think you need to be careful about not rejecting their offer, i believe, and it would be good if anyone could confirm/correct my thought, that if they make an offer they usually specify a timeframe, if you dont respond then they can assume you have accepted the offer.

 

Accordingly they can inform the courts you have settled.

 

Glenn

[JonCris]

zebby write back & refer to your previous rejection saying it remains the same.

 

As Glenn says don't NOT answer

[Glenn UK]

Jon

 

Your pm box is full i have something you might be interested in.

 

Glenn

[JonCris]

Glenn box now scattered to the four winds......... PM again please

[CrispDust]

j bart , I think your figures are wrong. Where do you get 39p as a daily interest amount?

OK here we go again,

£30 unlawful charge on say 1/1/2001.

APR on that account for overdraft say 15%.

Total interest on £30 charge from 1/1/2001 to 31/12/2001 - £4.50

Daily rate = £4.50/365 = 1.2p

So 1/1/2001 to 21/1/2007 = (6x365 +21) x1.2p = £27.25 interest.

HOWEVER, this is simple contractual interest. Compounded contractual interet adds more on but is far more complicated to calculate!

ie

£30 on 1/1/2001. Interest 1/1-31/12/2001 -£4.50

now becomes £34.50 for next year

Interest for 1/1/2002 - 31/12/2002 - £5.17

now becomes £39.67 for next year

interest for 1/1/2003 -31/12/2003 - £5.95

now becomes £45.62 for next year

interest for 1/1/2004-31/12-2004 - £6.84

now becomes £52.47 for next year

interest for /1/2005-31/12/2005 - £7.87

now becomes £60.34 for next year

interest for 1/1/2006-31/12/2006 - £9.05

Total interest £39.39!!

I've only ever claimed simple contractual as I just could not be bothered to produce the necessary spreadsheet.

I didn't even claim contractual interest from Barclays. I submitted my claim SOOO long ago I wasn't aware of it then!

[j.barton1]

OMG just when i thought i was on the right track....these are my calcs...

 

I thought it was total amount in chgs x 0.00022=daily charge which is where my 39p comes from.

I know this has been answered time and time and time again but for totally unmathematic people like me who couldnt even figure vamps spreadsheets!!!could someone point be in the right direction.

Jenny:idea:

[Glenn UK]

FWIW

 

You cannot use the term 'contractual interest' unless you apply the interest in the same way as the contract does, i.e. you use the rate and method of application.

 

So, contractual interest never returns a figure per day since the amount will change every day, the change may be small to start with but will become more significant as the age of the charge increases.

 

So you need to express the increase in claim value as a percentage to day which will be a function of the contractual rate used, for example i claimed Abbeys Unauthorised OD rate of 28.7%, this returned a daily rate of 0.07% (or thereabouts).

 

Something else which i think is important to understand is that compounding interest by the banks/cc companies is done on a daily basis i believe, this means that the amounts you claim are different to applying a monthly or annual compounding period. Although i have heard people argue that monthly is arguably sufficient, doing it annually definitely isn't right IMHO.

 

If you're having trouble with the spreadsheet jenny, its probably because your thinking too hard.

 

I would suggest using MINDZAI's sheet, simply because thats the one i did. All you do is fill in the front sheet with your bank details, start date etc and then enter the charges along with the date they were applied.

 

Same for interested in the columns next to the charges.

 

The spreadsheet works out all the interest you are claiming and the daily rate and adds everything up.

 

HTH

 

Glenn

 

PS in case anyone is wondering i don't have anything against Vampiress sheets, i have just never used them, i am sure they are fine.

[j.barton1]

Hi, Sorry for appearing dumb...honestly i didnt think i was till now!!! I have tried vamps and mindzais. Mindzais wouldnt load correctly and i entered all the details in vamps...then it asked for.....

#VALUE! Not a number: multiple points.....

I have noooooooooo idea what to do, Is there anyone who can help, sorry

Jenny

[CrispDust]

Jenny, if i get time i will try to get a spreadsheet done and email it to you. PM me your e mail addy. Unfortunately also doing my tax return at moment!! NOT something you want to get wrong!! If you thought banks were heartless b*$%ards, then try the Inland Revenue!!

Glenn I only gave yearly compund as an example. The end result is the same if you use the APR or AER, thats the whole point of that rate - it shows the equivalent interest rate per year, wether daily, monthly or annually.

However the frequency of interest obviousley dependes on the account T&C.

[Glenn UK]

Crisp

 

Unless you do somehting with the interest rate you select then it will return differing values for differing compounding periods or at least Mindzais spreadhseet does.

 

Its simple to explain, take £100 and apply a rate of 10%.

 

Compound the interest on an annual basis and the final vaule would be £110.00.

 

Take the same value and apply the 10% and compound daily returns £110.36, monthly returns £110.91.

 

The difference is small as i said and the older the charge the bigger the difference becomes.

 

When applied to a series of charges and interest paid the difference could be signficant I suppose, its more to do with the fact that if challenged you have to try to mimc the way the interest is charged by the banks.

 

HTH

 

Glenn

[JulesTools]

Hi All ,

Just to let you all know my case numbers on the list are

6LS40677 - SIDDLE vs YORKSHIRE BANK

 

6LS40668 - SIDDLE vs YORKSHIRE BANK

 

I have had offers on both accounts of : Charges + costs + 8% interest to date of claim(not date of settlement/judgement)

 

So I have refused the offers until they are willing to pay the 8% up until date of settlement/judgement.

 

I for one would love to see my cases go into the court room for judgement but unfortunately we all know they wont.

 

Will keep everyone updated and here is the link to my thread

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/yorkshire-bank-clydesdale-bank/26725-jules-yorkshire-bank-well.html

 

 

Also seeing as everyone here will be local , and I know its short notice , but if you hadn`t already seen it in the Bear Garden we are having a CAG meet in Wakefield Friday 26th January

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bear-garden/50525-yorkshire-cag-meet-26th.html

 

Its an open invite and everyone is welcome.

 

Jules

 

 

 

[CrispDust]

Glenn sorry to disagree and agree.

APR/AER rate is a way of calculating the total interest applied to an account annually, whether daily compund, monthl or simple.

Its supposed to make it easy for us, the great unwashed, to compare interest rates easily. (when did banks ever make anything easy except ripping us off)

So 10% APR is 10% at the end of 12 months irrespective of how it was applied.

This makes it easy with credit cards, which show and APR and a monthly interest rate.

Its a little more tricky with bank accounts since they usually ue a flat rate and you can never be quite sure how and when they apply/compund interest, I believe this is another rea where they rip their clients off, sinc eit is VERY difficult to check.

i agree that you have to apply a similar methodology.

Perhaps part of any disclosure request should be the exact method, with workings about how interest is applied to an account?