Hello - mis sold pension Question

[zama]

Hello everyone. (I am a newbie)

 

I am trying to take up a complaint of the Mis-selling of a pension.

 

I have all the details of the pension, date sold, policy no, value etc and also the company who sold me the pension.

 

I am not sure if I am allowed to mention the companies by name, don't want to get into trouble with my first post

 

On the 22.10.2013, I phoned the company who sold me the pension and they advised me to send an email, to which I did on the same day. I never received any confirmation of my email, and nobody contacted me.

 

On the 29.10.2013, I phoned the company again and was informed he couldn't understand why nobody was dealing with the complaint and as advised to send the email again with "for the attention of Mr.(the chap I was speaking to), to which I did on the same day, again I never received any confirmation of my email, and nobody contacted me.

 

On the 07.11.2013, I phoned the company yet again and talked to a different employee and she couldn't find the emails I had sent, even though the first employee I had spoken to, had seen the first email I had sent, she advised me to send the email yet again, this time I made the email high priority and asked for a return receipt, I sent the email on the same day, again I never received any confirmation of my email, and nobody contacted me.

 

I have to be honest and say they were very patient and helpful on the phone, and I am very surprised that nobody contacted me.

 

I don't hold up much hope of getting a good result with the mis-sold pension anyway as we are going back to 1990, but I would at least like to get information from the company and then I could consider whether I would pursue this matter.

 

What advice would you give, should I phone them yet again or should I send a registered letter, or something else.

 

Thank You

 

Wayne

Edited November 11, 2013 by honeybee13
Increasing font size and formatting.

[AndyOrch]

Hi zama and a warm welcome to CAG

 

I have relocated your post to the appropriate forum.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[honeybee13]

Hello there.

 

I think you should stop dealing by phone and as emails don't seem to work, send a good old-fashioned letter. Have you spoken with the Compliance department of this company? This is who I think would normally deal with complaints.

 

I don't think we need to know the name of the company as yet, but is it a broker or an insurance company please?

 

My best, HB

[zama]

hi, thank you for helping me so promptly.

I am in a state of shock,

I have actually now received a an answer,

it must be a coincidence because I never mentioned any names in my post but the timing was perfect

 

This is the email I received:

 

Dear Mr XXXXXX,

 

Complaint - X X XXXXXX

 

Thank you for your recent Email.

I am sorry you are disappointed but can confirm the issues you've raised will now be fully investigated in accordance with our enclosed Customer Complaints Procedures.

 

To summarise, I understand your complaint is about: the mis selling of a pension with XXXXXXXXXXXX.

 

In line with our procedure, if we have not concluded our investigation within 4 weeks, we will write to you with an update.

 

As you have contacted us by email, we will continue to correspond with you by this method.

 

However, if you would prefer for future correspondence to be issued by post, then please advise us accordingly.

 

I would be grateful if you could expand on when the pension was sold to you and why you believe the pension is unsuitable.

 

If you have any questions, please let me know and I'll do my best to help you.

 

Yours sincerely

XXXXXXXXXX

Service Recovery Specialist

 

Direct Dial: XXXX XXX XXXX

Email: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

 

Service Recovery

End of Email.

...

 

Thank you again for your help

I will put something together to answer them

If you have any more advice it would be greatly appreciated, if you think more details about the pension would help I would be happy to post them.

 

Zama

[honeybee13]

Hello again, well that's good.

 

Why do you think it was missold please?

 

HB

[zama]

Hello honeybee13

 

Sorry about the delay in answering,

I have just been diagnosed as being Diabetic,

so the last couple of days have been a bit hectic to say the least,

it never rains but it pours

 

I was in the post office pension (1990's),

then I was sold the private pension 1990 to 1997),

then I joined a large company with a good pension scheme,

which is paying my pension now.

 

I remember at the time the pensions adviser at my new company was shocked that I was advised to move my post office pension into the private pension and usually he wouldn't advise me to transfer a pension but this time he would recommend that I transfer my private pension into my new company pension scheme, which I did.

 

Obviously this was a long time ago, and I just got on with normal life,

7 years ago I had to take early retirement for personal reasons,

and like most people things are a real struggle now

 

With all the mis-selling scandals in the news at the moment,

I thought about the private pension and decided to put in a claim,

as I said in my earlier post,

I don't hold much hope but I would give it try

 

Now I have to put the above into a coherent reply for the insurance company who sold me the private pension.

 

Any help or advise would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thank You

Zama

[honeybee13]

Hello again. I'm sorry to hear of your health news, I hope they find the right treatment.

 

So you're saying that you were told to leave the Post Office pension scheme and pay into the private one instead? That sounds like mis-selling to me.

 

How much paperwork do you have going back that far please?

 

HB

[zama]

Hello again. I'm sorry to hear of your health news, I hope they find the right treatment.

 

So you're saying that you were told to leave the Post Office pension scheme and pay into the private one instead? That sounds like mis-selling to me.

