HMRC want paying for WTC joint claim - my wife forged my sig?

[chiefmegawatty]

Can HMRC legally accuse a man of making a joint claim with his wife for working tax credit if he has never filled out his part of the application form and never signed it?

[blondebubbles]

If the man never signed it then I assume you are saying that the wife forged the signature?

 

Even if that was the case, if the wife was wanting to claim tax credits they would need to declare the husband.

 

Can you be more specific about why you are asking the question?

[chiefmegawatty]

Hello Blondbubbles, yes you are correct, my wife forged my signatue without my knowledge.

Just after my wife left me the HMRC said that I had to repay half of the over payments because it was a joint claim. HMRC sent me a copy of the original claim form which clearly showed by signature as forged. Anyway, HMRC said that I had to pay my half of the over payments because I was living here despite my signature being obviously forged.

I therefore assume you can be chased for money even if the creditor knows that your signature was forged. This also proves that a genuine signature is worth no more than a forged signature under British law.

[blondebubbles]

So you were not aware she was receiving these payments?

 

Were they paid to her own account rather than a joint one?

 

What was the reason for the overpayment?

 

Have you disputed the overpayment?

[chiefmegawatty]

I was aware that she was claiming WTC but I knew nothing of the process involved in applying for it.

 

All payments must have gone into her own bank account as we had separate accounts with different banks.

 

I later discovered that the overpayments came about because my wife didn't inform HMRC when I found temporary employment.

 

I have disputed the overpayment on the grounds that I have never filled out an application form.

 

 

HMRC didn't accept this and insisted that I was liable for half of the overpayment.

[blondebubbles]

Your next step then would be to speak to someone for example citizens advice or civil legal advice

[chiefmegawatty]

I did take professional advice

 

 

was advised to report my wife to the Police fraud investigation unit.

 

 

I did exactly that

 

 

I am now waiting for them to contact me.

 

 

I have a copy of the application form my wife filled out in 2006 which clearly shows my forged signature in my wife's hand writing.

[chiefmegawatty]

OK so does anybody know if am legally liable for repayment of an overpayment when the application form for a joint claim was signed with a forged signature without my knowledge?

[chiefmegawatty]

OK, no replies. I therfore assume based on HMRC rules that anybody can be charged for anything that requires a signature despite never signing anything. This also implies that a genuine signature is worth nothing. I am confused.

[chiefmegawatty]

I received a nasty threatening letter today from HMRC demanding money for a working tax credit over payment.

 

This is the third time HMRC have asked me to pay back an over payment

despite me paying it back over two years ago in cash.

 

Also to make things worse,

I have never claimed or applied for working tax credit. Confused? yes so am I.

 

I paid HMRC over two years ago for something I have never claimed just to get them off my back.

Now they want me to pay it again !

 

I am looking forward to appearing in court.

 

The county court judge will ask me if I have anything to say before he passes sentence.

 

I will say "I've already paid the debt I didn't actually owe and here is my receipt of payment from HMRC.

The court case will be very interesting indeed.

[blondebubbles]

Did you report to HMRC and the police that someone has used your identity fraudulently?

[chiefmegawatty]

Yes I told the HMRC that my identity had been used fraudulently and also reported it to the Police through

Action Fraud 21 months ago.

I haven't heard anything from Action Fraud since I reported it.

[BazzaS]

 

The county court judge will ask me if I have anything to say before he passes sentence..

 

Colour me impressed.

 

I've seen judgements from County Courts (who deal with civil cases)

I've seen sentences passed by Magistrates and Crown Courts, dealing with criminal cases.

 

"Sentence passed" by a County Court? : your previous threads have shown you to be special, and this reinforces that!.

[chiefmegawatty]

OK I shouldn't have used the word "sentence". However I consider a court judgement passed for a debt that was paid in full over two years ago to be a nasty and unjust version of a sentence.

A CCJ exists on your record for six years even if you have paid it back.

A satisfied CCJ still considers you as untrustworthy financial **** for six years.

Your personal insult against me suggests that you have completely missed the point of this forum.

Your post enforces that view.

[BazzaS]

OK I shouldn't have used the word "sentence". However I consider a court judgement passed for a debt that was paid in full over two years ago to be a nasty and unjust version of a sentence.

A CCJ exists on your record for six years even if you have paid it back.

A satisfied CCJ still considers you as untrustworthy financial **** for six years.

Your personal insult against me suggests that you have completely missed the point of this forum.

Your post enforces that view.

 

What personal insult?

That you are special (because no one else gets a sentence in County Court?). That would indeed be something special, so how is that an insult?

 

That you would demolish your own house to avoid paying a debt : pretty special (as not many people would consider that).

That you would consider your property suddenly worthless because of a Family Law Act restriction placed on it by a spouse? : ditto.

 

With your County Court "sentence" exaggeration : taken with the above - would you prefer it if I instead suggested "not that special, just prone to exaggeration / 'drama llama-matosis' ", such as labelling people with satisfied CCJ's as

untrustworthy financial ****

 

Edited to add (now thread has been merged with your previous thread on the same subject)

 

This also implies that a genuine signature is worth nothing.

 

So, no drama / exaggeration, then!.

[honeybee13]

Chief, are you able to prove that you paid the money to HMRC?

 

HB

[honeybee13]

Me again.

 

Are we talking about your previous thread, chief?

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?421865-Working-tax-credit-joint-claim

 

HB

[dx100uk]

threads merged

 

 

have you ever sent them an sar?

 

 

dx

[blondebubbles]

Thanks for merging threads. Hadn't realised it was the same one as I'd previously commented on.

[dx100uk]

hay no sweat helps us too.

 

 

dx

[Conniff]

threads merged

 

 

have you ever sent them an sar?

 

 

dx

 

Need some answers if you want help chiefmegawatty.

[chiefmegawatty]

I recently discovered this: http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/+/http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/ntcmanual/applica_capture/ntc0070430.htm

 

I assume that proves that HMRC should have not told me that I am liable for a joint claim.

HMRC were therefore telling lies when the told me that my signature wasn't required to be held

responsible for a joint claim.

I want the money I paid to HMRC back.

HMRC seem to be just as corrupt as false claiments who forge signatures.

I am not a happy chappie.

[ericsbrother]

It means there has been no criminality on your part but I'm not sure that this equals the right to reclaim the money that was duly paid. If your wife has been prosecuted then it would be a simple matter

[chiefmegawatty]

Thanks for your posting ericsbrother.

 

 

I think you are probably right.

 

 

However, 18 months ago I reported this issue to Action Fraud.

They gave me a case number and said they would be in touch.

I have heard nothing from them since.

 

 

I recently emailed them asking why nothing had happened.

I am awaiting their reply.

 

 

Maybe I should have never paid HMRC and just let them take me to court.

 

I would have brought my copy of the WTC application form to court with the obviously forged signature.

 

Today I contacted HMRC and explained how I was unhappy with the situation.

They are sending me a form to dispute the case.

They also told me to mention the HMRC website link that states that both claiments must sign the form for the application to be valid as a joint claim.

 

I am hoping that Action Fraud will soon take up the case,

prosecute my wife then inform HMRC of the prosecution so that I can get my money back.

[ericsbrother]

action fraud will do nothing, they just collate things and publish statistical data. Your battle with HMRC will have to go on without their help. Best of luck, your hope will lie with where the money went, if it wnet into your wife's account then you may be able to argue there was no benefit to you and the repayment is "betterment" for HMRC and therefore illegal for them to keep the money you paid.