 

How much paperwork do you have going back that far please?

HB

 

Hello HB

 

I have no paperwork at all, this happened such a long time ago (1990 to 1997), I have only recently tracked down the private pension details, policy no etc, and the company who sold me the policy.

 

I have the amount that was transferred from the private pension into my current pension, but I don't know the amount that was transferred from my Post Office pension.

 

I was thinking that I should contact the Post Office pension Dept and find out what amount transferred into the private pension, do you think this would help?

 

Thank You

zama

[honeybee13]

Hello again.

 

I suppose it would do no harm to find out the figure, although you would hope that the insurance company would have a record of that.

 

I found this on the Financial Ombudsman's website about complaining. I'm not suggesting you start a complaint with them yet, because you have to try to resolve this with the company first. You may consider going to the ombudsman later if you're not happy.

 

But they have an 0800 number you can ring, so they can tell you if they think you have a complaint. I've not dealt with pension mis-selling paperwork myself, but hopefully they will give you an idea of what to say and ask.

 

http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/consumer/complaints.htm

 

It will be interesting to hear what they say if you ring them, but I would say your case hinges around the benefits you gave up when you left the Post Office scheme on the advice of this company. From memory, it had an index-linked pension that was based on your final salary?

 

What could be helpful is if you could get hold of the pension scheme booklet for 1990, to demonstrate what you gave up. Maybe the Post Office pension people would help you with that?

 

The other thing I would check with the ombudsman is that there is no time limit for a case like this.

 

Does that give you something to go on?

 

HB

[zama]

YES Thank You HB, you have helped me greatly.

 

I will give the Post Office Pensions Dept a ring and try and find out about the pension details from that time,

and depending on what I find out,

I will give Financial Ombudsman's a ring and ask them if they think I have a complaint?

 

The wheels are in motion, so I suppose it's a bit of a waiting game now,

I will leave in peace you for a while

 

I will let you know what happens, whether it's good or bad news.

 

Thank you again for your help, it really is VERY much appreciated.

 

zama

[honeybee13]

You're welcome, zama. Please keep me posted as you say, and if you get stuck on anything I'll do my best to help.

 

HB

[Andybars]

If you were advised top transfer out of an employers Pension into a Private Pension, this would be particularly bad advice and there was a statutory review of such pensions in the late nineties / early 2000's. There was more than one Post Office Scheme, however the key reasons for mis-selling are;

- you missed out on employer contributions

- you missed out on other benefits e,g Death in service

- you missed out on guaranteed benefits so the personal pension was more risky

- you have paid higher management fees in this pension

 

Pension disputes are dealt with by a dedicated Pensions Ombudsman rather than by FOS - if you contact them they should be able to provide further guidance.

[honeybee13]

Hello Andybars.

 

Reading the pensions ombudsman website, I got the impression they deal with schemes rather than individuals. Did I misunderstand?

 

HB

[Andybars]

Hi,

the Pensions Ombudsman deal with both individuals and schemes.

 

However having had a look at your thread again the specific complaint would perhaps be better initially dealt with by the FOS. The link below gives a couple of examples of cases that FOS have looked at.

 

http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/ombudsman-news/33/review-33.htm

 

Given the issues that you have had regarding non-responses to your emails by the company in question, can I check whether you have now had a written acknowledgement of your complaint. If not, if you can name the company involved somebody should be able to provide you with contact details to escalate this as it is important to get the case progressing

Edited November 19, 2013 by Andybars
Incorrect info

[zama]

Hello Andybars

 

Thank you for taking the time to answer.

 

No I have not received any written acknowledgement, only the email which have I already posted.

 

The last thing I have done is that I contacted the Insurance company and asked for more details.

 

I was informed that because of the age of the pension policy they don't have it on the computer system and that she would contact the records department and have them post details to me.

 

This time they couldn't even confirm that the previous pension was transferred from the Post Office, even though I thought they mentioned it in the previous conversation.

 

I am embarrassed about being a bit unclear. My rather weak excuse is I worked at my first job for about 15 years and paid into the company pension scheme and my final job which I worked for about 17 years and from which I retired and which I paid the maximum pension I was allowed.

 

In between these two main jobs I worked at two other jobs for only a few years, one of which was the Post Office, it was during this time, between my two main jobs when the pension was transferred into the private scheme.

 

Anyway as I said I am waiting for details from the insurance company and then I will decide what my next move should be

 

Zama

[Andybars]

Hi - there were millions of these pensions mis-sold thanks to deregulation of the market, you are not the only person in this position.

 

What is important is trying to resolve this. Based upon what you have said regarding the progress so far - make a note to chase the person who sent the email in post 4 if you have not received an update within 28 days of the date that you first complained. If you need help with wording, I will be happy to assist when the time comes.

[zama]

Hello Everyone

 

I did say I would let you know what happens, whether it's good or bad news.

 

An update (probably the last:()

 

I have just received a final correspondence from the company whom I contacted over the mis-selling of my pension and it doesn’t look very good to say the least:sad:

 

It would seem that that there was yet another company involved. It seems that a local company who is now dissolved sold me the pension, then sold/passed the pension onto another company (the company I contacted over the miss-selling) who then passed it on to the actual insurance company.

 

Anyway I have scanned the letter I received and converted it into text, it is easier to just post the letter, and again I have crossed out all the company names, I still don’t want to get into any trouble:)

 

Start of letter:

……

 

Private & Confidential

Mr xx xxxxx

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxxx

xxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxx

 

11 December 2013

Our ref: xxxx

 

Dear Mr xxxxxx

Complaint — xxxxxxxx xxxx xxxxxxx

 

Thank you for taking the time to contact us.

 

I have now completed my investigation and detail my findings below. If you believe there is

material information which is not covered in my response or you have not previously

disclosed, we would ask you to provide this to us.

 

From reviewing the file I can see you set up your plan with xxxxxxxx xxxx on an execution

only basis. This means you received no advice about the investment. I am enclosing a copy

of the application for your information.

 

xxxxxxx xxxx indicated we were listed on file to provide you with ongoing advice. But our

records show you were receiving advice from xxxxxxx xxxxxx Limited. Normally we would

refer your complaint onto them but the company was dissolved in 2003.

 

A complainant has six years to bring a claim against an adviser after the date of the advice

was given, or three years from being aware (or ought reasonably to have become aware)

that they had cause to bring a complaint. We are entitled to reject a complaint where it is

outside the time limits for referral to the FOS.

 

Our records show you were liaising with xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Limited in 1990. Consequently, the six year period for you to complain expired at the latest in 1996.

 

In view of my findings I am unable to uphold your complaint. of our

Complaints Procedure, this is our final response and we will not enter into further

communications with you. lf you are dissatisfied with our final response you may wish to

contact The Pensions Advisor Service (TPAS). This is an independent voluntary

organisation whose contact details are outlined on the enclosed explanatory leaflet.

 

Alternatively, you can refer your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service and you

need to do this within six months from the date of this letter. For more information and

contact details, I would refer you to the enclosed guide ‘Your Complaint and the

Ombudsman’.

 

Should you choose to contact either of the above services, please let us know.

Yours sincerely

xxxxx xxxxx

Service Recovery Specialist

Direct Dial: xxxx xxx xxxx

……

End of letter

 

Well that seems final, I didn't hold up much hope of getting a good result with the mis-sold pension anyway, but I did at least want to try.

 

The biggest problem is that it was such a long time ago and I struggled to remember details, I didn’t even remember that it was the now dissolved local insurance company who transferred the pension in the first place, At that time I think I used to buy my car Insurance from them, boy did that turn out to be an expensive policy LOL.

 

Unless you think this is worth pursuing I will end it here.

 

I would very much like to thank Honeybee13 and Andybars for taking the effort and time to help me.

 

Zama

[Andybars]

Hi,

this is certainly worth pursuing - you should never have been advised to transfer this pension, Something which the advisor appears aware of by insisting that you do so on an "execution only basis" - this is a way of trying to avoid responsibility for the sale and should never have been used for a Final Salary Pension Transfer to somebody who did not hold professional pension qualifications and/or have extensive experience in cases of this type.

 

The suggestion that this case is time barred is also incorrect - the case would become time barred on the LATER of 6 years from the date of sale OR 3 years from the date that you were reasonably aware of cause for complaint. Whilst the 6 years is not in dispute it would be for the to decide whether you should reasonably have been aware of this more than 3 years ago.

 

My own view is that as this provider was listed on file as giving you ongoing advice they must bear some responsibility for the sale. I would certainly suggest that it is worth referring this case to the Ombudsman as a complaint against the product provider

[zama]

Hi Andybars

 

Thank you for answering, I will give it a go.

 

The product provider I assume is Standard Life Pensions and not the company I contacted over the miss-selling.

 

Sorry if this a cheeky question but would you suggest that I telephone the Ombudsman first or email them or post a letter.

 

Thank you

zama

[Andybars]

Hi,

I would initially approach the Ombudsman with a complaint against the company who sent you the response of 11 December 2013.

 

If you contact the Ombudsman by telephone they will be able to signpost you through the process (Their number 0300 123 9 123 OR 0207 964 1000).

 

The will need you to complete a complaint form but the person you speak to will hopefully partially complete this for you and then send it out to you to complete

 

They will need to know why you are unhappy and ask for copies of the correspondence between you and the company.

 

They dont expect you to be an expert in these things so just tell them in your own words what has gone on I.e you were advised to transfer a low risk company pension with a guaranteed pension to a much riskier personal pension.

 

You also believe that your Post Office Pension would have provided substantial benefits on early retirement

 

Hope this helps

[zama]

Hello

 

Thank you again Andy, I will do exactly that, I will give them a ring on Monday.

 

I will let you know how I get on.

 

Zama